While enjoying a fine late Sunday afternoon breakfast, I overheard portions of a scintillating conversation between the woman and the man sitting in the background of this picture.
To the left is the woman, in her late 30s/early 40s, recounting her lifetime sexual exploits while simultaneously lamenting her failure to “find the right man” and get married and have children. To the right is her gay boyfriend. We assumed he was gay by his mellifluous vocal cadence, and he confirmed it when he mentioned his gayness during the course of their conversation.
When you read these dialogue snippets try to imagine a plain-looking past-her-prime woman describing in a breezy, almost detached, tone of voice how she was violated sexually, and her gay boyfriend listening to her as if he’d heard it all before.
We’ll call her washed up wall victim (WUWV) and him GB (gay BF).
WUWV: Oh, I forgot to tell you, I had a one night stand last week! I didn’t expect him to sleep over and be there in the morning.
GB: I know, I know. Sometimes you just want them to get out.
Their conversation was starting to heat up.
WUWV: I’ve had a lot of flings and one night stands.
GB: [blah blah... something about Nietzsche... blah]
WUWV: I’ve done a lot of juggling.
GB: I could never do that. I’m the monogamous type. [editor's note: if you're a girl and you outcompete a gay guy in the whore sweepstakes you know you're doing something wrong]
It got better.
WUWV: I did it once with a black guy and it was great.
GB: Wow, how big was he?
WUWV: He was really huge! God it just filled me up. I’d recommend a black guy at least once to all my friends.
GB: I love being a bottom to a black man. You know… just take me!
Please lord don’t let this train wreck stop.
WUWV: One time he took me in all three holes in the same night. Younger men have such stamina.
GB: Mmmhm!
WUWV: His tongue was almost as fast as my vibrator.
Suddenly, a turn to the tragic.
WUWV: …well, it didn’t work out. So now it’s back to dating. It can be such a chore. What’s out there, really?
GB: Don’t worry about it, you’ll be fine. I’ve seen men checking you out, you’ve still got it girl.
WUWV: …and, you know, eventually I want to have kids. I don’t have all the time in the world to waste.
GB: Please, that’s nothing. You can get help to have children these days. Everyone’s doing it. Don’t rush yourself, honey.
What a monument to self-deception! To any lesser betas reading this: When you consider settling for a desperate older woman on the prowl for a husband sucker, this is what you’re getting — a has-been dried-up wall-hitting cock-slurping cum dumpster pussy-stretched three input titty-sagging multiple-cat-having haagen daz-scarfing cervix-scarred barren-wombed psychologically unmoored skank whore cougar. You have been warned.
The last thing this broad needs is a sympathetic gay boyfriend feeding her delusions and greasing the skids on her downward spiral. What she needs is the unvarnished truth. From, oh, a guy like me!
Like the release of the Kraken from its undersea lair, I feel a mighty Roissy Rant coming on.
***
Here we have, her brave front temporarily lowered, the typical tragic wail of the childless aging modern urban woman. And her tragedy enabler, the gay boyfriend who will never inject her with the dose of reality she desperately needs. She will continue aging, refusing to settle for a grateful beta who will be happy to have her sagging carcass as his tepid seed receptacle, never letting go of the pickiness she could afford when she was 20 years younger, and missing out on her chance at motherhood as she sips mimosas every Sunday afternoon at an overpriced trendy Dupont Circle eatery. At the bottom of the glass she will see her reflection crying back at her, and later that night she will pull the bedsheets close, the other side of the bed cold, and feel the suffocating weight of reality encircling her like shards of streetlamp lights slowly marching across her sickly gray bedroom walls. All those used condoms and triple penetrations and girls nights out will have done nothing to alleviate the crushing loneliness which has stolen her sense of invulnerability like a thief in the night.
Her fate is sealed:
fuck around with alpha cads –> delay marriage –> get too much education –> throw self into career –> earn lotsa money to spend on handbags –> feel empowered –> serially date and fuck as career and educational success distort her time horizon –> start to get serious about finding husband at age 29 –> slowly discover she is not worth as much on the open market despite business school degree and 1350 SATs –> get bitter –> sabotage her dating prospects with bitter resentment –> show up to dates with cat scratches and abrasive attitude –> die childless or burdened with a downs child and a lickspittle beta life partner.
***
I am cruel in my tactics, but my message is unassailable. If these super self-confident tankgrrl wannabes listened to me and took my advice before it was too late, despite their revulsion for the way in which I say it, they would find happiness.
But they won’t. And so I will laugh at them, half in pity, half in amusement.
Quick, Sex And The City tickets are going fast! Those girls know how to have fun. So much fun…
“And her tragedy enabler, the gay boyfriend who will never inject her with the dose of reality she desperately needs.”
Speaking of inject, she could be artificially inseminated with her gay friend’s sperm. One of my daughter’s friends is the result of an artificial insemination of a lesbian. Her mom picked out some dude from a catalog based on his looks and other traits. At least this woman and her progeny would know the father personally. Not that in this case, that is any real advantage. If artificial insemination is too expensive, a turkey baster works quite well, I’ve heard.
Well, Roissy, you’ve read my posts on my gameless admirers, poor dears. Do you really think I ought to have “settled” for one of them when I was in my 30s? There are some decisions in my life that I regret, but not marrying one of these men is not one of them.
Since most women do marry before their time is up, you have to consider the possibility that those of us who do not might be outliers in some sense or other anyway. Some, like me, are outliers because we are unwilling or unable to play the date/have semi-casual relationship/live together/ get-married-if-he’s-willing routine demanded by modern sexual mores. That sort of thing can happen even to the prettiest women, as some of your female friends who post here could probably testify.
You may well be right about this silly, unlucky woman. But there are many women whose lives don’t resemble Sex and the City to the degree that you think.
I was talking to a 30-something year old woman who was convinced that her advanced degree (law) was necessary for her to attract a man, especially a successful one. I wanted so badly to tell her that losing 20 pounds would go way further. It’s amazing how women have deluded themselves so to the point they believe that anyone except maybe a high-performing beta or a gigolo cares about her advanced degree.
To comment #1, Sara, I would love to see that girl’s cumulative therapy bills by the time she hits 21.
fuck around with alpha cads –> delay marriage –> get too much education –> throw self into career –> earn lotsa money to spend on handbags –> feel empowered –>
That’s a pretty fancy purse the girl across from you has over her shoulder. How did she respond to your warning to stay away from alpha cads?
Many women pursue high-status education and careers to increase their odds of meeting high-status men. This, incidentally, is why in my opinion yuppie parents push their daughters toward hyper-achievement.
But there are so many other, better, less costly to society, more humane, more cost-effective ways of meeting the kind of man a woman might want to marry.
‘Kay, Roissy, where were you sitting when you overheard this conversation? Were you in the spot from which you took the picture? If so, I’m going to call B.S. on the story, because especially given the level of street noise it seems unlikely you could have heard much of their conversation.
In fact, I’m suspicious of your whole story. This conversation is just too close to some of your favorite topics, too much of a coincidence.
4 T
I hope that is not the case. At this point she has two mothers and a father she will probably never meet, and no siblings. Still, I don’t see how she is any worse off than the rest of us.
4 T
Sorry…identity crises.
” He was really huge! God it just filled me up. I’d recommend a black guy at least once to all my friends….. One time he took me in all three holes in the same night. Younger men have such stamina.”
Wait, did she mention last June??? Oh God, I really need to stop blacking out in Dupont Circle. This is just getting out of control when women are spreading my business like that.
>missing out on her chance at motherhood
What’s so great about motherhood? Seriously, you act as though that’s the only worthwhile destiny for every woman. All the moms I know are, in their own words, overstressed and underappreciated. Doesn’t look like such a great gig to me….
I was thinking of writing this in the GBF post earlier, but here might be even more appropriate: Beta male encouragement of homosexuality is counter-productive. The thinking that, “oh, well, more gay men means more chances for me to get a girl” is flawed because it fails to account for, among other things, the above situation. That thinking is analogous to the thinking I had as a high school student with regard to kids who did drugs (”that’s ok because it means less school and job competition for me later”). I discovered the flaw in the drug thought years later: Wow, I wonder who is going to carry these losers? Similarly, your post shows how a complete waiver, surrender, and tacit encouragement of homosexuality on the rationale that more gays = less beta competition over women, is a flawed way of looking at things because it fails to account for what some call externalities. Yes, same-sex attraction behavior, like drug abuse, is like a sort of cultural pollution.
Furthermore, let us admit that while alpha’s may not have the time or the inclination to listen to and engage in this girly-girl talk, beta’s might be more inclined –ready, willing, and able, to do so. But instead of appreciating this middle ground capability possessed by beta’s (and eventually settling and, god forbid, making one of them happy for a while (”not marrying one of these men is not one of them”) and maybe bringing new healthy life into the world), lotsa city girls just ping-pong between alpha’s for sex and their girls and effeminate men for talk.
clio:
Well, Roissy, you’ve read my posts on my gameless admirers, poor dears.
with a little bit of vom in my mouth.
i suppose it’s good for me there are so many hapless betas out there.
Do you really think I ought to have “settled” for one of them when I was in my 30s?
yes.
There are some decisions in my life that I regret, but not marrying one of these men is not one of them.
you have only two choices:
settle
or die alone.
i suspect you will do what most women in your position do — settle and then rationalize the man as a great catch.
peter:
If so, I’m going to call B.S. on the story, because especially given the level of street noise it seems unlikely you could have heard much of their conversation.
there wasn’t much street noise. it was quiet that morning and the cafe sits off the main road.
i was sitting across the table and heard most of it. plus, i have a witness who heard it as well.
@ 5 Reggie: That’s a pretty fancy purse the girl across from you has over her shoulder. How did she respond to your warning to stay away from alpha cads?
With a knowing wink.
@ 7 Peter: In fact, I’m suspicious of your whole story. This conversation is just too close to some of your favorite topics, too much of a coincidence.
Unfortunately, although summarized, the convo is pretty much verbatim.
anonymous 57,
children are a joy beyond joy to have, nurture, and teach. yes, it is hard work, but it is worth every moment spent doing it.
of course, not everyone can see it this way. it is their loss.
Sounds like my kind of woman actually – smart, independent, and sexual! And she has a gay boyfriend to listen to all the crap I don’t care about!
She could be a good time…
“you have only two choices:
settle
or die alone.
i suspect you will do what most women in your position do — settle and then rationalize the man as a great catch.”
Dying alone is better than marrying someone whose every word fills you with exasperation, and whom you don’t really want to touch. It’s not fair to the man either, in such a situation.
Anyway, sugar bun, you’re in some danger of dying alone too. The qualities you want in a woman – young, beautiful, feminine but not too eager to have children, sexually adventurous but not too experienced – are somewhat contradictory.
What’s so great about motherhood?
Unless someone is changing the world through their other accomplishments, they might as well blow their brains out now if they’re not having children. What’s the point of being here at all if your ideas or genes won’t propagate any further?
clio:
Anyway, sugar bun, you’re in some danger of dying alone too.
i’ve noticed women have a much greater aversion than men do to the concept of settling, if not the act itself. they really lash out at any thought that they may have to bend their criteria in a partner to avoid being alone or pumped and dumped.
i believe there is a good evo psych reason for this intense natural female aversion.
or: sperm is cheap. eggs are expensive.
for instance, i, like most men i know, freely admit i am settling. after all, i’m not (yet) banging mila kunis and natalia vodianova in a threesome while alizee feeds me bacon-wrapped sushi. but just try and find a woman willing to admit she settled for her boyfriend or is in the process of settling to find a longterm mate. you’d have better luck finding gold nuggets in the sands of the jersey shore after an army of old men with metal detectors passed through.
What’s the point of being here?! Art, music, nature, adventure! Good ideas live on, one doesn’t need children to perpetuate those. What difference does it make if your genes propegate or don’t?
I’m not attacking the choice to be a parent, nor am I saying it doesn’t have its transcendentally joyful moments, but it’s patently ridiculous to behave as though motherhood is the only valid path for every female’s life.
*Everyone* dies alone.
“Anyway, sugar bun, you’re in some danger of dying alone too. The qualities you want in a woman – young, beautiful, feminine but not too eager to have children, sexually adventurous but not too experienced – are somewhat contradictory.”
No, worse comes to worse, Roissy will end up married to a Thai or Russian hooker.
clio:
Dying alone is better than marrying someone whose every word fills you with exasperation, and whom you don’t really want to touch.
is it really? i wonder if you’ve thought it through and if some of those men in your life were really as repulsive as you describe here.
nevertheless, if this is how you really feel, your super choosy genes will die out, to be replaced by the genes of women who weren’t so repulsed by the majority of men they encountered in their lives.
You are wrong about gay bf’s constantly enabling and reassuring delusional women. Of course some do, but my “gay bf” just told me if I gained 5 lbs I would be “fat” and I needed to watch myself. Though gay men participate in over the top antics and will gossip about sex with the best of them, many are also supremely superficial and they have a keen sense on how the world works. Every time I have gained weight, a gay man has pointed out to me. Every time I have chucked a man in the trash, I have been admonished as I should “hold on to them”. Gay men are brutal bitches.
Good ideas live in, but for most people those are other people’s good ideas. Most people won’t create art, music, nature or adventure that survives their time on earth. Most of us won’t have our art displayed in museums long after we’re dead, we won’t make music that is played long after we died, we won’t have adventures that are remembered for generations. For the average person, having a kid is their only way to leave future generations a reminder you were ever alive, it’s the closest we can come to having a lasting legacy or achieving immortality. It’s a natural biological urge.
“I’m not attacking the choice to be a parent, nor am I saying it doesn’t have its transcendentally joyful moments, but it’s patently ridiculous to behave as though motherhood is the only valid path for every female’s life.”
That’s a statement indicative of a woman who’s fat, ugly, a lawyer, man-hater, and/or doesn’t like sex.
ALL hot chicks who love sex, love the idea of having kids, whether or not they want them at the moment.
I’ve never understood why so many women treat one of their most valuable resources, their reproductive system, with such depravity and then say, they would love to have children…some day. WTF?!
I think having and raising children is one of the most important stages in anyone’s life provided both are psychologically and financially prepared for it. Alpha or not. Unfortunately, there are few incentives for men to curtail what increasingly looks like a perpetual adolescence and few women worth the long term investment. Correction, few American women worth it.
“Unless someone is changing the world through their other accomplishments, they might as well blow their brains out now if they’re not having children. ”
Now, or later…
http://www.nationalpost.com/scripts/story.html?id=483710
Yeah, this is a good point. It shows another way gay men can create delusions in women…by being too extreme in the opposite direction by being overcritical. If you look at the fashion model industry which is gay dominated, you see women unnaturally skeletally skinny. Yet if you look at men’s magazines made to cater to straight men’s tastes, women like Scarlett Johanssen’s curves are #1. Either way, gay bf’s often make straight women neurotic, either by indulging them with too much self-esteem or being too overcritical.
“Either way, gay bf’s often make straight women neurotic, either by indulging them with too much self-esteem or being too overcritical.”
No. Only neurotic, fucked up women have gay boyfriends. Regular women are too busy getting fucked to hang out with chicks with dicks.
Anon: but if I was getting fucked all the time, I would be a cum guzzling whore, right?
#19 roissy
for instance, i, like most men i know, freely admit i am settling. after all, i’m not (yet) banging mila kunis and natalia vodianova in a threesome while alizee feeds me bacon-wrapped sushi. but just try and find a woman willing to admit she settled for her boyfriend or is in the process of settling to find a longterm mate.
You’re coming at it from different angles. If her posts here are anything to judge by, Clio plans on being faithful should she end up getting married. She’d be settling permanently. You, however, are settling for the time being; should the opportunity to get with Mila Kunis or whoever present itself, you’d drop the woman you were currently with like a bag of flaming excrement. You’re not settling permanently.
“Anon: but if I was getting fucked all the time, I would be a cum guzzling whore, right?”
You seem like a typical sex-hating, man-hating chick who gets along only with men who fuck men, and hates women who like sex.
Why would you consider a girl who gets fuck all the time a “cum guzzling whore”? Normal girls get fucked all the time, whether by one man or many men.
I think this might be a made up story. Seriously, how could 99.9% of us check your alibi? The woman does NOT look like the slut she supposedly makes herself out to be. She’s dressed more like a health conscious woman who shops at Patagonia, than one who is out Mr Goodbar-ing.
And pardon me for saying so roissy, but your woman friend has poor taste in dress. I never could comprehend the short sleeved fleece sweat jacket concept; and paired with the inappropriately flashy taupe purse and black tshirt? I’m sounding pretty gay here I know, but be serious. The fact that she’s still clinging to her purse after you’ve sat down, means she would rather be somewhere else.
should the opportunity to get with Mila Kunis or whoever present itself, you’d drop the woman you were currently with like a bag of flaming excrement.
no, i’d just have mila join us in a fun romp.
come on, dude, it’s me. i only date girls i want to be around.
anyway, my point stands. men are more willing to settle in concept and in reality, though they are more careful about avoiding settling when seeking long term mates they will invest their resources in. women are not willing to settle at all in concept, and only marginally moreso in reality, whereupon they rationalize their settling with a contortion of semantical gymnastics that would impress the greatest bloviating french philosophers.
Anon: but if I was getting fucked all the time, I would be a cum guzzling whore, right?
i love sluts, but let’s face it, in most men’s view they are not marriage material.
and science backs men up on that impression.
“your super choosy genes will die out, to be replaced by the genes of women who weren’t so repulsed by the majority of men they encountered in their lives.”
ouch. jerrry! jerrry! jerrrry!
Anon: You could not be more wrong. Really. Have you ever read any of my other comments? Or are you extrapolating from this one instance? You don’t know me. The “cum guzzling whore” was a comment on the general virgin/whore dichotomy that I feel plays out here. Get over yourself and at least have the balls to post under some sort of real identifier, not “Anon”.
Now excuse me…I need to go get the shit fucked out of me by many of my gentleman callers.
peep show had a great example of this type of woman last week
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2vxfPBaqqn4
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vh4pGDg_oV4
Lemmonex <3
What’s happening to pretty Lemmony is in large part why I don’t post much here anymore.
What’s happening to pretty Lemmony is in large part why I don’t post much here anymore.
lemmonex is great. a tough cookie with a heart of marshmallow. i love her. she can handle herself here in a way, i suppose, you can’t.
38 Hope
What about pretty Sara Lee? LOL….backs away slowly.
Do you really think I ought to have “settled” for one of them when I was in my 30s?
Clio, I would ask you a different question.
What if you were raised in an environment where this message was constant and consistent:
“Now, young Clio, if you are absolutely dead certain that you never, ever want to have a family, then, you can basically do whatever you want. However, if you think that you might want to have a family, then, you need to be focused on finding a good man so that you can get married in time to have healthy children. This is not always easy for a young woman, so we will be here if you need any help.”
Then, what kinds of decisions would you have made at 18, 21, 25, and 30?
Hope, come on. Lemmonex, who is fairly popular in these parts, is getting crap thrown at her from some guy named “Anon”.
He should have a good, proper namer like Lurking.
anonymous 57:
“What’s so great about motherhood? Seriously…”
WSince the whole point of each species is to reproduce, I’d say it’s pretty great for larger reasons than you seem capable of realizing.
#34
come on, dude, it’s me. i only date girls i want to be around.
Well, sure. Until another comes along that you want to be around more. Not that there’s anything wrong with that — most men, including me, do that to some extent. But if, like you say, women not wanting to settle is due to biology, it seems pointless to chastise them for it, just like it’s pointless to chastise men for wanting to sleep around. If either party ends up lonely after following their instincts, well, that’s just how things roll.
#33 sara
And pardon me for saying so roissy, but your woman friend has poor taste in dress. I never could comprehend the short sleeved fleece sweat jacket concept; and paired with the inappropriately flashy taupe purse and black tshirt? I’m sounding pretty gay here I know, but be serious. The fact that she’s still clinging to her purse after you’ve sat down, means she would rather be somewhere else.
This whole passage is a monument to passive-aggressive catty bitchery. What does any of this drivel have to do with roissy’s point? Nothing. This is why no one gives your posts the slightest intellectual consideration, sara/candycane/termagent.
“What does any of this drivel have to do with roissy’s point?”
Nada. I just like being a pain in his ass. Most of my points are not meant to be taken seriously. God forbid. But some have things shoved up their asses and just have to take everything seriously. I find it amusing, so if you want me to go away, stop amusing me. BTW, you take roissy seriously? OMG. Sorry!
This explains a lot. Now I truly regret responding to her.
46 T
Try to deal with it.
@33 Sara
My shirt is blue, we were about to leave, and I have extremely cold shoulders.
Now untwist your panties, my dear, and go LIVE YOUR LIFE.
48 We all know that’s you, roissy. Am I not living my life? Good grief, you’re presumptuous!! LOL Unceasing amusement. What can I say?
What exactly was the point again? I’ll try really hard this time. Sorry, I really do have to go now and live the rest of my day at least. Have fun, ya’ll. That’s the only point as far as my limited intelligence can determine at this point.
reggie:
Until another comes along that you want to be around more.
unless i fall in love. it’s been known to happen.
But if, like you say, women not wanting to settle is due to biology, it seems pointless to chastise them for it, just like it’s pointless to chastise men for wanting to sleep around.
most women eventually want marriage and children. so chastising them for life choices (and non-choices) that directly harm their ability to fulfill their deepest longings is not pointless. a visceral distaste for settling and out-of-whack expectations in a partner that results in lifelong loneliness is a tragedy that can be avoided if my words are heeded.
since most men like sleeping around and would do it forever if they could get away with it, the analogy to men would be chastising them for acting beta and harming their chances to get laid, something which i do a lot here on my blog, but which many don’t seem to notice as much as my attacks on women.
color me surprised.
So true.
sperm is cheap. eggs are expensive.
That’s my “bathroom wall” quote.
i love sluts, but let’s face it, in most men’s view they are not marriage material.
and science backs men up on that impression.
What about weirdos like me who prefer sluts over non-sluts?
Many women pursue high-status education and careers to increase their odds of meeting high-status men.
You’re relatively correct in this case. Ever since the proles started going to college, those proper rank in society and employers required a means to separating the wheat from the chaff, and masters degree have essentially served that purpose. Seriously, what high ranking male would bring a girl who works in a salon or as a receptionist or some other low ranking service position to his family as a potential marriage partner? In effect, the masters degree and career are a means of weeding out lower class women who could be good partners, but don’t meet social muster.
He was really huge! God it just filled me up. I’d recommend a black guy at least once to all my friends….. One time he took me in all three holes in the same night. Younger men have such stamina.
Most white women will be *very* disappointed when they meet me…
a has-been dried-up wall-hitting cock-slurping cum dumpster pussy-stretched three input titty-sagging multiple-cat-having haagen daz-scarfing cervix-scarred barren-wombed psychologically unmoored skank whore cougar
Who cares? I’d rather have that so-called *whore* fucking me till the end of our marriage than some boring low-count sexless partner who makes a marriage pathetic and boring. For a guy who allegedly bangs young hot women, you’re rather miserable and ranting off like a beta. Hell, you advocate that marriage is a scam, yet you continuously suggest women to settle and marry which creates the miserable situation that you tell men to avoid.
For the average person, having a kid is their only way to leave future generations a reminder you were ever alive, it’s the closest we can come to having a lasting legacy or achieving immortality. It’s a natural biological urge.
One should ask why should we have kids? Yes, they’re cute and such, but they’re such hard work, and they’re downright expensive to “own and operate”. For most people, why should they replicate their broken beta genes into the future when they can avoid having children and stay single having. Being single may be lonely, but there’s a certain degree of social freedom that comes with it that may make it well worth it for some members of the population. Why clean up after some little kids when you can have great sex with good looking people?
the analogy to men would be chastising them for acting beta and harming their chances to get laid
Despite not getting laid, some of us are happy and content with our lives as betas, and some of us really can’t act like alphas. It just isn’t natural for us, and it feels weird and awkward. It’s no different than trying to get you to act like a beta. You wouldn’t like it and you would feel terribly restrained and agitated.
DA:
I’d rather have that so-called *whore* fucking me till the end of our marriage than some boring low-count sexless partner who makes a marriage pathetic and boring.
those aren’t the only choices.
although if they were, i’d also choose the whore over the frigidaire.
For a guy who allegedly bangs young hot women, you’re rather miserable and ranting off like a beta.
performance art ranting is not indicative of personal misery.
Hell, you advocate that marriage is a scam, yet you continuously suggest women to settle and marry which creates the miserable situation that you tell men to avoid.
true. for men, marriage is a raw deal. this fact doesn’t alter women’s preference for marriage and family. just the opposite: it strengthens their preference.
double standards are part of life, DA, you may as well get used to them.
“Since the whole point of each species is to reproduce, I’d say it’s pretty great for larger reasons than you seem capable of realizing.”
No. I didn’t ask what’s the point of reproduction in the larger sense, I asked what’s so great about the actual nut-and-bolts experience of motherhood. It’s a lot of hard work, much of it thankless. If a woman chooses that route, then good for her and her genes, but don’t pretend it’s the only route to personal fulfillment.
those aren’t the only choices.
I find the slutty activities to insurance on a healthy sex life since it proves a woman’s interest in sex. In contrast, most other women are using bait and switch tactics on their male mates. Nearly every guy that I know dumped the slutty girl for the *normal* girl, and they’ve only had complaints. I’d prefer to avoid the pump & dump that my grandfather used on the women in his life, and I don’t want to cheat on my wife. A slut is probably the best choice.
for men, marriage is a raw deal. this fact doesn’t alter women’s preference for marriage and family.
So why are you encouraging women to settle down with men that they’ll learn to hate and have contempt for in the medium to long term range? It’s as if you’re trying to screw over beta males who do marry with frigid wives…
employers required a means to separating the wheat from the chaff, and masters degree have essentially served that purpose.
This is a minor sidetrack, but that’s not true across many industries. In some even very renumerative white-collar lines of work having a Masters degree can be a liability, especially when combined with lack of experience.
#58 PA
This is a minor sidetrack, but that’s not true across many industries. In some even very renumerative white-collar lines of work having a Masters degree can be a liability, especially when combined with lack of experience.
Interesting. Could you give some examples? We’re already past 50 comments anyway, so you may as well track that side. I could see a lack of experience being a big negative no matter your education level, but why would employers prefer an experienced person without an advanced degree over someone equally experienced who’s earned a masters? Is it the increased salary demands, even in “very remunerative” lines of work?
anonymous 57, are you a lesbian?
You know roissy really makes a great point when you dwell on it further: WOMEN OPERATE FROM THE ASSUMPTION OF INFINITE CHOICE. This is rational from an evolutionary perspective, women really just have to wait around and some guy will be more than willing to offer them sperm and assistance with raising a child. Men are the far more desperate sex and genuinely fall in love with girls in a millisecond. So women are preprogammed to wait, to be selective etc. This is compounded, of course, by modernity, which expands female choice pretty much to the whole world, so obviously no guy is going to measure up when the competition is THE WHOLE WORLD.
Lemmonex,
where does THAT line start…. do I need a golden ticket or what? Just saying we could turn this into the new Chuck Palahniuk book Snuff and go out with a bang… nah mean?
So why are you encouraging women to settle down with men that they’ll learn to hate and have contempt for in the medium to long term range?
Should she go without the house, alimony payments and child support?
Anon 57 said: “No. I didn’t ask what’s the point of reproduction in the larger sense, I asked what’s so great about the actual nut-and-bolts experience of motherhood.”
Again, you seem incapable of seeing this from any larger point of view. Maybe you can’t get the reproductive angle, so let me put it a different way: What’s so great about the actual nuts and bults experience of being an office drone and slave to a boss and company that don’t care?
“It’s a lot of hard work, much of it thankless.”
As opposed to office jobs, where you’re booted out with no warning and often undervalued?
Should she go without the house, alimony payments and child support?
That’s why we should never force these women into these marriages. Eventually, they will want a divorce when they’re sick of dealing with a beta, and they’ll leave creating financial havoc on both sides.
33, Sara / Candy Cane
Are you for serious? Who the fuck are you, some project runway judge. You probably don’t get what she’s wearing because the last time you had any fashion sense Nixon was in the White House. You’re up here frontin as if you wear nothing but Top Shop Pansy dresses to all your Sunday brunches….
Bitch please
Go back to breast feeding your six year old and kill that noise.
DA, who said anything about force?
She doesn’t HAVE to get married? This is not Afghanistan.
But, marriage will likely provide her with resources that she would, otherwise, not have had.
66 Virgl Kent
That was an awesome rant. Feel better?
VK, How it works is I sit in a kiddie pool full of ice and all the men just line up. You supply your own condoms, I will email you the mapquest directions on where to find me and the party shall commence.
Well all this time I thought people were supposed to get an education to better themselves for that purpose alone!
More than to seem like a better catch later on, I’d say women who go to uni can select a better catch of men also. And while you might say that the women are wasting time trying to look better to a guy, it’s probably a good idea to be able to be on a level field with whomever you’re involved.
Being the trophy wife is okay if the guy loves you as much as you love him but the woman will always feel like she’s less. And in the end, that will suck for both parties.
why would employers prefer an experienced person without an advanced degree over someone equally experienced who’s earned a masters? Is it the increased salary demands, even in “very remunerative” lines of work?
Yes, salary demands out of line with expected productivity are a big reason.
Excessive education without corresponding experience might also be a red flag, indicating an impractical person or someone who stayed in school in order to avoid working.
As opposed to office jobs, where you’re booted out with no warning and often undervalued?
Office jobs can pay for $500 Christian Louboutin shoes, vacations to exotic locations, sports cars, and PlayStation games. Having children pays for nothing, and the car is more likely to love you back than the kids…
She doesn’t HAVE to get married? This is not Afghanistan.
But, marriage will likely provide her with resources that she would, otherwise, not have had.
You’re right, she isn’t forced, but Roissy wants to socially encourage these women into situations that *could* make them and their beta male husbands miserable. Besides, if you’re a successful career woman with a good job, there’s no real financial incentive to marry, as far as I’m concerned. Only women marrying into richer men really benefit, and men are (and should be) leery of those types of women, especially of the poorest women.
66 Virgl,
Look, we all know you’re in love with roissy. It’s so obvious you’re his personal butt wiper.
I disagree. A guy who is a real prize mostly goes for a woman that is hot and pleasant. After that he may go for hot and unreasonable bitch. As long as the woman is not a stripper or welfare recipient or an embarassingly low class bum, guys don’t really care about her education level, except for nerds that really like to show off their Ivy league credentials maybe. Bougee buppies also care about their wives’ pedigree because their lives revolve around proving they are the opposite of ghetto. But for most other men, it’s hotness. Look at Trump’s level of success and who he married. Tiger Woods is happy with a nanny, so long as she’s hot.
If anything, a lot of education can often make a woman harder to deal with thanks to all the PC brainwashing that often happens at universities. If you think the gay boyfriend feeds into that woman’s delusions, that’s nothing compared to what 5-years-plus of higher education does.
But look at educated women and check out the emasculated, henpecked wuss husbands they often get. They may be well-paid and secure, but I’m not sure they are an improved catch over what the woman could have gotten if she married when she was younger and hotter instead of waiting to get a degree.
Roissy, not every woman wants to get married and fewer want children.
What is up with the obession with the black man’s body? The black brute sterotype goes back over 100 hundred years.
Lemmonex-I am not much of a joiner but I will volunteer to turn the pool of ice into margaritas for you. We will skip the salt.
You’re right, she isn’t forced, but Roissy wants to socially encourage these women into situations that *could* make them and their beta male husbands miserable.
DA, the average woman, whether you like it or not, really, REALLY wants to get married. To see 35 year old childless women scramble is an amazing thing.
So, with that in mind, what is the common advice? Get Married.
And, to improve your chances, stay slim, be fun and find a good provider, Beta or not, and marry him.
Yes, it is absolutely possible that you will end up in an unhappy marriage. However, you could have ended up childless, alone and slaving away at a job you hate. So, do yourself a favor, and get married…at least you will get the house, the car, the alimony and child support.
So, in the Game of Life, did you win? No, but you came in a fine second place. No need for suicide and you probably shouldn’t need any cats. You have kids.
Besides, if you’re a successful career woman with a good job, there’s no real financial incentive to marry, as far as I’m concerned.
DA, get a good career. Then, get a sex change and have estrogen pumped though you. Then, come back and tell me that you are really happy WITH the caree and WITHOUT children.
Only women marrying into richer men really benefit, and men are (and should be) leery of those types of women, especially of the poorest women.
Fine, advise the men not to marry. But, the women probably should.
And, if both parties follow these pieces of advice, many women will find that they need to up the ante to get quality men to marry.
How it works is I sit in a kiddie pool full of ice and all the men just line up.
i don’t think a kiddie pool is gonna fit all of me.
Tiger Woods is happy with a nanny, so long as she’s hot.
Yes, but according to wikipedia, was a former public policy minister for the Sweedish government and her father is a journalist for Swedish state media. In other words, he married a hot girl of proper social rank.
guys don’t really care about her education level
So why do WASP men continue to marry ugly women who fit the NY Times Wedding Registry profile when they could marry lower ranking hot girls?
Come on, I dare you to marry and have kids with a stupid woman. Magically, your desire to marry the hot stupid girl magically disappears since nobody wants to chance having stupid kids as their offspring.
T, what paperdreamer is saying is that, for a girl, she gets to meet higher quality guys by going to university, instead of hanging around the trailer park or beauty parlor.
Even if she does not get married in college, which is no longer common, she will still be forming a circle of friends that will stay her for a while. These will be her friends and connections.
She can major in Womyn’s Studies or Applied Mathematics, as long as she gets good friends.
74 T:
I’m not saying women at uni are automatically able to get better men. I’m saying uni education has the benefit of giving girls 1st pick at men, during college, who will probably be successful. And women can be as selective as men.
I do plan on getting 5 plus years of education. What’s wrong with that? I plan on following my dreams.
You sound like the pre-professional advisor at school who says I told the girls not to go into medicine because it will get in the way of their baby making. Who says I can’t do both? Plenty of women who actually try do.
If I do get married, I want to make sure that the person wants me not for my degree or for my looks alone. I think the same is true for guys? I won’t throw my education stats at you and I don’t want to ever turn into a bitch! But if those things are to (not) happen, the guy has to not be someone that constantly makes me feel subordinate to them. When I prove to myself that I am as worthy as the person I like, then I think that’s for the best.
Yeah. What 80 Usually Lurking said…
So, with that in mind, what is the common advice? Get Married.
What about all those studies that show married women to be unhappier than their single counterparts? I mean, who can really be happy being the bitch to some loser beta male?
However, you could have ended up childless, alone and slaving away at a job you hate. So, do yourself a favor, and get married…at least you will get the house, the car, the alimony and child support.
Staying childless and alone is probably a better option than tricking yourself into liking some loser beta male and bearing his ugly ass loser kids. The single woman gets to enjoy her life while her divorced counterpart is stuck with kids who probably will hate her for some reason or another.
And who needs kids when there’s long-term care insurance. I’d trust them to pay out over my kids who would enact their revenge because mommy and daddy didn’t buy the PlayStation when they were younger.
Fine, advise the men not to marry. But, the women probably should.
Since polygamy isn’t legal, who will these women marry if the men are unwilling to marry them? Unless you’re advocating for women to marry other women which is probably the best advice to offer…
DA:
In other words, he married a hot girl of proper social rank.
men don’t care about a woman’s rank outside of the context of social pressure to marry “right”. even then, it’s a wash. notice the common denominator for alpha males is the chick’s hotness. it’s just more convenient for tiger woods, who spends most of his time in an upper echelon of people, to hook up with a hottie within his social circle, rather than go out of his way to find a hottie outside his social circle. this convenience does not prove there is a male preference for high status or high class women. if there were, you’d see more porn with naked girls talking about their glamorous careers and waving their ivy league credentials.
So why do WASP men continue to marry ugly women who fit the NY Times Wedding Registry profile when they could marry lower ranking hot girls?
one, these WASP men may be betas. just because they work on wall street doesn’t automatically confer alpha status if they look like trolls or have a crippling inability to turn women on with their words.
two, show me their mistresses and get back to me.
papergirl:
You sound like the pre-professional advisor at school who says I told the girls not to go into medicine because it will get in the way of their baby making.
odds are, it will.
What about all those studies that show married women to be unhappier than their single counterparts?
I don’t know about these studies, and I don’t care. Very few women want to a lifetime without marriage. Yes, the unhappy ones are unhappy. But, lucky for them, they get children, alimony and child support.
Staying childless and alone is probably a better option than tricking yourself into liking some loser beta male and bearing his ugly ass loser kids.
She is not bearing his children, she is getting children. THIS IS WHAT SHE WANTED!!!
Chicks want children. No, maybe not when they are 18. But, by the time they are 35, they are freaking out. And, David, the grand majority of the human race either likes, or loves their Mommy.
Slut-obsessed, porn-freaks may be the exception.
Since polygamy isn’t legal, who will these women marry if the men are unwilling to marry them?
Supply and Demand. If demand is greater than supply, prices go up. Women will need to improve what they offer. One suggestion: change the divorce laws.
Roissy – We make our choices. Guys also want to go to school and spend a few years chasing a dream. Why do you get to be the one who gets everything?
I am aware that the chances of me finding happiness with a guy are lessened because I spend a lot of my time at the library. But I make that decision because I never, ever want to be dominated by anyone. I’ve seen it and it is ugly.
I hope that I can find someone wonderful but I need to make sure I can judge him accurately when I get there.
I have one child and two ex-husbands. What does that make ME?
And by dominated I mean socially…
Going to college is OK, as long as you live at home or otherwise avoid becoming a binge-drinking cum dumpster your freshman year, and as long as you don’t expose yourself to the mindrot of the PC curriculum.
Beyond a BA, no one cares what credentials you have; if anything, you’ll be less attractive — not because education is repulsive per se, but getting lots of credentials correlates with a hypercompetitive ball-busting personality, and guys don’t look for that in females.
What’s happening to pretty Lemmony is in large part why I don’t post much here anymore.
Oh please. You make it sound as though the men are ganging up on the women, and using sexist language in doing so. Maybe — but look what we do to each other. We call each other fags, betas, wimps, cuckolded limp-dicks, and so on.
Yesterday I suggested that guys who like strong, athletic girls like getting fucked up the butt with strap-ons by Amazons — it’s all in good fun, and no one came down on me for calling another guy a fag.
It’s part of competitiveness: you insult someone to see how they respond. If they crawl away, your probe has told you that you’re higher than they are. The strong pick on the weak, period. It only appears that men pick on women because strength of demeanor is correlated with sex. But it isn’t perfect: the weak guys leave, and the strong girls stay.
Guys use sexist language even when they don’t believe it — they just know it’ll push a girl’s buttons and make her shut up. When we call each other fags, we don’t necessarily believe it — but we know it can push a guy’s buttons and make him shut up.
87 paperdreamer
“I never, ever want to be dominated by anyone. I’ve seen it and it is ugly.”
I’ve seen it and lived it, and it is ugly indeed. Roissy will hate me for bringing this up, and even though I will take no action, my ex’s new on/off girlfriend is now the subject of the ugliness and she has aged 10 years in the last nine months.
Never, ever settle. I don’t care what roissy says. Be yourself, live your own life, do the best you can and try to have no regrets. We all have stories of “the one that got away.” Mine is a very fine man I met when I was 17 years old, and had I been in Gannon’s desired state of mind, would have seen the great man he was, that he was truly in love with me, and I would have married him.
Alas, I had too many fucking issues and broke his heart. So there ya go. The best thing you can do is work on the issues, feel better, be happy, happier, whatever… and stop blaming and take responsibility. Not you in particular…you know. ^_^
Usually Lurking, Roissy, you don’t know my circumstances, past or present. The men I turned down were either too young for me, in years and so in experience, or showed signs of having serious personality flaws, the kind that would obviously have made marriage to them quite difficult.
As for the ones I encouraged, the ones in whom I was interested, we usually ended up breaking up after a few months because I couldn’t play the “game” the way they wanted, i.e. no living together before marriage. It worked for a few of my friends, but many of them in those liaiasons found themselves dumped at 27 or 30 for a younger woman, or waiting for years for their live-in boyfriends to propose. Always pretending, of course, that they didn’t care.
Anyway, my prospects at the moment are rosier than you might think, no settling required. I’ll have to see how it goes, though.
“ALL hot chicks who love sex, love the idea of having kids, whether or not they want them at the moment.”
anon 25, don’t fool yourself
I don’t want children of my own, and I am young and hot.
clio:
we usually ended up breaking up after a few months because I couldn’t play the “game” the way they wanted, i.e. no living together before marriage.
if your religious or prudential sensibility has stacked the modern sexual market deck against you, then i admire your willingness to stand by your principles while reminding you that such a stand may very well cost you a quality man’s devoted love.
there are trade-offs in life, clio, and you’ve chosen yours, unfortunately, at a time in western history when your choice is likely to cost you more than it would have in a bygone era. the sluttification of the West is a force most women have learned, happily or not, to accommodate.
It worked for a few of my friends, but many of them in those liaiasons found themselves dumped at 27 or 30 for a younger woman
part of the reason for this is how unattractive feminism, the pill, and unfair laws have made marriage for men. clio, you cannot deny that on the balance marriage is simply a better deal for women. men are simply reacting to that reality.
Anyway, my prospects at the moment are rosier than you might think
of this i’ve no doubt. i’ve mentioned elsewhere that based on your pic my opinion is that you are in the top 5% of attractiveness for women your age.
it helps that you leaven your firm and sometimes serrated demeanor with a barely submerged femininity. frankly, i’d be surprised you haven’t lost it completely if i hadn’t seen your pic. being more physically attractive than most of your peers helps soften the repeated blows of reality.
Clio, I wasn’t judging your choices. I really wanted to know the answer to my question.
“Some, like me, are outliers because we are unwilling or unable to play the date/have semi-casual relationship/live together/ get-married-if-he’s-willing routine demanded by modern sexual mores”
Alice clio
Men do this because so many women of today are willing to go for it. I refuse to clean up,pay half of the bills, and be a personal freak for a man who is not my husband.
90 agnostic — I’m not actually going to uni to attract a mate. I’m going there to *get my shit done*. And sexist language doesn’t turn me off. I have a sense of humour
91 sara — Thanks. I try the best I can. I kind of hate people who are bitches on purpose for this reason. Just like how players ruin good girls for the future, bitchy girls make good guys really bitter.
As for settling, I think it’s always possible to do one better. But the person you pick will be the “one” for you because that’s the one you want; I don’t believe in soul mates. I wouldn’t make someone jump through a hoop I can’t jump over too. I guess you could say, “how much “quality” is enough?”
——————————–
I’m not an ice queen but I have as many exams as the guys in this rat race of a school. It’s hard to be brave and say the first word but however it happens, I give people a chance.
I know Roissy will roll his eyes but I think at 20 I can stand to wait before I freak out. I’m not even a legal adult.
“if your religious or prudential sensibility has stacked the modern sexual market deck against you, then i admire your willingness to stand by your principles while reminding you that such a stand may very well cost you a quality man’s devoted love.”
That is about the long and the short of it. I did try to modify both my religious and prudential sensibilities to some degree to try to accommodate today’s sexual “market” (and it’s horrible to describe it that way, but that’s what it is), but found that I was not emotionally cut out for it.
On the whole, I’ve accepted the realities of my situation. And I have very sweet little nieces and nephews, nice brothers and in-laws, and a large extended family, so I have more support than many single people do.
^ chic has obviously maintained her vigor and standards and will only play the game her way. There is no way to win/win unless you are both playing the same game. I particularly liked the “personal freak” comment.
@Agnostic, I really must ask and I am not criticizing your statement, but when you speak of the mind rot of academia, how did you bear through it if you are a graduate student now. Surely it constantly pissed you off and made you want to quit. I mean it’d be like being told 2=3 everyday and you’d realize it was a waste of time. So tell me what did you do to cope such extremities?
mila kunis and natalia vodianova
Roissy, what is it you like about Natalia Vodianova? She has the super thin supermodel body which I thought you were not a fan of.
Mila is gorgeous but natalia is just model preety gorgeous women are Adrinanna Lima, Liya Kabede and Karen Mulder( in her day).
T, are you looking forward to marriage one day.
98 alias
Men do not like to be told the way it is: that the majority of women can live without men, than men can live without women, which is why it’s so easy for a woman such as yourself to brush aside roissy’s self-righteous pronouncements to the contrary. He wishes.
100 Poseur
Am enjoying The Power of Now. Your wish was my command! That’s the secret Roissy. Tell a woman to do that which she wants to do and you will always be in control; and it’s fun for both of you.
Meanwhile, in Iceland:
“The comfort of knowing that, come what may, the future for the children is safe also helps explain why Icelandic women, modern as they are (Iceland elected the world’s first female president, Vigdis Finnbogadottir, a single mother, 28 years ago), persist in the ancient habit of bearing children very young. ‘Not unwanted teen pregnancies, you understand,’ said Oddny, ‘but women of 21, 22 who willingly have children, very often while they are still at university.’ At a British university a pregnant student would be an oddity; in Iceland, even at the business-oriented Reykjavik University, it is not only common to see pregnant girls in the student cafeteria, you see them breast-feeding, too. ‘You extend your studies by a year, so what?’ said Oddny. ‘No way do you think when you have a kid at 22, “Oh my God, my life is over!” Definitely not! It is considered stupid here to wait till 38 to have a child. We think it’s healthy to have lots of kids. All babies are welcome.’”
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2008/may/18/iceland
Sara/candy cane/nany nany boo boo/termagent/elvis/easter bunny/spaghetti beast I have no idea what that comment meant, but I’m glad you’re enjoying the book.
Sara 102 — if the majority of women can live without men, then why do so many women want to get married or have a relationship with a man? Perhaps you’re right though; women can live without men. They’ll be miserable, but they’ll be right. For many women, being right seems to be more important than being happy, as is clearly demonstrated by many of the comments on this thread.
“Well, sure. Until another comes along that you want to be around more. Not that there’s anything wrong with that — most men, including me, do that to some extent. But if, like you say, women not wanting to settle is due to biology, it seems pointless to chastise them for it, just like it’s pointless to chastise men for wanting to sleep around. If either party ends up lonely after following their instincts, well, that’s just how things roll”
Reggie #45
Well said Reggie.
Question:
Do men really believe in love at first sight?
I think its rare for a woman but for men I am not sure.
@chic noir only gullable men with little background in science believe in love as a purely spiritual phenomenon. More to the point I think a lot of betas, believe in love at first sight either because they were socially conditioned to be emotional pansies through Hollywood’s depictions of love. The second case is a construct in that they need to believe in love at first sight because it validates their own reality and makes them think they are worth more on the sexual market than their potential competitors.
I’m sure we’ve all heard of the sensitive man that thinks that by listening to the woman’s stories and being her friend he will get into her pants. Well that is where this comes from.
Just like how players ruin good girls for the future, bitchy girls make good guys really bitter.
dreamer, it used to be that “good” girls married some small-town local or maybe met a guy in church. Now, girls are meeting guys at frat parties, bars and night clubs and getting their heart broken.
I am not religious, and I am not promoting religion here, but, if you decided right now to devote yourself to a moral life by throwing yourself into your church (Catholicism, Baptism, whatever) and being constantly involved with the church, I guarantee you, the type of guys you meet will be quite different than the ones in the club.
Don’t want to get your heart broken? Here is another tack:
Spend all of your time in the Math and Comp Sci departments. 1.) The ratio of male-female will be nice for you and 2.) I bet your chances of having your heart-broken will be drastically cut.
Now, I am guessing that you would be less interested in the devout Baptist and the Math Major, and more interested in the Hockey playing Business major, but, that is my advice.
Do men really believe in love at first sight?
I can not say, but who would want that. It is basically the most superficial way, by far, for to “fall in love”.
How about this:
Lisa: so, how did it all happen?
Kelly: He said he saw me from across the room and thought I was cute, so, he came over and talked to me.
Lisa: Was it love at first sight?
Kelly: No. He said that after talking to me he knew that he wanted to get to know me better. We have been nearly inseperable for months now. He says that he can’t believe how much he loves me.
The lack of desire to get married might just be part of our short future orientation instant gratification culture that seems to consistently miss the forest for the trees.
Roissy, reading between the lines, you seem just as alone as Clio. Yeah sure, you’re getting a lot of action, but your repeated references to love in your posts, makes me think that you’re missing out on that extra dimension in your relationship.
Physical proximity is not emotional intimacy.
In many ways the modern sexual environment is stacked against you as well. The trashy chics that are a product of todays society while fun and easily available to bang, aren’t really the type of material you want to marry. Given a choice, who wants to marry a slut? Its a market full of hamburger with the occasional fillet mignon.
I actually believe that you are a person of high standards and given the low quality of todays dating market I feel that finding a lifetime partner for you will be next to impossible. The type of woman you will want to commit to would have to be exceptional. Clio may be doomed because she has standards, you may be doomed because her competitors don’t.
Days of Broken Arrows are you male/female?
I think both parenthod and the office hold the same type of appeal.
sara
98 alias
Men do not like to be told the way it is: that the majority of women can live without men, than men can live without women,
I2I sara I2I
Jay Gatsby, until they are married and then many women cry b*tch and moan about their husbands and sometimes children all day. In my observation men and women think differently and its a large part of the reason we can not get along.
“Spend all of your time in the Math and Comp Sci departments. 1.) The ratio of male-female will be nice for you and 2.) I bet your chances of having your heart-broken will be drastically cut.”
Hilarious. Low-value betas in college might not possess the resources at present to cheat on a partner, but given the opportunity, they most certainly would. Nevermind all the weird pathologies and fetishes they present. Really, you should’ve stuck with the alter boy advice.
Thanks Poseur for answering my question.
I thought the idea of love at first sight for men came from the fact that men value women primarily for their beauty, and that love at first sight is actually an extreme form of lust.
“Spend all of your time in the Math and Comp Sci departments. 1.) The ratio of male-female will be nice for you and 2.) I bet your chances of having your heart-broken will be drastically cut.”
Hilarious. Low-value betas in college might not possess the resources at present to cheat on a partner, but given the opportunity, they most certainly would. Nevermind all the weird pathologies and fetishes they present. Really, you should’ve stuck with the alter boy advice.
I was hanging out in DC this past weekend and before getting out of the car I turned to my buddy and said, “look dude, Roissy could be anywhere, we need to make sure we refrain from doing any outlandishly beta shit that could land us on his blog.”
Today’s post proves that my fear was not totally unfounded.
Roissy is out there.
“anonymous 57, are you a lesbian?”
Nope!
Poseur
The lack of desire to get married might just be part of our short future orientation instant gratification culture that seems to consistently miss the forest for the trees
Good point
I also think it has to do with our culture overly romanticizing children and marriage to a lesser degree.
Again, you seem incapable of seeing this from any larger point of view. Maybe you can’t get the reproductive angle, so let me put it a different way: What’s so great about the actual nuts and bults experience of being an office drone and slave to a boss and company that don’t care?
“It’s a lot of hard work, much of it thankless.”
As opposed to office jobs, where you’re booted out with no warning and often undervalued?
* * * * *
You do seem intent on misunderstanding what I’m talking about: the fulfillment of the individual, not some obligation to The Genes of The Future. The yield of being an “office drone” is self-sufficiency and financial independence to pursue actual interests in off-time.
Let me ask you this: how many women have put in their time being wives & mothers, putting others’ needs before their own & opting out of a career, only to end up traded in for a younger, hotter wife, ignored by the adult children who no longer need her, and without the means to look after herself? This deification of the uber-benevolent mother-figure is a really nice idea in theory, but the reality of it is that it’s a lot of work, and not every woman is going to choose it. Nor should they be expected to.
LOL @ Steve Lurkel. Another young man made the point recently that many men follow game like it’s a religion. Men should remember that their true selves will come out eventually so it’ s better to not go overboard with game.
“The yield of being an “office drone” is self-sufficiency and financial independence to pursue actual interests in off-time.”
anonymous 119
A lot of people forget this ^^^and many people do not have hobbies( beyond going to bars and watching Grey’s Anatomy & Friends) or travel and that is why their lives are very boring and bland.
Sara:
“Never, ever settle. I don’t care what roissy says. Be yourself, live your own life, do the best you can and try to have no regrets. We all have stories of “the one that got away.” Mine is a very fine man I met when I was 17 years old, and had I been in Gannon’s desired state of mind, would have seen the great man he was, that he was truly in love with me, and I would have married him.
Alas, I had too many fucking issues and broke his heart.”
Let me guess: those “issues” had more than a little to do with you being young and hot and hit on by tons of studs, and preferring them to the secure but boring life provided by Mr. Right?
In my experience when an aging beauty complains to me of her past and her “issues”, this is what it amounts to. No pop-psychology required. When you *had* the power, act without mercy. When you have no power, make spurious appeals to propriety. The truly sobering thought is that if by some magical quirk of fate, such women were allowed their former levels of beauty, they would drop the whole “issues” and “reformation” talk like yesterdays trash.
The only comfort such women will find in me is on the tip o’ my dick…
….in they mouf.
Tupac Chopra
Dude, that post is priceless. Give that man a beer.
Bougee buppies also care about their wives’ pedigree because their lives revolve around proving they are the opposite of ghetto.
I will admit that I probably fall under that category and it’s skewing my responses. I’ve openly admitted that I’m holding out for the middle college educated white girl as a marriage partner as a tool to secure entry into the middle class.
men don’t care about a woman’s rank outside of the context of social pressure to marry “right”
Depending on the family dynamics, marrying “right” can be the most important thing possible. I know that friends and family members would chastise me if I married a woman who meets my bizarre sexual appearance needs.
two, show me their mistresses and get back to me
So why are they hiding their mistresses? It’s obvious that the men are forced to choose between open sexual bliss or maintaining respectability, and they’re choosing the latter. Of course, for us lowly proles, we don’t have the option of having a mistress on the side, so it makes more sense to simply opt out of marriage.
BTW, I would argue that these upper class men are alphas by default due to their high rank when compared to the average male. In effect, they can buy women in away that middle class women can’t. An interesting experiment would be Roissy versus a rich trust fund baby with a pool of middle class women. I seriously would like to see game versus money in a battle for women.
And, David, the grand majority of the human race either likes, or loves their Mommy.
I love my mom, but there are plenty of people who don’t love their mothers. For example, my cousin hates his mom because she called him a mistake, and she has openly stated to him that she would have gotten an abortion if it was legal.
part of the reason for this is how unattractive feminism, the pill, and unfair laws have made marriage for me
Marriage and the social mores of dating fifty years ago are probably worse than the current situation. At least in our modern world, we can check for some sexual compatibility before marriage, but back then there was nearly no recourse for a frigid wife. You got stuck with the ugly girl who came along and there was nothing that you could do about it. And god forbid you decided to opt-out and be single.
The current regime works out for everybody. You get to bang hot women, I get to aspire to porn chicks and masturbate on demand, and women get the chance to date alphas.
hey’ll be miserable, but they’ll be right. For many women, being right seems to be more important than being happy
Actually, being (or feeling) right is the source of happiness.
Spend all of your time in the Math and Comp Sci departments
Those men are ugly and boring. Any woman with any self-respect would cheat on him with Roissy within six weeks of a relationship.I have told all of my female friends to avoid the nerds and geeks, and given what I’ve seen at engineering school, I think I’m well justified in my advice. Getting strung along by Roissy is less demeaning and more fun…
Given a choice, who wants to marry a slut?
I would, but I am the group weirdo.
108 usually Lurking:
I am not religious. It’s more like spiritual.
I’m not against seeing people who are really religious, but wouldn’t they think I was weird?
On that note, I stopped going to clubs in 2nd year. I never really went to bars (do korean bars count?).
I’ll risk my heart getting broken. It happens. But I guarantee you that going for the Math & Comp Sci guys will not mean you won’t be heart broken. If anything, I find that more of these guys are socially inept (sometimes just …cold…) and thus can’t function in any mutual relationship.
Before you totally kill my theory, I do know this as most of my courses are in these departments –> most of my friends are within my major also.
There is also no business major in my school. I know people doing business minors but it’s still just a bunch of engineers of IR/ poli sci kids who want “variety”.
Also, hockey kids and sports kids in general don’t hang out with me because I’m not involved in the traditional varsity sports.
maybe it’s just this place, but it’s hard to connect with different people. And I’m not so narcissistic as to want someone exactly like me. But male.
I have no issues with the hockey player though. Except if they are boring. But the boring restriction for everybody
Well. I read the article and the comments. I have nothing to say on the subject other than being a human being can be a lonely bit of business. Gay, straight, married, not, children, not: we all carry our burdens.
We live in an age where you are lucky if the person you are speaking directly to is even paying attention, let alone a stranger sitting next to you. At least she had another human being talking to her and responding back and it wasn’t Mr. Whiffles she was pouring this out to while he was doing a periscope cleansing.
What I do like is that you listened. Listening is always a good quality for a writer to possess.
I’ll risk my heart getting broken. It happens. But I guarantee you that going for the Math & Comp Sci guys will not mean you won’t be heart broken.
I didnt say that. I said that the probability would be less. I stand by that.
Biz Major, Sociology, Pre-Law, whatever…they are all bullshit. The point is, surround yourself with guys that are either Morally Driven (Religious Beliefs, or, obvious Traditional Convictions) are are focused on improving a real skill. A skill that is measurable and marketable.
Also, you don’t need to date the whole math dept. Hjust one.
Oh, I didnt realize that boring was an issue. Nevermind what I said earlier.
Find yourself an exciting guy. Things should work out.
A nice, thick, luxuriant bush is a thing of absolute beauty, a veritable lush garden of delightful tastes and aromas.
I love the Glorious Natural Pelt.
oh come on, peter, now you’re not even trying to put your GNP into context.
The Glorious Natural Pelt doesn’t need to be put into context. It’s so wonderful, it can create its own context just about anywhere.
127 Usually Lurking
Here, we call them Arts and Crafts
But it’s an endearment. Really.
screwed up in a variety of ways. Or gay.
But I agree with you about the fact that engineering guys aren’t as hot; it’s important to actually be attracted to the person. It’s gotten to the point where people here think an average looking person is the shit.
It’s quite hard to find such a guy (morally driven, doing well, cool AND hot (normal looking)). They’re either taken or mentally screwed up in some way. Or gay.
was she talking about vk?
it’s important to actually be attracted to the person
This is a relatively new idea for women. In the past, the fact that he was a good man was the only thing that mattered. Granted, that usually meant hard working and from a good family.
If you were to drop cool and hot from your list, the options would probably open up.
110 Poseur: “The lack of desire to get married might just be part of our short future orientation instant gratification culture that seems to consistently miss the forest for the trees.”
Since marriage is no longer necessary for sex or children, it must be for something beyond sex and procreation.
55, 129 roissy :”for men, marriage is a raw deal”
Marriage is pretty much a raw deal for everybody.
“oh come on, peter, now you’re not even trying to put your GNP into context.”
See I’m not the only one who does that.
105 Jay: “For many women, being right seems to be more important than being happy,”
It’s not about being right. I agree with you on that point. Am not one to quote studies, but I believe that single women are happier than married women according to a lot of studies. Women want to get married, yes, but they are often unhappy after they get married as many men have discovered.
122 Tupac: “Let me guess: those “issues” had more than a little to do with you being young and hot and hit on by tons of studs, and preferring them to the secure but boring life provided by Mr. Right?”
Correct, though I really don’t think it would have been a boring life at all. I was just jaded and too screwed up to not a lot of shallow sexual experiences. I suppose I could make the same argument men make. How do you know what you want if you haven’t done enough sampling? But is was a lot worse than that, especially judging from the psycho I ended up marrying at 19.
Not trying to be maudlin, but if I was to tell you my history starting from infancy you might wonder how I could ever have sex period, and roissy would be crying for me in his beer and begging for forgiveness. LOL
What about all those studies that show married women to be unhappier than their single counterparts
This is not what the data show. Marriage is one of the strongest predictors of happiness for women as well as for men. Marriage is a better predictor of happiness than being rich.
http://www.webmd.com/mental-health/news/20070104/marriage-beats-money-for-happiness
But for the minority that are not ‘very happy’ with their marriage it would have been better to stay single.
http://econlog.econlib.org/archives/2005/12/is_a_bad_marria.html
Guys, Paperdreamer goes to Johns Hopkins — there are no quality guys there at all. If you get in and go to visit, everyone will tell you: “There are no girls here. All we do is study and play video games. You can’t leave campus or you’ll get shot. I am going to kill myself.”
What a bunch of whiners — you never hear that at any other top school. Paperdreamer, I suggest finding a boyfriend at Georgetown or GW. Don’t date an alpha, since the long-distance aspect means he’ll cheat on you every weekend / night, since you won’t be around. But find a guy just below that, who doesn’t have the option of cheating, but is not a loser either.
http://www.upi.com/NewsTrack/Top_News/2008/05/19/nazis_attack_teens_after_feminist_event/6602/
Men and violence, why do some men get such a rise out of beating women
110 Poseur
I must add to that-that marriage, in order to work, has to be beyond love too.
If she goes to JHU their should be plenty of science majors to choose from. Also, most of the area just east and north of JHU is quite nice. Just west of campus is a different story. Also, there is Towson, Notre Dame (not that one) and, I think, St Marys just north of her. Lots of guys to choose from.
Granted, I think that one of those schools is an all girls school.
I don’t know, you’re kinda mean…
Average looking but feels superior because of self-assessment of intelligence, lots of one night stands, over-developed sense of entitlement, idealizes love, widespread complaints about the other sex…
Yeah, that’s how to stay single. For either sex.
Project much, Roissy?
PS – You spend 20 minutes with a toddler and then try to tell me how unhappy a child-free existence is… Men who say this about women never seem to expect to have to spend much time around their own offspring.
133 Usually Lurking — Since when was it new? NO ONE wants to be with someone that disgusts them, guys and girls alike.
134 “” “” — By cool I meant not socially retarded or controlling. Someone without deeply seated personal issues. By hot I mean at average looking and has all their limbs. My school has lowered my expectations in the looks department. *shrug*
136 agnostic — Luckily for me, I came to get an education. People who came here for “real” college life were disappointed. Sorely disappointed.
I hear more guys have complaints about the lack of quality girls here, though. But I don’t think I’m THAT bad, yeah? So maybe in the same way, quality guys exist here too? But yes, all we do is study (mostly).
You don’t hear it much at other top schools because JHU is not a rich kid school. And as pointed out on some other comment (somewhere?), rich kid schools = better looking kids from rich legacy.
Georgetown people sound good actually, but I don’t have a car. So I need to find a way around that? And I hate the MTA. Hate it!
I don’t really do alpha/ beta classification. Just jerk/pansy notation of people who fit the bill. People have a mix of alpha/beta qualities and I only care if it gets in the way of them being a good person. Everyone is flawed a little bit.
138 Usually Lurking — You would be surprised at how hard it is to talk to people here! I would see people from any major as long as they can hold up a convo. I think people feel awkward so they aren’t comfortable talking to me, but it just comes off like they’re brushing me off. It took me a while to realize that maybe the way I felt is the same for them…
For some reason, there’s this great stigma against seeing people from other schools in the area. I think it’s mostly because whatever girls from other we see out where we are are kind of slutty. So it’s become very stereotyped. On top of that, I feel like guys from other schools are weirded out by what I’m studying? Unless they want a total fling; obviously then, they would not bother to ask!
And I admit that girls at other schools are generally hotter than JHU girls. I don’t have blonde hair and I’m afraid to pull bold moves initially. Guys at other schools would probably find it more convenient to date a girl from their own school?
I don’t know where St Mary’s is though — wouldn’t the school with the girl name be the all-girls’ school though?
dizzy8 — I think the joy in being a parent is partly due to the work and strength it takes to actually do it. Sometimes the hardest jobs are the most rewarding.
WUWV: Oh, I forgot to tell you, I had a one night stand last week! I didn’t expect him to sleep over and be there in the morning.
GB: I know, I know. Sometimes you just want them to get out.
This is funny because they are talking past one another. Sex differences persist across orientation.
Since when was it new? NO ONE wants to be with someone that disgusts them, guys and girls alike.
Read any popular examples of courtship before World War One. The inter-war years were very interesting, but things did not really change until after the 1950’s.
Her “virtue” was extremely important in the mating market (hell, just watch the Godfather for when Pacino goes to Italy). A girl saying that her man needs to be exciting and hawt, well, she would have sounded like a whore.
I am not telling you what to do. Your life, you live it. But, in my experience, it is usually the tried and true advice that works best.
Guys at other schools would probably find it more convenient to date a girl from their own school?
Guys find it convenient to date girls that are attractive.
And, yeah, St Marys might be the all girls school.
#61 chuchulainn you nailed it, and I like the term “infinite choice”, which is what they perceive it to be. The reality, unfortunately, is quite a bit at odds.
First off, there isn’t unlimited time when one has to find a mate and breed early in order to avoid all kinds of birth defects and other problems. Second, their choice may be limited by the choices of other females. It is a marketplace, after all, even though some of the posters here do not want to admit it.
#22, roissy, “your super choosy genes will die out, to be replaced by the genes of women who weren’t so repulsed by the majority of men they encountered in their lives.”
This was precisely my experience through my 30’s and into my 40’s. Those who self-selected for breeding did so early and and made whatever compromises necessary (”settling”, as we call it here), while the others were increasingly composed over time of the “super choosy”. I encounter them from time to time, and I know what they’re thinking: “good grief, who would be desperate enough to marry him?” Problem is they think that way about almost all men–married or single.
1465 Usually Lurking — Okay. I never said being weird looking was the worst thing (being a douchebag tops it all) but I don’t think it’s necessary to reach the point of “disgust.” A little weird looking isn’t bad; it’s its own brand of “hot” sometimes.
I would be happiest with someone not too hot and not too…gross.
I wouldn’t complain if he was ridiculously good looking though
Again more ranting on these poor women, instead of introspection. The males like Roissy need to analyze their contribution to the decay of their women, after all they fathered them and bedded them. While I personally am indifferent to the choices – bad ones – made by these American women, the hypocrisy of the Roissy types irritates me because it reminds me of an older white male hypocrisy.
All these girls who become grotesque sexual animals are trained that way from high school and early adulthood by their fellow american males who had the *choice* not to seduce these women. They chose sexual pleasure. Then they rail on these girls for being 40 and still having one night-stands, when all you glorify in male behavior is the “alpha” trait of bedding girls quickly without any strings attached.
Its not as if the Roissys of the world were planning on marrying her when she was 20, they wanted the easy lay. Whatever though, keep your hypocrisy, it will destroy you.
Paperdreamer — Checking some stats, 60% of JHU undergrads get need-based financial aid, and 55% of Georgetown undergrads get “some form of” financial aid. I don’t know how much of that is need-based, but most probably is. JHU is certainly an upper-middle class school, maybe not quite as packed with richies as Georgetown, but not very different.
The study-all-the-time habit does not reflect wanting an education more than a life — students at other top schools have lives. What Hopkins students do is purely a nerd fashion statement — “Look how much we study!”
However, if all that excess time studying were truly accomplishing something, rather than being past the point where the gain curve has plateaued, then Hopkins students would be dominating the world after graduation. But they’re basically the same as other smart, hard-working people.
Seriously, you all just need to lighten up and have more fun!
No, you don’t seem that bad. You just need to be around people who are more like you, and you’ll find that more at GW or Georgetown.
And I admit that girls at other schools are generally hotter than JHU girls. I don’t have blonde hair and I’m afraid to pull bold moves initially.
Ah, give me a break — have you been to GW or Georgetown? It’s not like the tall thin blond is considered the best-looking. You see tons of girls with tawny skin and jet-black hair — and the guys notice them. Plus you have gray eyes, whereas most people with your skin and hair color don’t, so you’ll stand out.
agnostic — Meh. All I know is that grant money is yummy. I know it might seem like we’re exaggerating, but there really is a reason we scramble to not get screwed over by most of our courses. Maybe it’s just the courses I happen to be taking? Humanities classes are pretty easy in comparison though. I’ll probably end up ranting about that in my own space
People try really hard to get away from the nerd stereotype. We WISH we had friends from MICA.
A lot of Hopkins kids actually do pretty well for themselves after graduation. Probably because they are used to all the crap from this school on a daily basis (most months of the year.)
I’ve never been to Georgetown but I know someone who goes there. She has black hair but she doesn’t count because she’s Asian too
I’m not very fond of blonde hair due to its usual accompaniment with really red skin! But on people who have thicker skin it looks really cool.
I like my looks. I just think guys are more drawn to the All American thing.
It’s sad that schools which actually offer a real education these days are known as nerd schools. Perhaps it’s the other schools that are actually under performing and the nerd schools are actually the normal schools.
Try to keep in mind that what we consider “nerd” now was considered a normal, well-respected man back in the 1950s and 1960s.
Then, women started taking The Pill. As I’ve stated before here (but cannot state enough), when women take The Pill, it changes their hormonal balance and thus changes their taste in men, making them prefer more aggressive masculine types.
Since so many women have been on the pill for so many years, women’s definition of a man has changed — now women prefer bastards and players and dis decent potential providers as “nerds.” This, along with government sponsored feminism and welfare, has created a society of young men who are animals — and thusly beloved by women for that.
This leaves men who worked hard and followed rules saying “WTF happened? I’m successful! Why can’t I get a date?” Hence, we need people like Roissy and Cajun to show us how to out-bastard today’s females.
I wonder if the women in the original post, as well as some of the female posters here are all hopped up on the pill, which is causing their problems with men.
Here is a news story about a study regarding the Pill and how it changes women’s taste in men:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/2677697.stm
Grr! I made a comment (again) that the problem with the woman on this post and some of the female posters may be that their taste in men has leaned towards the too-aggressive because they are on the pill. Being on the pill changes women’s taste in men.
Anyway, it got caught in Roissy’s spam filter.
My feeling is that women now see normal men as nerds because the pill is changing their hormones. Since so many women are on the pill, this has caused a wholesale change in the way women in society view men. The stand-up guy from the 1950s is now a nerdy loser. This is why successful guys who play by the rules cant get dates and read this site.
Here is a link to a study about this. I broke up the link so the spam filter doesn’t get me again. Damn you spam filter!!
http: //news.bbc.co.uk /1/hi/ health/2677697.stm
125 David at an Apple Store in San Francisco
Given a choice, who wants to marry a slut?
I would, but I am the group weirdo.
There’s someone for everyone.
Roissy’s mom and dad should be shot dead. I’m not joking. They will die someday, if they haven’t already. I hope they do soon and you will feel in more pain then you could ever know.
Days of Broken Arrows, I wonder if there’s some self-selection bias in these studies. Women who use birth control are possibly more likely to have sex outside of relationships on a frequent basis, and it may be possible that these women find aggressive and masculine men more attractive.
There’s someone for everyone.
Fun question, do sluts marry lowly beta males or do they go for Roissy types with game? I would suspect the latter since masculine men with game can be aggressive and interesting sex partners.
dizzy8
PS – You spend 20 minutes with a toddler and then try to tell me how unhappy a child-free existence is…
little kids are awesome.
i find kids somewhat tedious between the ages of about 5 and 10, but that seems to be the latter part of the window during which mothers are better equipped to deal with them than are fathers.
–
doba
Being on the pill changes women’s taste in men.
as does repealing social taboos on illegitimacy and instituting government benefits exclusively for illegitimate children. unlike the pill, though, the impact of those changes is not easily reversible.
dizzy8 again
Average looking but feels superior because of self-assessment of intelligence, lots of one night stands, … project much roissy?
write each of the following on the board ten times:
(1)
* 90% of superiority consists of feeling superior.
– ever heard ‘nothing succeeds like success’? it runs deeper: nothing succeeds like the outward appearance of success.
(2)
* promiscuity enhances a male’s reputation, provided his partners satisfy a reasonable standard of social proof.
* promiscuity destroys a female’s reputation, regardless of the standard of her partners.
(3)
* men and women are not measured by the same standards.
(4)
* women reach their expiration date first.
[...] Hot post: Overheard In DC [...]
#151
Again more ranting on these poor women, instead of introspection. The males like Roissy need to analyze their contribution to the decay of their women, after all they fathered them and bedded them. While I personally am indifferent to the choices – bad ones – made by these American women, the hypocrisy of the Roissy types irritates me because it reminds me of an older white male hypocrisy.
women are sexual gatekeepers, whether they like it or not. as such, they do shoulder more of the blame when those gates are breached.
–
Its not as if the Roissys of the world were planning on marrying her when she was 20, they wanted the easy lay.
the presence or absence of that easy lay is completely determined by women.
or:
stealing free samples isn’t stealing.
–
j5 conjecture of the day: you, ‘karma’, are one of those people who think that consensual intercourse in which both partners are drunk can properly be called ‘rape’ if the woman decides upon sobering up that she’s upset about the course of events.
Unfortunately for Roissy, he’s a dead man.
And I’m sorry to all those I’ve offended, I shouldn’t have been so rude and inconsiderate.
I have thought long and hard about my life and I think I may be leaving town soon to change things up. I don’t want to become a bitter person and I fear that’s what I’m becoming.
Wow!
roissy: let’s go to madagascar. hang out with some lemurs, etc. xo
Are “J5″ and “Roissy” posts 164-166 fakes?
roissy
No man. DC is sucking the life out of me and so are the boring women I meet. I need some inspiration. When the only female friend I can really trust tells me sincerely that I seem angry all the time, then I know it’s time to make some changes.
170 contains objective dead-givaways that it’s a fake.
The biggest sign that the latest roissy posts are fake is that their is no “link” attached to the name. That would likely happen by default.
156 DOBA. You mention the pill being a contributing factor in women’s sexual choices. Pardon me because I know most of you guys (especially) are turned off by personal anecdotes and turned on by studies (no matter how irrelevant, useless and contradictory they might be!) but my experience with the pill is that it reduced my sex drive in general. Being a high estrogen type to begin with is a counter indication for taking the pill according to what my doctor told me. It makes such a women feel “a little pregnant” all the time. In other words; bloated & bitchy. (Though I loved actually BEING pregnant.) I hated it, but took it because my first husband insisted. The pill added to my already out of control estrogen nearly cost me my life and my ability to have children.
170 roissy
Your focus is sucking the life out of you, not DC. An active, intelligent mind focused on the negative attracts more and more of it. I hate the whole “Secret” phenomena because it only tells the Spark Notes version of law of attraction in the most irritating way possible, but the law of attraction is the way it is. “The Secret” has given it a bad name! Ugh.
BUT, trust me LOL, wherever you go, there you’ll be (like you didn’t know) and DC is as good a place as any. Still, leave if it makes you feel better because that is the point as it turns out. Reading “The Power of Now” is a great book to add to all the other great books and wisdom out there. As Socrates says “An unexamined life is not worth living.” Yada yada. I know you hate unasked for advice. Who doesn’t? BTW “Sex Matters” could possibly renew your faith in life, sex, human beings, etc…………. And Osho tells some great dirty jokes.
Two regular Sherlock Holmes sleuths. You must rake in the big bucks for being so smart and observant. It was the Butler, in the Drawing Room with the Candlestick!
170 is fake? Oh well.
Not just the link, Usually Lurking. The style is a dead giveaway. Roissy never capitalizes his initial letters at the start of a sentence, nor his “I”s. Someone is pulling his leg for the fun of it.
Anyway, it isn’t the kind of thing I could ever imagine him writing even if it were true.
The biggest sign that the latest roissy posts are fake is that their is no “link” attached to the name. That would likely happen by default.
The style is a dead giveaway. Roissy never capitalizes his initial letters
Neither of these clues was the most obvious indicator of fake. The dead giveaway was that roissy’s custom user icon is that plate of nachos.
richard #175, is the fake roissy and johnny five; see his user icon.
Well, I noticed that, but I figured it wasn’t decisive. Address links can get broken by accident (or if you clear out cookies and other materials in a clean-up), and when they do the icons get de-linked as well. But it was clear to me that Roissy would never have written that stuff.
I’d stick with the assertion that this story is bullshit. I guess Roissy gets bonus points for milking 100+ responses out of pure fiction.
Well done Columbo. Well done. You’re career with the FBI is a calling!
And Now for my next trick. . . TBA
I think this story is bullshit too, but it’s good performance art. It reveals the fundamentally cramped and narrow nature of Roissy’s perspective: men and women can’t be human beings together, they have to fill strictly proscribed roles in a sex game designed to salve his insecurities and boost his ego.
Here we have a woman who lives exactly and precisely his lifestyle, but he’s viciously judgemental about her. Instead of living as he does, she’s supposed to marry a man who will have her.
Yet any man who would have her is a pathetic beta, who Roissy is equally vicious about. The beta is supposed to be out trawling DC bars trying to pick up skanks.
Notice too the whole slut-shaming thing. If said skanks consent to sleep with him, he’s too contempturous of them to want a relationship. This is the classic madonna/whore thing that can end up with sexist males marrying sexless women.
It’s all a hatred-driven perspective, but if you stick to that consistently you can sometimes get a nice stream of ego rewards by manipulating other people.
Oh, and on this thread I’m with David Alexander for once — certain types of “slutty” women make great partners, because they’re fantastic in bed. Just make sure it’s the kind of woman who’s “slutty” because she genuinely enjoys sex and is good at it, just like you are. Women who sleep around because of really low self-esteem are bad news and relationships with them are to be avoided.
Children are beautiful; demanding and rewarding in equal measure. But it’s rude to assume everyone should have them. It’s rude to even ask a married/partnered couple if they want them. In my opinion it is no one else’s business. When I was having fertility problems, people would nosily ask us when we were having children. Very rude. If you want them, have them. Personally I think for a woman who wants them and has them, it will soften her demeanor. If she wants them and doesn’t, she will have regrets.
^ And that goes for men too.
the recent roissys above are not me, as many of you figured out. they are from an IP address originating in japan as far as i can tell. a couple of the johnny fives are imposters from the same IP address as well.
you’ll know it’s me when you see the chips and salsa avatar. unless i post without signing in, in which case the avatar defaults to those geometric wordpress designs.
#157 DOBA
My feeling is that women now see normal men as nerds because the pill is changing their hormones. Since so many women are on the pill, this has caused a wholesale change in the way women in society view men. The stand-up guy from the 1950s is now a nerdy loser. This is why successful guys who play by the rules cant get dates and read this site.
The study doesn’t exactly support your view. From the article:
The study found women on the pill appeared to make equally inappropriate choices when picking a man for a fling.
They were more likely to choose a “caring” man with feminine features.
Conversely, those not on the pill were more likely to choose a macho male for a fling.
So, rather than causing a wholesale sea change in female attraction, the pill appears to reverse the normal order of things. Rather than preferring “masculine” men for flings and “feminine” men for long-term relationships, the pill caused women to do the opposite: They rated masculine men as more attractive as long-term mates and feminine men as more attractive for flings.
Thus, if this research is to be believed, the pill should be causing women to have more casual sex with exactly the beta — i.e., less masculine — men that are here learning about game because they can’t get laid. That’s obviously not happening (if it were, they wouldn’t need game) so there have to be other factors in play.
@ Reggie 187: Of course that article is right.
I don’t think the pill should be causing women to have more casual sex with betas, though, because when single women engage in normal dating, they are primarily (consciously or subconsciously) seeking mates.
Therefore if the pill is driving women to prefer highly masculine-looking men for husbands, this tendency would spill over dramatically into what kind of guys women prefer to hook up with or casually date.
It would be only after the woman has landed the alpha husband, that she might want to have an affair with a caring beta, and then, that would be to get her emotional needs met.
But this thing about the pill doesn’t surprise me and may account for much of the differences we’ve discussed here between American women (and their well-known sense of entitlement, i.e., “I deserve an Alpha”), and women in more traditional societies who don’t use the pill or can’t afford it.
I think if we as a society retreated from the pill as a method of contraception and went back to other methods (or a male pill), this whole thing might change and move more into reverse.
The point is the difference isn’t as clear-cut as the article makes it seem: masculine men for marriage, sensitive betas for affairs.
An affair isn’t the same as dating. An affair happens after the couple is already married. For women, dating is auditioning men for the status of “husband”, and whatever criteria a single woman will employ in this auditioning process will essentially be the same criteria she employs in dating.
Therefore even in casual dating, the average American woman on the pill will prefer the masculine, macho alpha type guys, as opposed to before the advent of the pill, when beta types were much more acceptible dating and mating prospects.
As with everything, the answer lies with Dan Jenkins quotes:
Female character: “I don’t know why we give it away seeing as we have the market on pussy cornered.”
Male character: “If women didn’t have a pussy, there’d be a bounty on ‘em!”
Just because you know the game is stacked against you doesn’t mean you shouldn’t play.
All you whiny college kids that can’t find a man/woman, come up to Boston. The weather can be crappy to those from southerly climes, but every September about 250,000 kids converge on the 80+ colleges and universities withing a 50-mile radius of downtown. We have a college for every race, creed, (trans)gender, SAT and credit score (though conservative students may be more comfortable elsewhere).
More kids mean more competition, but also a target-rich environment. My little brother’s college roommate was in town last month and I went with them on a pub crawl. He commented that he’d never seen so many young hotties in one town, and he grew up in Florida and is working in NYC.
My only non-tourist DC stops were 2 visits to my buddy at Georgetown back in the 80’s.
1. At first blush, I really wouldn’t want to live there.
2. With all the diplomats’ kids matriculating there, Georgetown had the best supply of baroque and hard-to-find drugs I’d ever seen; the parties there were at least as good as the Theta Delta Chi nitrous oxide/grape & grain parties at Tufts!
3. Much more varied and attractive supply of sisters than Boston.
#188 Joe T
You’re conflating “fling” with “affair,” which aren’t the same thing, at least with the usage I’m familiar with. (Then again, given that it’s a BBC article they may be using it in a different sense; are the two words synonymous in Britain?)
Assuming my interpretation is accurate, the study doesn’t say anything about cheating on a partner in a long-term relationship. It simply says that women on the pill prefer feminine men for casual hook-ups (flings) and masculine men for long-term pairings-off. Your extrapolation, though, was that masculine men would still be getting more action than feminine ones because women are always looking for a long-term mate.
But if that were the case, women who are not on the pill would be hooking up with more betas; given that they prefer more feminine men for long-term relationships and that they are always seeking such, the spillover you describe should happen in the betas’ favor instead of the alphas. Is that how things work with women who aren’t on the pill? Anecdotally, I tend to doubt it. But hey, I don’t know.
dizzy8
“PS – You spend 20 minutes with a toddler and then try to tell me how unhappy a child-free existence is… Men who say this about women never seem to expect to have to spend much time around their own offspring.”
Dizzy this is perfect and so true.
Reggie – you’re right, but I think it’s the journalistic style of the author of that article who decided to use “fling” to jazz up what was a scientific finding. The study itself didn’t use the word fling, I’m sure, and yes, I do believe that Brits have a tendency to conflate fling and affair, but then so do many Americans.
It’s a semantic nuance revolving around what is really a slang word anyway, so we should be careful not to impute any scientific significance into the reporter’s choice of words.
Regarding women who aren’t on the pill, I think it’s enough for a statistically (and scientifically) significant segment of the female population to be using the pill, for it to register in what is perceived to be a mass phenomenon.
I think the study is borne out empirically by our perceptions that modern urban women (as a group) seem to be selecting for alpha types more than women of pre-pill days, or women in traditional societies or places where non-pharmaceutical contraception is used (e.g., abortions as a form of contraception in Russia and Eastern Europe.)
191 Chic and Dizzy
It’s no joke that two’s are terrible, but two and a half was even worse. Parents need training and seriously need to have their shit a lot more together and/or have lots of family/friend support to deal with toddlers especially in an effective manner that does not leave everyone drained and upset. Not that I had that. I wish. It’s better to overestimate the demands and decide against kids, than romanticize having them (especially as a single parent–ouch!) and wonder why you did something so fucking insane.
I never, ever wanted to be a single parent. I know of a single woman who adopted a Chinese girl who ended up with serious health issues and cannot get a date because of it. She’s aged 20 years. They are GREAT, don’t get me wrong, but be realistic. Bottom line though, most who have them think their kids are the best ever. I am no exception, though we have had our extremely negative moments.
Parents need training and seriously need to have their shit a lot more together and/or have lots of family/friend support to deal with toddlers especially in an effective manner that does not leave everyone drained and upset.
dealing with small children is not a walk in the park, but it only becomes eternally draining and upsetting if the parents operate under the following ridiculous presumptions:
1) the child’s opinions are carry the same weight and gravitas as do informed adult opinions;
2) the default is to grant children’s requests rather than to defer them.
parents who deal with their small children within the context of a proper parent-child dynamic, in which #1 and #2 above do not hold, rarely experience problems to the degree you’ve described. additionally, unless you come from a large conservative family, the ‘family/friend support’ you’ve mentioned is highly overrated; many of those friends and family members will merely provide ’support’ in the form of further spoiling or gift-giving.
our homesteader ancestors had children in double-digit numbers in every family. why didn’t their parents go insane? oh, that’s right, because the parents ran the family, not the children’s fickle desires.
oh yeah, and let’s not forget that cooking and laundry took a lot longer than twenty minutes back then, too.
[...] Hot post: Overheard In DC [...]
Did you say Nietzsche? God is dead and man is free…pass it on.
J5 “the ‘family/friend support’ you’ve mentioned is highly overrated;”
Practically speaking I have to agree. Most of us have families we prefer to be 1000 miles away from. For a lot of us “homesickness” means getting sick when you go home.
Hi Paperdreamer – You’re right, being a parent is rewarding. It is not, however, the only way to be happy.
And what I was getting at was the double standard, “Oh those poor women who had too many one night stands and now I will never let them have my babies!” is hard to take. Especially when it’s from the kind of guy who 1) Spends all his time bragging about one night stands and 2) Obviously expects his wife to spend much more time with the kids than he will.
The main point: I agree the woman Roissy described sounds unhappy, but she also sounds exactly like his persona on this board.
paperdreamer, at least from this site, I take it that a lot of men like women with dark hair. I’ve never had any complaints and I have dark skin too.
Johnny Five is giving some great parenting advice. Dude, you should start your own blog. As one who has been there, that’s some perceptive stuff — it’s a shame too many parents these days act like their little rugrats are little Gods.
198 dizzy8
hey
I never said it’s the only way to be happy. In fact, a lot of people just can’t be happy as parents.
But little children come with joys for sure if you happen to be in that position and see the beauty of their life for what it is.
There’s a HUGE age gap between my sibling and me; my parents needed help taking care of a random baby after so long! Through most of middle school and until college, my sibling grew up with me (it’s probably been the most effective way I know to make a teenager cringe at the thought of pregnancy.)
So yeah, I know better than to glorify the upkeep of kids. But it’s amazing what it takes to “make” a person — I admire my parents and all good parents for sucking it up and doing it in grace.
But as for baby-making, I think the girl’s got as much of a choice as the guy. If he (or you) can’t handle a baby, don’t have one with him.
—————————————————-
199 Chicnoir — Well that is fantastic then
It’s hard to tell when someone is genuinely interested versus someone who is being friendly.
I think the biggest problem has been saying hi to someone. Sometimes a guy will just stare, like I can read his mind. At the time, I always get really self conscious, hoping he’s not staring at food or something on my lips. After they leave, I stop panicking and realize I should’ve at least smiled. Crap.
It is sad that so many women are going to be childless in about 10 more years due to emulating the lifestyles presented them via the media. I imagine alot of women will wake up 42 and childless and realize that its “too late”.
Younger women dont seem to realize that those good looks WILL BE GOING, and that in time no men will be interested in them except guys who are over fifty years old. When they go out, nobody is going to notice them anymore at the grocery, getting coffee, running errands, etc. 29 year olds, due to Western make up, moisturizing soaps, nutrition do not realize this. Just because science can keep skin supple for an extra decade doesn’t mean your womb is getting younger.
The best men, the real winning men, get married fairly young, the gals are leaving themselves with the lesser males as potential mates.
There is nothing as sad as an old maid…………………..and we are going to have alot of them in the next two decades. Many of these old maids will know in their hearts that some fairly decent guys once made them offers that they refused, thinking they were going to land a choice male because a handful of choice males had one-nighters with those females. It doesn’t work like that. After they get old, even the older beta males wont really give a tinker’s damn about these women. Their nephews and nieces wont care about them, their siblings who had children will be caring for their granchildren at that time. Old maid equals old loser. Old men who are childless usually get openly bitter, but at least many of them will be able to honestly say that they tried, but were turned down. The old maids, especially if they once had decent looks, will know they wound up old and unwanted and UNLOVED (yes, you will be unloved and viewed as a burden by your family ladies for bringing no joy into the world), will know they turned down many opportunities to have a family.
If you think alone is tough at 40…………………….try it at 60 when you really are unwanted and the younger folks in your family wished you’d not show up at gatherings and that you’d die soon so the family could sell your condo and enjoy your net worth for a few months. Friends? Ha, what do you have to talk about at that age? Gonna gossip about “Dancing with the Stars” in your sixties.
202 z
What astounds me is that you posted this comment at 7:22 a.m. yesterday and no one has seen fit to cite any studies to disprove your assertions.
Sara,
That is because what I took the time to type is the cold hard truth. Too many people wait too long now, either ending up alone or having to make a choice out of desperation.
My real “point” is this: If you a guy, with maybe better-than-average-but-not-David-Hasselhoff-in-his-prime looks, making decent money, you can expect a pretty cute gal, but you cannot expect a supermodel.
If you are a gal, who is between Cynthia Nixon and Carmen Electra……….you can expect a pretty neat fella, but not the young Antonio Banderas. When you get to be about 27, its time to start REALLY looking hard, and realize that you might want to lower your standards by about 10% or so. You WANT to be MARRIED by 30, trust me.
To be really ugly and brutally honest (Ive seen more days than you Sara……Im older now), most of the real “winners” I went to school and college with—the best guys and gals, were married before 25 and alot of them before 22……….and have been “off the market” all these years. In fact, the very best gals I went to high school with never went bar-hopping, but got married around 19-20. They are all still married. That goes for the guys too…………………….the club scene really didn’t have the all-American types…………they had already “hooked up” for life.
These days, in the age of myspace and facebook, people with real impressive resume’s can skip both smokey bars and hokey singles-get togethers altogether and seek out those who have similar high qualities as themselves via the internet and not have to deal with Rico Suave’s putting their hands all over them at some damp nightspot. I was lucky enough to get out of the bar scene at a little past 30, but I was already feeling ridiculous out there……………its plainly hideous to see older people obviously “for sale” having to compete with younger folks in their prime in meat markets where they can’t post their full “resume” of cultural awareness, education, professional achievement, financial achievement (i.e. a decent house with an acceptable mortage that doesn’t leave you eating porrige), etc.
Sara,
I hope your not defending cougarhood or “dirty-old-mannism”, ……………they both suck. Youth is the time to fall in love and fall happily in love with someone you want to raise a couple of kids with. Endless one-night-stands (I had a few of them back in the day)………….eventually just stink and are empty pleasures that you soon forget. Find love, Roissy is right, he just has a very blunt force raunchy way of putting it.
“What Happened to All the Nice Guys?”
Date: 2007-11-19, 3:52AM PST
I see this question posted with some regularity in the personals section, so I thought I’d take a minute to explain things to the ladies out there that haven’t figured it out.
What happened to all the nice guys?
The answer is simple: you did.
See, if you think back, really hard, you might vaguely remember a Platonic guy pal who always seemed to want to spend time with you. He’d tag along with you when you went shopping, stop by your place for a movie when you were lonely but didn’t feel like going out, or even sit there and hold you while you sobbed and told him about how horribly the (other) guy that you were fucking treated you.
At the time, you probably joked with your girlfriends about how he was a little puppy dog, always following you around, trying to do things to get you to pay attention to him. They probably teased you because they thought he had a crush on you. Given that his behavior was, admittedly, a little pathetic, you vehemently denied having any romantic feelings for him, and buttressed your position by claiming that you were “just friends.” Besides, he totally wasn’t your type. I mean, he was a little too short, or too bald, or too fat, or too poor, or didn’t know how to dress himself, or basically be or do any of the things that your tall, good-looking, fit, rich, stylish boyfriend at the time pulled off with such ease.
Eventually, your Platonic buddy drifted away, as your relationship with the boyfriend got more serious and spending time with this other guy was, admittedly, a little weird, if you werent dating him. More time passed, and the boyfriend eventually cheated on you, or became boring, or you realized that the things that attracted you to him weren’t the kinds of things that make for a good, long-term relationship. So, now, you’re single again, and after having tried the bar scene for several months having only encountered players and douche bags, you wonder, “What happened to all the nice guys?”
Well, once again, you did.
You ignored the nice guy. You used him for emotional intimacy without reciprocating, in kind, with physical intimacy. You laughed at his consideration and resented his devotion. You valued the aloof boyfriend more than the attentive “just-a-” friend. Eventually, he took the hint and moved on with his life. He probably came to realize, one day, that women aren’t really attracted to guys who hold doors open; or make dinners just because; or buy you a Christmas gift that you mentioned, in passing, that you really wanted five months ago; or listen when you’re upset; or hold you when you cry. He came to realize that, if he wanted a woman like you, he’d have to act more like the boyfriend that you had. He probably cleaned up his look, started making some money, and generally acted like more of an asshole than he ever wanted to be.
Fact is, now, he’s probably getting laid, and in a way, your ultimate rejection of him is to thank for that. And I’m sorry that it took the complete absence of “nice guys” in your life for you to realize that you missed them and wanted them. Most women will only have a handful of nice guys stumble into their lives, if that.
So, if you’re looking for a nice guy, here’s what you do:
1.) Build a time machine.
2.) Go back a few years and pull your head out of your ass.
3.) Take a look at what’s right in front of you and grab ahold of it.
I suppose the other possibility is that you STILL don’t really want a nice guy, but you feel the social pressure to at least appear to have matured beyond your infantile taste in men. In which case, you might be in luck, because the nice guy you claim to want has, in reality, shed his nice guy mantle and is out there looking to unleash his cynicism and resentment onto someone just like you.
If you were five years younger.
So, please: either stop misrepresenting what you want, or own up to the fact that you’ve fucked yourself over. You’re getting older, after all. It’s time to excise the bullshit and deal with reality. You didn’t want a nice guy then, and he certainly doesn’t fucking want you, now.
Sincerely,
A Recovering Nice Guy
@ 205
I agree with most of what you say here, but I don’t think it’s all the woman’s fault. I would like to date a nice guy, but in my experience those guys never ask me out or are turned off by the fact that I’ve asked them out.
Advice to nice guys: Use your words
Jules : Same here. Being the “nice” person extends both ways.
or are turned off by the fact that I’ve asked them out.
wait what?
you can’t be serious. most archetypal nice guys would be thrilled to be asked out by a woman, as most of them are so timorous and emasculated that they would rather a woman take control and make decisions, and would rather poke out their own eyes than muster the courage to approach a woman.
unless, of course, you’re dealing with nice guys over the age of 60.
Completely serious – though ‘turned off’ probably wasn’t the best phrase. They are excited, but they never take any kind of initiative to make anything happen after that. I’m ok asking a guy out and I’m ok making the first phone call, but if they can’t make an effort after that I’m over it.
They are excited, but they never take any kind of initiative to make anything happen after that.
fyi:
where precedents are set, they are generally followed.
it’s a rare sheep that will spontaneously begin to lead shepherds around, especially a really nice and conscientious sheep who doesn’t want to offend the shepherd’s (real or imagined) delicate sensibilities.
To any lesser betas reading this: When you consider settling for a desperate older woman on the prowl for a sucker, this is what you’re getting — a has-been dried-up wall-hitting cock-slurping cum dumpster pussy-stretched three input titty-sagging multiple-cat-having haagen daz-scarfing cervix-scarred barren-wombed psychologically unmoored skank whore cougar. You have been warned.
That’s why I quit the game entirely, and just fuck whores.
What I can get on the free dating market, I’m not interested in. I’d probably treat her like shite, because I would be mad at myself for not getting better.
“There is nothing as sad as an old maid…………………..and we are going to have alot of them in the next two decades. Many of these old maids will know in their hearts that some fairly decent guys once made them offers that they refused, thinking they were going to land a choice male because a handful of choice males had one-nighters with those females. It doesn’t work like that. After they get old, even the older beta males wont really give a tinker’s damn about these women.”
The assumption underlying that argument is: “This woman will be sad, sad, sad once I don’t want her anymore.” That only works if she wanted you. It’s more than likely she never did, or she tried to put up with you and opted out after you bugged her too much.
It’s true that some women may not get to have the kids they wanted, but like in Juno, many people blame the dorky guys who kept trying to be 16. “I’ll never have a baby if I have to wait for you to grow up,” is the best line, ever. Most women who reach some “advanced” age like, 30 and are still childless, had at least one long-term relationship that didn’t work out.
So now, with Roissy, the jackass husband from Juno has a board where he says, constantly, that what he really wants is a fertile, agreeable teenager-or-barely-past-it and any woman who, has her own opinion, makes her own money, or, you know, AGES (like there’s an alternative) is not going to do it for him.
And you guys think we feel bad for being left out of the fun?
204 z
“I hope your not defending cougarhood or “dirty-old-mannism”, ……………they both suck. ”
No. I advocate people working toward taking more and more responsibility for themselves and being as happy with themselves as possible regardless of age, marital status. child-having or not-having status, race, color, creed, etc., etc.. etc.
You’re describing the masses perhaps that had high hopes for the fulfilling the made for TV American (or some such) ideal dream life and are old and bitter in their middle and older years because they did not achieve that pinnacle of “success”.
There is no REAL reason why anyone has to fall into that pit of self-pity, just because you observe the majority doing just that. What about the people who don’t achieve the worshipped IDEAL and are still happy with themselves? You don’t want to consider that possibility because then where does that leave you? With no excuses? The key is to be happy where you are, but looking for more. If you’re unhappy where you are, you’re screwed at any age no matter what and it sounds like you’re screwed. Correct me if I’m wrong.
205 anonymous too
“I suppose the other possibility is that you STILL don’t really want a nice guy, but you feel the social pressure to at least appear to have matured beyond your infantile taste in men. In which case, you might be in luck, because the nice guy you claim to want has, in reality, shed his nice guy mantle and is out there looking to unleash his cynicism and resentment onto someone just like you.”
So, you’re pissed. That is good. It’s better than crying yourself to sleep every night. But what now? Unleash your anger and vengeance on the first woman you can find? (Let’s assume your talking about yourself here for a minute.) I never can understand people who are conscious of how fucked up they are, going out and seducing other people in order to “get back” at some imaginary wrong doing that was inflicted on them by a vicious victimizer. That is such a great help to society in general. LOL
Any jerk or jerkette can can do that, and boy do they. My ex is a great example. If I were as fucked up as he is about women (yes, I’ve been that fucked up) I would avoid relationships like the plague until I figured it out: #1 so I don’t inflict more damage on MYSELF. #2 So I don’t inflict more damage on OTHERS.
This seems to me to be Humanity 101 and I would never have believed how many do not live by that until stumbling upon roissy’s world and having experienced it myself.
My advice; get your own head out of your own ass before you inflict yourself on anyone else. Maybe that’s what you’re doing. I hope so.
Why is it that when women try to assess real life, they can’t ever look at stats or trends?
Instead they cite literature (which is largely rewritten by editors to sell product) or (gag) movies…like “Juno.” This feminist fantasy of pregnancy is not a good example as to what any type of “reality” is like.
In fact, one of the big problems with most art created by females is that it usually reflects on the female’s own edition of “reality” not on the real world itself. Who was it who said that men look at the world through a window, while a woman’s idea of the world is to gaze endlessly into a mirror?
215 DOBA
“art created by females is that it usually reflects on the female’s own edition of “reality” not on the real world itself.”
I hate to call anyone an idiot and it is never polite. It is always wiser and more accurate to call a persons beliefs or behavior idiotic; or more accurately in error; or more accurately self-defeating. But this statement begs for a response. Whether you believe it or not; the truth holds: we create our own reality. You are also looking in a mirror 24/7. Your mirror is full of studies and the idea that there is such a thing as an objective reality. Sorry to burst your bubble of perception; but there truly is not. There are in fact studies to prove it.
^ Don’t waste your time DOBA calling me a dumb cunt or stupid fucking bitch. I am already aware of it, but am enjoying myself regardless of the reality. Too much sometimes, but such is life.
sara
I got that screed from The Best of Craigslist, and posted it because it exemplifies a lot of what’s posted here. Woman dates bad guys, woman marries uber beta, has kids with uber beta, divorces him, then ruts with bad guys after divorce, while uber beta pays her through the nose.
I’ve been divorced in San Diego- the epicenter of female entitlement and sexual selection run amok. I see this happening again and again and again – it’s not a fiction that women initiate 70% of divorces nationwide (about 85% in San Diego County).
At the same time, if joint custody were the rule of law, divorce rates would plummet. But no, NOW and the other hagocracy feminista organizations won’t have that.
I am content to get in shape and date for the next few years until my kids are out of the house (I have to pay more child support if I live with or marry any other wage-earners: thanks, NOW). Eventually I’ll settle down, but I want to enjoy life for a while and all of the wonderful experiences a single man with money in his pocket can have in SoCal.
You seem bitter – no one is inflicting any choices on you. No men’s groups have bullied the milquetoast betas who run our country into penalizing you with Constitution-free family law legal burdens.
As a woman, and hence, a legally privileged member of our matriarchal society, you have nothing to complain about.
Sara – I don’t insult people because that’s the sign that a person has a weak argument.
I think my point, though, is valid, and is the reason there has never been a female Shakespeare or Frank Capra or Warhol or Beatles. Great art cannot be totally insular and narcissistic; it has to reference the real world to resonante thru the ages. This, I suspect, is the reason Madonna’s work is already looking awful in retrospect. Most female art celebrates females (ie Annie Lebovitz). I don’t really think “celebrating females” is on the same level as “Macbeth” or even “Hey Jude.”
218 DOBA
You are judging the value of art based on it’s ability to be massively popular. Maybe they don’t look at stats and trends because they don’t give a shit about stats and trends. You seem to believe that makes men superior. I’m generalizing here but a woman is usually more interested in what is close to home, such as what she going to wear on any given day, rather than what is going on in Afghanistan. Sure there are exceptions, but the highly political women also do not seem to be the ones that guys like you and roissy are attracted to. BTW I am so done with the Beatles.
218 Sorry DOBA I just can’t resist. So are you telling me that since there is some stat or trend that says Madonna’s music has become “awful” I should prefer “I Am The Walsrus” to “Get Into the Groove”? In my world that would be just idiotic, trends and stats to the contrary. Living by trends and stats is pathetic…in my humble opinion. I go by how I FEEL and what makes me feel good.
OMFG I am a woman! Guess you have zero respect for anyone who guides their life that way. Of course thoughts influence emotions and there is a place for logic, but in the end, emotions never lie.
sara
Not pissed, just wiser about the law and who is legally privileged in this society.
That being said, I agree with the above poster that there will be a lot of old maids in the US in the coming years.
Feminism is a failed experiment, at least as it is practiced in the US, and with 45% of births now out of wedlock, you can bet that the decline of civil society and functional families is going to accelerate.
Thanks, NOW. Thanks, Gloria, Andrea and Catherine.
I’ll enjoy myself for the next ten years or so, and then maybe settle down as much as I can without giving some woman an option on all my future earnings.
Very “empowering”.
I’m generalizing here but a woman is usually more interested in what is close to home, such as what she going to wear on any given day, rather than what is going on in Afghanistan.
this is exactly the reason why the notion of 50% female representation in boardrooms, legislatures, etc. is sadly misguided.
you might as well try to force the high school chess club* to become 50% jocks.
–
*off topic: i have never understood why chess, alone among all human activities, is the domain of clueless nerds in high school but of streetwise, silver-tongued hustlers in the agora.
“and is the reason there has never been a female Shakespeare or Frank Capra or Warhol or Beatles”
Oh, historically & societally I think there are a *lot* of other reasons why females are a little late to the party, artistically-speaking.
“This, I suspect, is the reason Madonna’s work is already looking awful in retrospect.”
More likely the fact that Madonna’s work was never art in the first place.
222 anonymous too
My house is for sale and I refuse to have a lockbox (too controlling as far as my environ. is concerned) so hence…here I am. Personally I believe the women’s movement has been a detriment to feminine causes. Becoming counterfeit men has not helped. Regardless of “who started it”, be nice to everyone! Being hurt in a so-called romantic relationship/marriage is no excuse to take it out on other women or your cat or dog for that matter. Just be yourself. Many men here gag at that advice. Being myself does not get me laid! I said be yourself, not a pathetic loser. There is a difference.
Women are suffering just as much as men. Victim/victimizer alike are suffering. Sometimes the victimizer is more open to getting help, because this society loves and encourages victimhood, so victims are not as motivated to seek the reason for their finding themselves victim over and over. The reasons are there, so find them. We are not meant to suffer, be unhappy and remain clueless as to why.
223 J5
“this is exactly the reason why the notion of 50% female representation in boardrooms, legislatures, etc. is sadly misguided.”
What you are saying is that what is close to home is not worthy of representation. Well, don’t worry because many of the women who ARE in boardrooms, legislatures, etc. are more or less counterfeit men, so feminine women are not being represented anyway. Being one of those sadly uninformed women, correct me if I’m wrong; but wasn’t it Hillary Clinton who said women should be fighting alongside men in the military? OMFG, if that isn’t counterproductive to feminine causes I don’t know what is.
224 anon #57
“More likely the fact that Madonna’s work was never art in the first place.”
Madonna’s “work” is to get people off their fat asses, dancing. I’ll take that over pondering an Andy Warhol Campbell’s soup can any day.
The funniest thing of all is that we thought feminism was so new and fresh. In Indonesia a third world country like 99 percent muslim the woman have to go to other countries to work and work the rice fields. They are liberated
and have been for a long time.
sara
“Many men here gag at that advice. Being myself does not get me laid! I said be yourself, not a pathetic loser. There is a difference.”
Hahaha. That is very funny!
I’m not wallowing. Getting off my ass, exercising regularly, hanging out w/my daughters – that is what life is all about.
To some degree “game” and “feminism” are just the opposite, as they both (often) require people to act contrary to their essence.
As I grow older, I am more and more comfortable with myself, and do not need to worry about game (I am a Natural) or PC feminism, which only restricts my actions and words at work.
Nonetheless, I worry about my daughters. The backlash against the hard-core feminism that permeates American society will be a long and ugly battle.
229 Anon Too
“Hahaha. That is very funny!”
I think you’re only the second person here who gets my sense of humor. ^_^
218 anon too
“You seem bitter – no one is inflicting any choices on you”
Do I? Don’t see myself that way. You have no idea what I’ve been through, but I will spare you. Fearful seems like a more appropriate word, or shell shocked, but am getting over it. Have taken a lot of abuse here, not that I’m complaining. I can dish it out and take it.
In general a lot of men do seem bitter here because they’ve been nice, taken for granted, and discarded. Lesson learned; you can never be too careful with your heart. TRUST is now my #! goal in romantic relationships. It used to be; trust till proven otherwise, now it’s trust first and foremost however long it takes before my panties come off. When a man breaches the gates, he’s pretty much got my heart too. For men who bond from sex, I’m sure it’s the same. Learning body language has been by FAR the best thing I’ve learned from my last tragedy. Everything I ever wanted to know was right there all along.
sara.
Hmmmm. At 44, rapidly approaching 45, with two kids 50% of the time finally, after 5 years and about $85K of litigation costs, this “heart” you speak of is no longer.
My heart over the years is now a dense ball of supercooled iron, floating in a chamber of Helium III. I honestly don’t know what that part of my life will bring over the next few years.
I do know this, though. Simply by allowing a woman to live in my house, I permit her to potentially option a good part of my future wages, due to Constitution-free, anti-male domestic violence and palimony laws in California. No way that is going to happen until my kids are out of the house and in college.
Until then, I will enjoy the sweet fruits of womanhood that appear within my grasp, their juices dribbling down my chin as I taste their sweetness.
Just because a love is fleeting, does not mean it cannot be as intense or enjoyable as one that lasts forever.
Anonymous Too — I keep saying this but it’s worth repeating: Check out Glenn Sacks’ blog for issues regarding divorice, child support and custody. He’s the leading authority on “men’s issues.” The reason men get reamed in court is because unlike feminists, we don’t band together and therefore don’t pose a threat to misandrist (anti-man) judges.
Sacks is the closest men have to a Gloria Steinem, and I recommend reading his work and getting involved in his campaigns. He’s done some good stuff.
I’ll just close with a dose of reality……………
German birthrate was recently “up” to 1.45
Spanish birthrate has been as low as 1.21
Italian birthrate was below 1.3 for a while.
Does anyone else want to do the math and see what this means?
It means that in Spain, if they keep it up………………121 kids are born to 200 adults of breeding age. If the kids do this for ONE MORE GENERATION, there will only be 70 or so grandchildren for 200 grandparents.
The financial consequences of this (gotta pay those retirements and entitlements) will make life miserable for those 70 kids without massive, unprecedented, population-REPLACEMENT levels of immigration. Its as if a country just decided to commit SUICIDE and give their nation to other peoples who are simply willing to breed.
THAT is what is bewildering about feminism Sara.
Sara, Ive read your remarks……………………………..and they ARE ALL ABOUT YOU. Good god, do you really think my remarks were about me? NO, Im happy and content, but I am looking out at the world and mathematically noting a potential financial and social catastrophe in the west due to weak birthrates——————————and have equivicated those birthrates to gender feminism and its extenalities that probably weren’t intended by many of its adherents. The unhappiness angle I do see is that many women who will have missed the opportunity to have families will regret it deeply in middle age…………………..and fucking strangers will not be as fun at this time for them, believe me. The shine of sport fucking was off it for me by my MIDDLE 20’s. Im glad I dont have to go out there and look anymore. Is she the most beautiful thing on earth or always happy? No, but we are pretty darn happy. Thats what you do in life at some point, you have to settle somewhat. You’ll find that it is OK. Very few people marry their “dream” person.
1)Feminism has equalled—————not enough kids
2) Feminism has also equalled…………..alot of old childless females.
3) Feminism has equalled a ton of divorce, that men have had to pay for financially and its the real driver of feminism.
4). When men start refusing to marry and (with the help of the male contraceptive that IS ON THE WAY and in studies now) father children……………………..women raised on feminist fantasies will be fucked, unable to get pregnant and blame it on men who will demand paternity tests (so the feminism wont be getting paid for via child support). Men seeking foreign wives will further hasten its demise as primarily white women will more and more find themselves really unwanted and even more un-needed.
5). The financial repreccusions of feminism will really be felt when generation X…………….the generation with the low birthrate and less helpful family members, starts to retire. Our brown and black youth aren’t going to want to pay for a bunch of old white crackers with few kids and grandkids. The electoral balance will shift drammatically at this time (do the math) and alot of then-oldsters might be shocked at how they are shucked by society then. No one will care, and they wont have the votes to do much about it.
6) This could have all been avoided—–regardless of how you “feel”. You cant “feel” an empty stomach up on food unless you have SOMEONE PAYING FOR YOU——which will be less and less (see above). Feminism in other words, paid for child-like indulgence for boomer and gen-x and gen-y women before the note really came due, but it will be in the coming decades.
Days of Broken Arrows
I know Glenn and his work. And you are right – for some reason, men don’t band together to remedy their situation.
Also, I have found that in my experience, and that of many fathers, the best judge to have if you are a man is….a relatively young female judge.
Perhaps there is hope for society three generations from now.
I don’t have the numbers, just a hunch here: are the campaigns against teenage pregnancy the culprit behind the West’s low birth rates?
The real culprit is that women’s extended adolescence increases each year. Age of first marriage delys itself more and more, specially among high and middle class (middle class girls aspire to be high class) women. A lot of women nowadyas marry at around 30, an age where their fertility has decreased a lot. Sure, a lot of women in their thirties have children. But also, a lot of women in their thirties can’t have children anymore. The real age brackets which always have produced the most children are the women aged 16-30. That is the age when women can produce the nexy generation. Teen girls are as fertile as shit. Fuck a 16 year old girl three times, and voilá, she will be knocked up. You can fuck some 30something year old woman for months, use a table to determine her fertile days, raise her hips to allow your spunk to get to the matrix but even the that gal’s belly won´t grow.
#234 PA I doubt it. The US still has the highest teen pregnancy rate in the developed world at 53/1000. The thing that Z was saying in point 5 of his long post, is that the kids having babies early and often aren’t going to look like you (I’m assuming you’re white). The teen birth rate is 20 times higher among Hispanics in Tulare county, California than in Marin County.
Also, since the birth rate has been dropping since the end of WWII, I doubt that Anti-Teen Preg. campaigns are doing it because they haven’t been aroung long enough.
“When a man breaches the gates, he’s pretty much got my heart too.”
Yeah, sara, but nobody cares. You are old. The prize isn’t what it used to be. Younger women have the luxury of getting away with BS, but older women never can.
The US still has the highest teen pregnancy rate in the developed world at 53/1000
But that is probably the reason why the US has a higher birthrate than Europe.
“Yeah, sara, but nobody cares. You are old. The prize isn’t what it used to be. Younger women have the luxury of getting away with BS, but older women never can.”
Why do sexually wothless chicks feel a need to constantly post on this site?
231 anon too
“Just because a love is fleeting, does not mean it cannot be as intense or enjoyable as one that lasts forever.”
You speak of a heart that “is now a dense ball of supercooled iron, floating in a chamber of Helium III” and then go on to say talk about “a love that is fleeting”?
Sorry, that makes my skin crawl. I only hope the women who have sex with you don’t get frostbitten. I KNOW that feeling of a heart that feels terminally broken, only for me it was a brick lodged between my ribs. I cannot imagine having sex under those conditions.
233 z
I was raised in a HIGHLY feminist environment. BOTH my parents would have preferred if I was a Lesbian!! I am 100% serious. They BOTH think men are the cause of everything evil in the world. My father cries when he watches Oprah and my mother does all the handyman chores in the house. They are both bleeding heart victim-worshipping liberals. No need to repeat myself I imagine, but I am not at ALL pro-feminism as it exists and agree with many of your points in that regard. I feel extremely lucky to have had a child. I wanted one and got one. Hooray!
238 and 240, freak and bristlecone
The reason I post on this site is to piss you off.
238 and 240
Yes you are correct in your assumption that I am “older”, but worthless? You will gag and laugh at this perhaps, but a friend told me recently she has seen men “drool over me” when I dance. And no, these are not old men who are missing their teeth. These are men 20-70. When you’ve got it, you’ve got it. On the other hand, you’re here, why? To get advice on how to get laid?
Sara’s parents said: “They BOTH think men are the cause of everything evil in the world.”
Maybe so, but men also invented and built the whole world that keeps them safe and makes things convienent — and clean. Without men, we’d all be living in grass huts, as Camile Paglia once said.
Also, many wars and battles are fought to protect women and children from treacherous other forms of ogvernment and oppression. So while men might fight wars, they’re often fighting for a greater good.
I’m glad your parents can live in a world where they can hate men — a luxury brought to them by (white) men, who came up with the notion of freedom of speech. And I’m glad you were able to broadcast it on the internet, invented by a man, projected on a screen, invented by a man, with electricity, invented by a man, fed through an entire infrastructire, all created and helmed by men.
“Yes you are correct in your assumption that I am “older”, but worthless? You will gag and laugh at this perhaps, but a friend told me recently she has seen men “drool over me” when I dance. And no, these are not old men who are missing their teeth. These are men 20-70. ”
I’d likely fuck you if you were giving it up for free. However, that doesn’t mean I’d want to invest in anything long term with you. Men want to fuck anything that moves. Sometimes when women aren’t present they will even fuck sheep. Does that mean sheep are do desireable to guys? Besides, friends will tell you anything because they’re your friends. Also, a lot of men over 50 are missing teeth sometimes, and my guess is that you’ve got more men over 50 drooling for you than under. But, like I said, even the under 50 crowd will fuck you if it’s for free.
Too many women on this board suffer from your same delusions of grandeur.
Talk to me when a rich man of whatever age actually wants to take care of you long term, financially and otherwise.
243 DOBA
Agreed. Both of my brothers are so screwed up, not that I am the most well-balanced person in the world. One of my brothers is certifiably mentally ill and the other who is middle-aged has not had a girlfriend since he was 16 years old. Now he is married to my mother for all intents and purposes. Sorry, I know that is creepy.
sara
I have no problem loving, but when I continually hear women talk about marriage after the third date, I surrender to my circumstances.
What is more insincere and callous – wanting to make love with a beautiful woman so you both can enjoy your time together, or talking about marriage the third time you meet someone?
Society has taken a turn, driven largely by feminist groups who have irrevocably changes the laws governing marriage and divorce such that only a foolish man would contemplate marriage in today’s legal environment, where men are warned at work to be careful about having female employees in their offices with the door closed, but women laugh about their “relationships” with teenage boys and the legal system doesn’t bat an eye.
The desperation of women who perceive themselves as close to expiration is sadly palpable all over America, and perhaps that legal entitlement they enjoy has resulted in a society where women are required to do nothing in life, and have motivation only to do exactly that.
Someone needs to erase and rewind the feminist era that robbed so many women of a chance for long lasting love
244 freak
I enjoyed your comments, and yes, men will fuck sheep but only the good looking ones. It’s probably true that more men over 30 (not 50) drool over me, but I was not ASKING for a compliment from my friend at all. I had a man tell me that I “turn heads” when taking walks through my neighborhood. It’s not such a big deal, as you stated for an attractive or semi-attractive woman to turn a man’s head, but you might want to reconsider your opinion of a person being worthless sexually because they are past 25. One day you will hopefully be well past 25 and unless you’re going to continue replacing your women because of age, you’ll be quite the pitiful dirty old man working out at the gym 24/7 on Viagra. If you’re rich enough you might be able to do that, but then again you may end up like the protagonist in Randy Newman’s song “Shame”.
http://www.sing365.com/music/lyric.nsf/Shame-lyrics-Randy-Newman/963B9BA9D866700C48256A37004AFB97
244 freak
Oh I forgot, I most assuredly DO have rich men wanting to provide for me. I’ll spare you the details, but you did say you wanted me to get back to you if that was the case.
“your opinion of a person being worthless sexually because they are past 25…”
No, please don’t deliberately obfuscate the issue. I clearly implied women become sexually worthless many times past a certain point, and it likely starts beginning at 30 for some women. Men are judged by different standards.
“Oh I forgot, I most assuredly DO have rich men wanting to provide for me. I’ll spare you the details, but you did say you wanted me to get back to you if that was the case.”
OK. Maybe you are the exception. Those rich men could get a lot better if they read Roissy’s blog and learned some game to get the younger, hotter, more nubile chicks that would earn them respect on the social totem pole from all men and women they’d meet. But, as I suggested, you could be the exception, and you might be hot for your age. I doubt most guys would want you for more than a one night MILF fuck, but who knows how hot you are. The exception proves the rule is true, and most women shouldn’t count on being the exception.
249
The blog that never stops….
You didn’t read the lyrics, did you? The song is hilarious. You really must! Past 30 now? That is much better. LOL
Consider who the quintessential alpha male is; Sean Connery. I believe he and his wife are only a few years apart in age. I would get wet for him, way before I’d get wet for Harrison Ford. Connery exudes maturity, sexuality, and confidence and probably will for years to come. Ford is beta by comparison. Connery does not NEED arm candy to continually prop up his ego or to keep his dick hard. I think he is not so shallow and childish. Compare him to Donald Trump. Trump is a joke.
Trump, Nicholson, and Hefner are all jokes. Warren Beatty is the only exception. Annette Bening is superlative.
I dunno about that Randy Newman song “Shame,” because it’s always unclear whether he’s being satirical or sincere. Anyway, only rock critics like the guy, not actual people. If it hadn’t been for Griel Marcus’ pretentious book “Mystery Train,” Newman would likely not have been remembered as anything but a one-hit wonder — if he’d kept his contratc long enough for ever that.
Here’s a much better song called “Shame” — the disco one by Evelyn “Champagne” King. Unlike Newman, who steals black American musical forms and dialect, this is the real thing:
253 DOBA
Fuck you, DOBA, I love them both and I am not a rock critic which makes you WRONG. I can’t believe sometimes how closed minded YOUNGER people are. Seriously. I love electronic music of all types. Many of my young friends hate this type, but love that type and will refuse to dance to something because it does not meet their at-the-moment perfectionist standard.
http://www.boingboing.net/2008/04/21/surgery-of-item-bein.html
If it has a good beat or makes me laugh, I’m usually there. Randy Newman is a satirist. Many a truth is spoken in jest. He’s hilarious, and you are a ……. ^_^
“Release the Kraken!” Hey!! I know where you heard that! That’s MY signature phrase!! Ya phrase stealing bastard..
sara: “On the other hand, you’re here, why? To get advice on how to get laid?”
I’m happily married and get laid whenever I want. Or she wants. I read these posts so I can feel snotty and superior. I like your comments as they give me fodder.
BTW, the gay boyfriend in the original post thought the dried up skank also “had it going on.” If, in fact, someone actually told you you “have it going on” (ie, you’re not making it up), that person is probably lying to you to make you feel good….as obviously no man has thought you worth closing the deal with.
Anyway, only rock critics like the guy, not actual people.
i actually like a fair amount of randy newman’s stuff, especially the song about cleveland’s cuyahoga river catching on fire.
it might just be his voice, which really stuck in my head when i first heard him sing as a kid. my brain retains distinctive voices almost as if it had a built-in mp3 player, although not-so-distinctive voices (such as the 95% of r&b singers who sound just like each other) seem to be filtered out.
–
256 bristlecone
I’m happily married and get laid whenever I want.
i knew some wives let their men keep mistresses. wait what?
If, in fact, someone actually told you you “have it going on” (ie, you’re not making it up), that person is probably lying to you to make you feel good….
truth.
actions >>> words.
[...] in April sucked) droll and deadpan blogfly Gannon takes home the prize with his comment on my post Overheard In DC: The real culprit is that women’s extended adolescence increases each year. Age of first [...]
256 Bristlecone
“as obviously no man has thought you worth closing the deal with.”
Obviously only the intellectually inferior even use the word, obviously. Fodder? Yes, you too.
257 J5
truth.
Well, obviously you are both idiots. I have to avoid getting laid. I’m a woman, right? How hard is it? Attacking me by saying I can’t get laid is so idiotic. I have better things to do……. It’s been fun.
Attacking me by saying I can’t get laid is so idiotic.
ok, i’ll be literal this time, because reading between the lines appears to be more difficult than it seems:
the essence of the comment is: direct statements of purported value (you got it going on, etc), are almost always insincere, manipulative, or both.
that is all.
there is obviously no inference about your abiliity to get laid, which, since you are female, is independent of your desirability (unless you’re disfigured, 300lbs, etc., which you clearly aren’t).
read for comprehension please.
Johnny, you beat me to it.
sara can get laid, but she can’t close a deal with a decent guy…she has admitted that two losers dumped her.
sara, I will spell this out for you. I’m typing slowly as you don’t read very well. You can’t find a guy who wants to be with you more than one night. This is a problem for you. Your situation will not get better, as each day bleeds a little of your market value.
Jfive and Bcone, You guys are hilarious.
Guys J and B
Here’s the thing about effective insults. The only way to really offend someone is to bring up some issue about themselves they subconsciously agree with you on, but have not consciously and fearlessly faced. Such as calling someone fat, who is obviously fat, is much more effective than calling a skinny person fat. Agreement is necessary for the insult to be felt.
Now, as far as two losers dumping me? Yes, that is true. A winner would not have dumped me in the first place. Women sometimes make the mistake of thinking if they date down, their chances of being dumped are less. Actually the opposite is true and thank God. Women, like myself, who bond from sex and know how to love unconditionally sometimes make that mistake. I did twice. Oh well, life does go on and I find it hilarious that you think that being dumped by two losers somehow makes me progressively more obsolete. It might be true if I were a statistic, but since I do have free will and a modicum of intelligence and self-love, I think I’m gonna be alright. Feel better?
J & B
Hi!!! Like you boys, I’m pretty hot shit. Case in point; the two losers are, since we broke up, collectively 50 pounds heavier, whereas I am as hot as ever, which to you boys, may not be hot enough, but such is life. The latest loser looks quite miserable though he tries very hard to hide it. Unfortunately for him I read BODY LANGUAGE like an expert. Have I mentioned that? ^_^ The first loser not only is significantly fatter, but his girlfriend has put on at least 15 pounds since they started dating. Do I feel bad about being dumped by those two losers? LOL I love seeing them go downhill. They never had it so good, now they are both settling. Bye……
haha… faggots are men that suck dick
i mean seriously, that in itself is fucking comedy GOLD
[...] In extremely rare hot face ugly body cases, it is a hot girl with some kind of bodily deformity, like a vestigial tail or a hunchback, or a moon surface of cellulite, that ruins the overall effect. For these girls, concealing clothing and advantageous body positioning are the answer, plus radical cosmetic surgery or settling for a grateful beta. [...]
Paperchaser 70-
“Being the trophy wife is okay if the guy loves you as much as you love him but the woman will always feel like she’s less.”
In my experience both direct and vicarious relationships almost always works better if the woman in some way looks up to her man, which you could call “feeling less”. Though I don’t think hot women hardly ever really feel less unless the man they’re with can attract skads more hot women than she can attract sexy, impressive men, which is rarely the case. (Now if you’re married to George Clooney …)
I don’t disagree with you that women should attend as good a college as they can though.
Any woman who thinks that there are more than a tiny handful of men who prefer really aggressive women, or away women who relate at all that way to him are seriously kidding themselves. That’s not to say alpha men want door mats, they don’t.
Roissy–
While you might be right that there is some inherently greater resistance in women to settle in their choice of husband, 1) I’m not at all sure about that and 2) in any event I think current American cultural messages massively influence the holdout choosiness that American women are displaying.
Women are endlessly told to feel “empowered” = entitled in our feminist driven culture. They haven’t remotely given up the project of creating the brave new woman, or the brave new man (who feminists want to be simultaneously very male sexy and feminist / female lead in all things important to her. Their best shot at coming up with plausible screen embodiments is basically the pretty boy, more or less.
Also, I think the really bad consequences of attractive but career driven women waiting too long are just beginning to seep into our culture’s consciousness. It has made it to popular magazines and talk shows, etc., but not to the FAR more broadly influential entertainment media.
DA 125–
“Marriage and the social mores of dating fifty years ago are probably worse than the current situation. At least in our modern world, we can check for some sexual compatibility before marriage, but back then there was nearly no recourse for a frigid wife. You got stuck with the ugly girl who came along and there was nothing that you could do about it. And god forbid you decided to opt-out and be single.”
Complete crap. As usual. More DA regurgitating of his feminist LJBF’s current situation justifying bullshit.
First of all most men fifty years ago DID sleep with their wives before they married them. She might hold out until engagement, but then she rarely did, and if she did, well he might have second thoughts. If she didn’t hold out, he’d feel more obligated, was the thinking at the time. Actually I’m just talking about middle class girls here. Lower class girls did sleep around some, as did some, maybe half, of upper class girls.
So anyway if the girl was cold in bed to him, or she wouldn’t put out once engaged, the guy would often pull the plug. Depended on him of course, but it was an option. Unless she got pregnant. Then not so much. Then he’d cheat for sure.
Chicnoir-
“Do men really believe in love at first sight?
I think its rare for a woman but for men I am not sure.”
Most men don’t, not really. Only really romantic types do, with that being a belief set much more than a personality type, but some of both.
But there is a core truth to it for most bordering on all men.
First it doesn’t apply to the case of a man seriously settling. Never does.
But men look at women and instantly know if they’re attracted. In addition to general attractiveness that all men will agree upon, there each man has his type or usually types he goes for most. I think some hints of personality in appearance and movement also figure in.
So lets say a girl one whole Roissy number higher than he almost ever has been able to get anywhere with before, lets say an 8 rather than his best case usually 7, or a 7 who is just totally his perfect kind of 7, smiles at him. Wam bam slam. Love at first sight. Well sort of. Racing hopes and desires in addition to the attraction.
I’m describing beta here of course, but probably high beta.
So then if she does eventually respond to his pursuit, and they find they really do attract each other emotionally, and she finds she really is sexually drawn to him and besides he’s a “pretty good catch”, and so they become long term or married — yeah then he’s likely to say it was “love at first sight”.
He probably wouldn’t say that in cases where he felt the exact same initial attraction but the woman then turned out to reject him (”proved to be a bitch”) or didn’t but he just didn’t like her (”proved to be a bitch”).
Sara 245–
“Agreed. Both of my brothers are so screwed up, not that I am the most well-balanced person in the world. One of my brothers is certifiably mentally ill and the other who is middle-aged has not had a girlfriend since he was 16 years old. Now he is married to my mother for all intents and purposes. Sorry, I know that is creepy.”
Very interesting, esp. in light of you’re saying in another comment a little about this how uber feminist both of your parents were and are.
Actually I think they are simply and extreme example of what feminism is doing to vast swaths of the American male population. It doesn’t work so well for the very toughest minded or most highly testosterone charged, and there’s a wimpy boy substratum that’s always there regardless, but feminism has pretty damn thoroughly emasculated a whole middle stratum younger of American men / boys seems to me.
It took me a while to really get you Sara, and you CAN be really exasperating. I have a high tolerance for /attraction to girly / flighty women but you REALLY write in circles and curly cues. I’ve come to rather like it, or rather the package. IN particular I felt long before you said it that “once a man has breached by gates he pretty much has my heart as well”.
That’s damn hot, actually.
Sara 251 –
“Consider who the quintessential alpha male is; Sean Connery. I believe he and his wife are only a few years apart in age. I would get wet for him, way before I’d get wet for Harrison Ford. Connery exudes maturity, sexuality, and confidence and probably will for years to come. Ford is beta by comparison. Connery does not NEED arm candy to continually prop up his ego or to keep his dick hard.”
I agree with you on Sean Connery.
I would bet my life savings though that he has had numerous affairs. His wife is wise enough to let him. Therefore she’s kept him. I’m not saying that’s the only reason she kept him, it couldn’t be. I am saying it was a necessary reason.
“i suspect you will do what most women in your position do — settle and then rationalize the man as a great catch.”
Dying alone is better than marrying someone whose every word fills you with exasperation, and whom you don’t really want to touch. It’s not fair to the man either, in such a situation. ”
I agree with Clio. I’d love to have a family with the right man. I man I can love, respect and accept the way he is. If that is not in the cards for me, I’d rather have no sex at all for 70 years than either have loveless sex or a loveless marriage. I would be much happier happily married than single, but I would be much happier single then I would be when settling.
There are no guarantees in life, no matter how attractive you are and how much you know about the other sex, all you can do is increase your chances. A loveless marriage brings your chances of finding true love down to about zero, loveless sex just makes you depressed and resentful if you have too much of it and while you are in that state, few decent men will be charmed anyway. Settling on a man’s qualities or settling on the quality level of the relationship (Shacking up, serial monogamy, casual sex) is simply not an option for me.
Sure, most women can and do rationalize the man as a great catch to him, her friends and the further outside world. They just don’t believe in the lies they are telling others. If a man does not have the things you NEED in a man, he is never going to be a good husband to you. It is also an incredibly hard task being a good wife to a man who is not a good husband to you. What is humanly achievable is making it look decent to the outside world but still having a bad marriage indoors.
“For the average person, having a kid is their only way to leave future generations a reminder you were ever alive, it’s the closest we can come to having a lasting legacy or achieving immortality. It’s a natural biological urge.”
This does not describe me and one in about every million people along with me, so I guess I have a pretty rare perspective. (I can’t tell you why, the reason would identify me.) Of course, my body does have the normal hormones that prompt the healthy family instinct, but knowing it is not the only way for me makes it easier to overcome my genetics.
My life will always be meaningful and happy, regardless of what is in the cards for me in terms of love and family.
I have very high values of what I think a child deserves, and unless I can offer that to a child, I would not be happy bringing a child into this world. A child deserves a good home, and the root of that is two parents who are devoted to eachother first and then together towards their children.
A child needs his parents to be a good example to him first and foremost, what parents tell a child has very little influence anyway. I can give my half of that example, but the other half must also be an example I can be proud of.
I know in my heart that I would not be happy with a man who shows his children that zoning out in front of the television every night or a man who lets himself be conned by salesmen and politicians or a man who is tired of developing and improving himself and just wants to slip into a comfortable routine and then die. I would not be able to teach my children to be the responsible, aware and life loving adults I’d want them to be without telling them to be what their father is not and castrating him in the process. If I would settle, children would not be the source of pride, fulfillment and happiness that my hormones tell me they can potentially be. And if not for the children, why settle at all?
241 sara in response to 233 z
“I was raised in a HIGHLY feminist environment. BOTH my parents would have preferred if I was a Lesbian!! I am 100% serious. They BOTH think men are the cause of everything evil in the world. My father cries when he watches Oprah and my mother does all the handyman chores in the house. They are both bleeding heart victim-worshipping liberals. No need to repeat myself I imagine, but I am not at ALL pro-feminism as it exists and agree with many of your points in that regard. I feel extremely lucky to have had a child. I wanted one and got one. Hooray! ”
A child? One? I’m very glad that you had one, but I think you just completely supported everything Z wrote in his post.
One child is becoming about the standard rate of reproduction in Western societies, which means, in other words, the future death of the West. We can sign Europe over to the Muslims right now and North America to the Mexicans, if that’ll ease the transition coming 40 years hence. Russia and Ukraine are doomed too, but at least they’re so xenophobic that they’ll be able to maintain their unique cultural characteristics.. amongst all 10 Russians remaining in Russia.
China will be a monstrosity soon due to their one child policy. Since the Chinese are aborting female babies, they are hugely skewing the demographic ratio in favor of males. Considering there are 1.4 billion Chinese now, there are going to be several hundred million pissed off adolescent and young Chinese men who can’t get laid nor find wives. Where is this aggression going to go? Into insane nationalism? Watch out, World. The Mongol Horde will be like the ice cream man in comparison to this.
As much as I don’t like Muslim treatment of women — The world will soon see cultural Darwinism at work. The culture that appreciates children and motherhood will eclipse the one that doesn’t. Feminists, enjoy living under Sharia law in Europe and enjoy wearing your burkhas. They managed to undermine the very existence and survival of the liberal, human-rights respecting countries that gave you choices in the first place.
Roissy isn’t being a jerk when he encourages young women to marry early and have children, even it seems to be a double standard. Whether subconsciously or not, every man knows that the survival of the tribe, clan, nation, or culture depends on it.
Do Svidanya iz Kieva!
Muslim families are changing too. Most of the muslim women in my country are either divorced, unhappily married, separated or (especially young women) waiting for a hard to find man. Women feel compelled to marry the man their family has chosen, but they do not feel compelled to stay with him or work on the marriage. Some marriages last no more than a few weeks. I know a Muslim girl who divorced after just a few days, she is only 22 and already bitter about men. Now most divorcees do have 2 or 3 children but those children are not that likely to value marriage and parenthoodas they grow up.
“Roissy isn’t being a jerk when he encourages young women to marry early and have children, even it seems to be a double standard.”
You have a good point there and I think Roissy is going to have a lot more power over the young men than he has over the young women. It is a shame he is using it to tell men they should avoid marriage and have casual sex with anything in a skirt. Women cannot marry if there are no husbands. So they look for a better job, buy a cat etc.
Both India and China have a shortage of women, they are the largest countries in the world populationwise. They do seem to export a lot of men, engineers mostly. Either a good deal of them will be taking wives among western women or they will mostly bring wives from their homecountries and the ratios will be even more skewed there. Or they may forbid women from leaving the country.
On a positive note, an authoritarian culture such as China is probably more likely to be able to control such a problem. In the dark ages, one in every three women died in childbirth so while most men did marry, a lot of them where not married for long. Rome had a tradition of exposing little girls, so there may have been about two men for every woman, if you counted the widowers too. Then again, Rome was an extremely militarist culture, rife with prostitution, so probably more of a negative note.
[...] culture shifts to de facto polygamy. Bitter divorcees, cougars, single moms, urban slut machines, aging yentas, used up playettes, trend whores and Samantha cliches all seeking the gossipy witty banter, [...]
this discussion is worth reopening.
It is sadly amusing, how an actual masculine man seems an anachronism to a world that embraces the two ‘human’ topics of the thread.
When I was a child, I wondered why Jeremiah Johnson lived like he did in the movie – abandoning society. I also wondered why he was so good-looking lol