I was at a cookout in Rock Creek Park where a bunch of couples were in attendance. They were all nice enough people, average age mid 20s to mid 30s, and the very Moloko Plus of SWPL sanctimony. There were three different varieties of veggie burgers on the grill, and someone had brought “cookies” made from garden herbs and bean sprouts. My boy Zeets brought 35% lean beef patties, dripping with animal juice, and I brought (along with my delightful company) 100% US Grade DEET mosquito repellent. MMmmm… chemicals.
I noticed something fascinating, and yet disturbing, at this cookout. It was the couples. Something was strange about them. The men moved and spoke with the languid mannerisms of women, and the women acted like brusque corporate executives. The informal host couple presented the most egregious example of this role reversal. The guy shuffled around with hunched shoulders, spoke in a lilting musical voice that belied the gravitas of his impressive beard stubble, and toiled over the grill with one hand on his hip and the other hand limply dangling the spatula over the flaccid flame, looking very much like a gay theater director supervising the prop placement of a grilled vegetable play.
His girlfriend was the exact opposite. She strode amongst the groups of people like a General inspecting the troops before battle, flipping her hair violently in and out of a neatly bunched ponytail, speaking in clipped staccato with clenched jaw, her eyes ablaze, her chin jutting, her arm muscles taut and sinewy. I never once noticed her wrists limply dangle; like most of the rest of the women, she comported herself with the stiffness of a cadet standing at attention.
General Grrlpower sat down with my group of friends. She monopolized the conversation. It wasn’t long before she steered the subject to hosannahs for Obama and snarky Daily Show-style jeers for his putative enemies. Zeets, who was wearing mirrored aviator glasses, forgot to check himself.
“Fuck that. Obama is putting this country in debt. We’re going straight down the toilet.”
You could’ve heard an asparagus sprig drop.
“Well, I dunno, we have to give the stimulus time to work…” General Grrlpower suddenly lost a bit of her inner strength. Her beady eyes must’ve caught a reflection of themselves in Zeets’ glasses, and she glanced uncomfortably at her feet. An Asian girl overheard the conversation and sat down next to Zeets. She was the most feminine of all the women at this cookout.
What’s going on here? It seemed to me like all the girlfriends were leading their boyfriends around by the nose, in either direct ways (“Could you take care of the grill for them?”) or in subtle ways wherein the girls would assume command of the conversations while their boyfriends would sit silently in plastic lawn chairs, hands stuffed in pockets and cradling beers like lifelines.
What I have described by this scene is nothing unusual for DC. The typical DC couple has reversed polarity. The yin has become the yang and the yang has become a jellied mush of timid circumspection. A dimensional rift right over Apple headquarters has opened and the sexes have assumed the characteristics of the other. This phenomenon mostly pertains to the upper middle and upper class sexes; the lower classes, stumbling and bumbling as they are with their own status jockeying, have aped some of the debilitating trends of their betters while simultaneously devolving ever faster toward an embrace of their worst instincts.
I have said it before: The crumbling of America — of every great empire — has at its core a retreat by men from stoic masculinity and a retreat by women from submissive femininity. All other reasons for cultural dissolution can be distilled to this essential treason against human nature.
Later, Zeets and I made fun of the guests who had brought vegetarian platters by quoting Homer (Simpson): “You don’t win friends with salad! You don’t win friends with salad!”
I won’t argue with your observations, but add that the welfare class is still matriarchal and the upper class is still patriarchal. The middle class is in flux.
So you didn’t have a young lady in tow yourself? Could have made for a nice foil to the Obamaette.
You write well.
So you didn’t have a young lady in tow yourself?
i did say i had brought along “delightful company”. no man that i know is delightful.
except maybe keith.
I picked up a Haliburton hat from the career fair at my college to wear for occasions such as this. I guess Halliburton may be a little passe now, but I could probably get a Walmart hat that would still do the trick.
I am of kind of mixed feelings on events like this myself. Is it better to say some common sense things in order to see the horror on others faces or to just sit back and enjoy the train wreck of other people’s lives.
”His girlfriend was the exact opposite. She strode amongst the groups of people like a General inspecting the troops before battle, flipping her hair violently in and out of a neatly bunched ponytail, speaking in clipped staccato with clenched jaw, her eyes ablaze, her chin jutting, her arm muscles taut and sinewy. I never once noticed her wrists limply dangle; like most of the rest of the women, she comported herself with the stiffness of a cadet standing at attention.”
Typical rhapshodic ode to ‘’strong wimmin”, of the sort usually penned by some cuckolded sub who needs his nuts paddled to acheive climax.
What you witnessed was women acting like women and the men in attendance also acting like women. Let’s not get all faggy and start pretending that the uptight, cunty, HR type fembot is in reality an amazonian virago poised to strike with ninja precision at the first sign of patriarchy.
Ben –
It’s generally best to do some of both, starting with the later, then moving to some well placed instances of the former, here and there.
Anony,
It’s also important to note that the welfare class (which is White, Black & Hispanic) is Matriarchal in the sense that all such oddities of its kind is in history, that it needs supports of one kind or another to even exist. Not so w/Patriarchy.
And at any rate, this is yet another interesting episode from the Annals of Roissy where I, as a working class Brotha cannot relate. In he hood, Men still deal w/the grill w/authority while the Womenfolk act in the manner Roissy has pined away for, and All’s Well in Black USA.
So, the question I must ask him and all others in the Grand Assembly is:
Wassup wit nominally, at least, White folk?
Please explain?
O
Feminism –much supported by the now almost bankrupt state, teaches women, against their nature, to refuse to defer to men in anything, and men to take it. It becomes a bad habit for both genders. The cure is as you suggest: halt the retreat by men from stoic masculinity; stand ground, and maybe lose the particular argument or point (see Roissy in the uselessness of voting) but regain some self-respect. For what it is worth, in terms of advancing and retreating, the woman are only advancing on abandoned, empty ground, and, for the most part, like all forward troops in such circumstances, they advance haltingly, jitteringly, feeling a bit in the wrong for being on, in many of these cases, foreign soil, wondering why the men (the enemy?) left. Is it an ambush?
for most of human history men have controlled all the overt means of power, the hard power: physical strength, material resources, freedom of movement, etc. in response women learned to use soft power as a counter.
the problem with the contemporary west is that while men are relinquishing their monopoly on hard power, women are retaining all of their soft power. role reversal doesn’t even cover the problem, because if it truly was a reversal in these couples, then men would have some means to counter.
unfortunately many men have swallowed whole the poison pill that is radical feminism while at the same time retaining their chivalric impulses, and that completely neuters them.
on the plus side, it is pretty funny to watch.
I guess Halliburton may be a little passe now, but I could probably get a Walmart hat that would still do the trick.
I hear ya, but now that WalMart has come out in favor of ObamaCare…
http://www.politicususa.com/en/walmart-healthcare
…they may finally be embraced by SWPL liberals, thus mitigating the delicious “provocation” factor that a WalMart hat might’ve previously induced.
ObamaCare would have the worst ramifications of all of the Dear Leader’s harebrained schemes. Worse than the porkulus bill, worse than the cap-&-tax enviro-fantasy legislation, worse than his lily-livered passivity re: foreign affairs. Fcuk!
”Wassup wit nominally, at least, White folk?”
We’re A-OK if you’re talking about the native working class (Yankee and redneck alike) or Slavic types and other ethnics or professional men who are heads of household.
The cuckold demographic in White society tends to be upwardly mobile DINKs.
Everyday, I kick myself for not buying a McCain or Palin tee-shirt last fall. Of course, people would think I’m some ironic DC hipster.
Your assessment of DC couples is on the mark. I’ve had discussions lately with female colleagues who have basically chided me for marrying a foreigner, who they rightly view as more feminine and passive. The implication is that I can’t handle a tough, independent American woman. It’s not that I can’t handle them….it’s that I don’t want to handle them. What’s attractive about a girl who acts like a man?
Thought that was the deal in white America too. The only problem with a woman asking a man to take over the grill isn’t one of emasculation but one of why the woman was allowed to touch the grill in the first place. Letting a woman touch a BBQ grill in the first place is the problem. That’s a no-no.
gay nerd:
Typical rhapshodic ode to ‘’strong wimmin”, of the sort usually penned by some cuckolded sub who needs his nuts paddled to acheive climax.
speaking from experience?
ob:
So, the question I must ask him and all others in the Grand Assembly is:
Wassup wit nominally, at least, White folk?
troll bait.
so what. its a group of type a, alpha females and their less than impressive boyfriends, who are probably only friends by the association of their women.. what were you doing there anyway? Didnt think that was your scene. the mere existence of some middle range testosterone men and their more masculine women doesnt mean the the opposite doesnt still exist in similar proportionis as in the past.
On the other hand I was at a bbq in Friendship heights where the men, nearly all of whom were athletic played tackle football while the women adorned in colorful sun dresses, sipped wine, watched adoringly, and in some cases tended to young children. After the game the men setup the grill and tables and grilled marinated flank steak and bbq chicken. I guess that cancels out the detrimental effect of you bbq. civilization has a chance.
Correction, I meant to ask: what is up with all those nominally at least, Middle Class White folks that they act in the manner Roissy has suggested and observed, that has left my people largely unscathed?
Comments?
O
and All’s Well in Black USA.
Well that’s going a little far, no? High crime, low income, high single motherhood, high drug use, etc., etc….
But in this one instance, you’re right that the average poor black man has been less indoctrinated in feminist ideology.
cz:
For what it is worth, in terms of advancing and retreating, the woman are only advancing on abandoned, empty ground, and, for the most part, like all forward troops in such circumstances, they advance haltingly, jitteringly, feeling a bit in the wrong for being on, in many of these cases, foreign soil, wondering why the men (the enemy?) left.
the sexual market abhors a vacuum. that is why when men abandon masculinity, women do not remain feminine — they instead adopt the partriarchal mannerisms they so dearly need from their men.
‘’speaking from experience?”
I’m not the one posting Ilsa She-Wolf fantasies, Slick.
The greater the cosmopolitan panache a city has, the gender behavior dimorphism is magnified further.
You’ll see it even in rural areas, but it’s not a sense of city pride the way it is in NYC or DC.
It’s particularly noticeable in bars where alcohol has its chance to ‘in vino veritas’ the role players; women swagger, swill and act like louts, while men are mild-mannered, bug-eyed supplicants.
Do not be lulled into thinking
swpl woman
prefers John Wayne.
They may – on the inside -
but they don’t universally choose them
joe:
Letting a woman touch a BBQ grill in the first place is the problem. That’s a no-no.
at least the dude in this case didn’t relinquish grill duty. i’ll give him that. but he wasn’t exactly manning the grill with much gusto.
”What’s attractive about a girl who acts like a man?”
Again, they’re off-putting because they act like ill-behaved women. ‘Men’ aren’t shrill, bitchy, status-obsessed harridans.
You guys have the problem backwards. Men need to get their house in order and stop acting like women.
Well, I always thought it was normal if women were the hosts. You know, if they talked a lot, if they were social. I think this is a bit extreme version of it.
But I mean, usually, you see the women chattering to each other, and then the men are off to the side, beers in hands, just talking to one another.
I don’t know.
“The crumbling of America — of every great empire — has at its core a retreat by men from stoic masculinity and a retreat by women from submissive femininity.”
Same here in Canada. Most men don’t have balls.
”Correction, I meant to ask: what is up with all those nominally at least, Middle Class White folks that they act in the manner Roissy has suggested and observed, that has left my people largely unscathed?”
Short answer:
Inadequate or non-existent cultural learning. The White middle class got soft after 1945. To much prosperity, not enough mortal threats.
“You don’t win friends with salad! You don’t win friends with salad!”
God I hope you and Zeets formed an impromptu Conga line while you were doing the dialogue!
I used to sit quiet and inwardly laugh at such displays. I no longer find them amusing and do not hesitate to boldly express blatently unfiltered politically incorrect statments. I find this route much more entertaining.
When I bring up the issue of masculinity with my female friends, they say that people should have both feminine and masculine qualities. Fine, I say, but it should be 90/10 or 80/20 at most. If we were all 50 percent masculine and 50 percent feminine, we could just fuck ourselves.
Go easy on the vegetarians. There are lots of reasons people give up meat. I used to be a vegetarian myself. As long as they’re not preachy about it, I just let them be.
Lance–
That’s it in a nutshell.
1. Reject gender equality. Repeat after me: No, I do not believe that men and women are equal. Of equal value and human worth, yes. But one naturally follows the other, naturally, and no it’s not random. History is and has been as it is for a reason. Technology has not changed this. An ideology has.
Men, unless the agree to voluntarily suppress their advantages with various kinds of discriminatory legisltation and practices against them, tend to seek and gain power over women. Men are in general and at the apex naturally leaders of women, and dominant, both physically and socially. It’s high time we recognized these things once again, and encouraged men to take their natural and rightful place, in families, in schools and in work places.
Affirmative action for women should be ended. Men doing better than women should again be celebrated and encouraged instead of regarded as reactionary. Or, reaction should be embraced.
Will it take a military coup to bring this about?
Or can persuasion work?
Let try persuasion.
gay nerd:
I’m not the one posting Ilsa She-Wolf fantasies, Slick.
sounds like your knowledge of she-wolf fantasies is quite extensive. do you fantasize a mighty she-wolf ripping your pud off with her powerful buttocks?
Vegetarians who have the sense of shame to remain in the closet about it are OK by me.
Openly vegetarian folk deserve all the derision on can heap upon them.
Seeking Alpha,
Its my studied observation that higher IQ folk, which most of us would agree tend to be White and Asian on average, also tend to have the very nasty habit of a kind of Asperger’s tunnelvision myopia that won’t even allow them to see or contemplate anything else. So, while I know this is rather difficult for my higherbrow brothers to understand, I’m gonna do it anyway:
All Black folk don’t live in the ghetto, have umpteen babies by as many mamas/daddies, or shoot each other up at cookouts or other such social events and functions.
Strange, but true.
In fact, some of the best events to attend are things like, Black family reunions, something else I notice Whites don’t tend to do very often, if at all. In Black America, its a very big deal.
And most definitely, several things my Women simply cannt do:
Touch the shopping cart, I do that.
Touch or come within 10 meters of the BBQ grill-she may approach after the criticual duties are done, ie proper preparing of the grill and food, but not before.
Sitting in my chair, she has her own designated chair. Yes, I got that from Archie Bunker.
It seems that for some strange and odd reason as Roissy suggested, nominally middle class and above Whites seem to have these gender reversal issues that I am not able to identify its source, nor am able to account for why it has for the most part bypassed Black America regardless of class -keep in mind that most African Americans are themselves at least nominally middle class at this point.
So again-wassup wit the White folks? What happened?
O
Inadequate or non-existent cultural learning. The White middle class got soft after 1945. To much prosperity, not enough mortal threats.
It’s an interesting dilemma. Obviously prosperity and security are good things and shouldn’t be thrown out hastily. Yet they undeniably have the effect of producing soft citizens. Can you have security and prosperity without complacency and decay?
Mandatory civil/military service?
Better education?
The individual effort of each citizen?
Or is it an unstoppable, cyclical force? A secure people grow weak. The weak are no longer secure. In their insecurity, they are forced to fight and become strong. Once they are strong they are secure. And so on?
Especially at a July 4 BBQ. If I go to one more BBQ where someone fires up some portobello burgers and veggie patties I’m punching someone.
Cheers to Zeets for doing what I would have done! Stomping on a devotee of the One is always fun, especially if it’s a surprise assault. I always enjoy watching the look of horror and confusion that arises when some SWPL type, male or female, thinks they’re in safe company and makes a statement of faith, only to have it thrown back in their face. It generally means that I’m not going to be scoring points with the SWPL female, but that’s an acceptable loss if they’re in thrall to the One.
As for tackle football at a picnic, you wouldn’t find me playing it. Athletics in high school and college left me with enough things to worry about as it is. In all other respects, I think I would like to have been at that barbeque.
Hand(s) on the hips can only be wrong if it’s not done in the manner that Tom Wolfe talked about in The Right Stuff—so long as it’s in the manner of the Mercury astronauts, it’s manly.
All Black folk don’t live in the ghetto, have umpteen babies by as many mamas/daddies, or shoot each other up at cookouts or other such social events and functions.
And not all of ‘da White folk’ are SWPL caricatures.
And if I had to guess whose stereotype was closer to the truth, I’d say it was mine.
”Or is it an unstoppable, cyclical force? A secure people grow weak. The weak are no longer secure. In their insecurity, they are forced to fight and become strong. Once they are strong they are secure. And so on?”
Its probably too complicated an nuanced to address in this format. I will say that its clear that the more temporally remote the frontier experience became, the greater the deterioration of large portions of White stock in the New World. The White race would be better off if we still had some Apache to fight with…
I swear there is something in the water.
All that bisphenol, and those phthalates, and estrogen. It’s fucking everyone up. I am gonna start drinking reverse-osmosis water.
My ladyfriend tries to be a bossy bitch, but I can shut her down pretty easily. It does get annoying how she questions and second-guesses me all the time, and asks for explanations. I never give em. Sometimes I yell at her, and then she’ll put on her teacher glasses and begs me to jerk off on her face as my punishment.
Its probably too complicated an nuanced to address in this format.
Oh come on. Wouldn’t you rather discuss something intelligent and mutually beneficial than act like a little kid calling Roissy names?
I will say that its clear that the more temporally remote the frontier experience became, the greater the deterioration of large portions of White stock in the New World. The White race would be better off if we still had some Apache to fight with…
That’s why I suggested some mandatory military time. For the wimpiest among us, even if they’re stuck at home doing civil service, at least they’d go through boot camp, and if more Americans were doing tours abroad that would man us up some.
@doug1:
“Men are in general and at the apex naturally leaders of women, and dominant, both physically and socially. It’s high time we recognized these things once again, and encouraged men to take their natural and rightful place, in families, in schools and in work places.”
I agree with this; however, what if there is a woman who can excell at these things, without affirmative action, without acting like a man? She should be allowed to pursue these things too.
I personally think that those best suited for the job should be working in that position. Regardless if whether they are male or female (which is why affirmative action based on gender should be ended).
There probably will be fewer women in higher positions or traditionally male-dominated fields anyway.
km-
What made you switch from quiet observation to hand grenade throwing in the presence of swpls?
Roissy –
What would have been most interesting would be if General Girlpower had shown signs of real attraction to Zeets.
However, it’s often not nearly that easy.
These DC lawyer chick types can be very bright. And filled with endless amounts of ideological argument to counter male bravado. A lot of their available argument is male crafted. The left has tons of resources and brainy wordsmiths.
The yin has become the yang and the yang has become a jellied mush of timid circumspection.
I’m rather shocked that somebody as rational as you would descend into such a philosophy that’s generally associated with the SWPL types.
what is up with all those nominally at least, Middle Class White folks that they act in the manner Roissy has suggested and observed, that has left my people largely unscathed?
The white people aren’t trying hard enough to convert the black people.
This role reversal doesn’t exist where my parents are originally from. I used to go every summer but not anymore.
The women there are feminine as can be. Floral dresses everywhere and even in day they’ll usually wear high-heels. All women there have no such thing as “short hair.” There hair reaches all the way about 2 inches above their ass. (The view is great)
The men there are just what I believe are typical men. Hard laboral workers with most of them with more than one wife.
The kids learn “game” as soon as they reach about 8 years of age. Most of it is “direct game.” Hilarious as hell. Image an 8 yr old woooeing a 20 yr old. Because of this AA when they get older is little.
The kids do this because its normal for a man. The men here in America sometimes forget that
Kind of funny.
But what’s up with the “openly vegetarian” comment???
Are you suggesting I should be a “closet vegetarian”?
LOL!
A veg or non-veg diet has nothing to do with masculinity or femininity. Many people are vegetarian due to religious/spritual/ethical beliefs. Some for health reasons… so many reasons could be there.
However, I will say this; amongst “new age” type people here in USA, there does seem to be a sort of “airy fairy” vibe around both the men and women that seems fake.
I’ll give an example; David Deida. I hear he’s crossing over into the PUA scene now but he’s been on the new age scene for a long time prior with his ideas about “sexual polarity”.
Watch his videos. The guy comes off as just another airy fairy new age dude in touch with his “feminine side”. And the women in the audience are SPELLBOUND.
I swear they use it as a ploy to get women.
And his protege Michael Jacsz. Watch HIS videos. He’s even “softer” than David Deida, and yet these two dudes are giving seminars to men on how to be MASCULINE and to women on how to be feminine (that much they do know!)
Here’s my theory: Guys who are by nature “soft” require women who are really, icky-sticky sweet, soft, uber-feminine in order for them to feel “like a man”, because they themselves are so much in touch with their feminine side.
That’s why David Deida, John Gray and Michael Jacsz are globe trotting giving seminars demanding to be seen as “masculine” and teaching women how to be even more feminine, so that they can feel “manly”.
“the sexual market abhors a vacuum. that is why when men abandon masculinity, women do not remain feminine — they instead adopt the partriarchal mannerisms they so dearly need from their men.”
That is the whole issue, its the men who have abandoned their masculine core. Its fun to criticise the strong women in this case but it has not been created by them. They are only filling the void, which is what women will always do, its what they do. I would like you to talk more about the men and why they have retreated, why they are emasculated?
@doug1:
“What would have been most interesting would be if General Girlpower had shown signs of real attraction to Zeets.”
That could have been the case.
I totally missed this:
Roissy said:
“General Grrlpower sat down with my group of friends. She monopolized the conversation.”
That’s just weird. The average person wouldn’t do that, and if someone were to join in, they should politely introduce themselves. At least, at a BBQ. (I’m not talking about pickup haha)
I don’t know, that’s just really weird of her. Taking over someone’s conversation. Not nice at all.
Mandy–
I agree Mandy.
But if there’s going to be any subtle discrimination, it should be in favor of men, rather than our being endlessly vigilant that that not be remotely, or one iota, not one scintilla, or even arguably, ever, the case. And then tilt playing fields, and school classes and all manner of social endeavors, in favor of girls doing AT LEAST AS WELL as boys. Instead, IF ANYTHING it should be the other way around.
We should accept that naturally men are going to tend to exceed and excel over women on average in many areas for the simple reason that while it helps men greatly in attracting women to do so, it doesn’t work in the other directin nearly so much (help women in attracting all around hot, to them, men), and can even hurt after a point.
But I wouldn’t start with affirmative action for men. I’d just end it for women.
(Leave affirmative action on race out of this for now. This is a plenty big enough thing to tackle on it’s own.)
Seeking Alpha,
If you noticed, I was very careful to insert the phrase “nominally, at least Middle class White folk”. You, on the other hand, made a rather sweeping generalization, which you still doggedly hang on to. You need to actually get to know more Black folks to counteract this. Like Dr. Alvin Poussaint has said, that which afflicts many Whites is a disease.
O
The men here in America sometimes forget that
I think more accurately, they weren’t taught. It’s not like some people are born with it and others aren’t. And I doubt there are all that many men who grow up in a masculine household but decide to choose the SWPL lifestyle.
@collegeboy:
“The kids learn “game” as soon as they reach about 8 years of age. Most of it is “direct game.” Hilarious as hell. Image an 8 yr old woooeing a 20 yr old. Because of this AA when they get older is little.
The kids do this because its normal for a man. The men here in America sometimes forget that”
Wow, that sounds like my cousin, haha!
Where are your parents from? I remember you saying you were Hispanic.
Anglo American men are so different. They’ll stare at women, but they won’t say anything. Then they get angry when she doesn’t make the first move. (THIS IS JUST A GENERALIZATION, I KNOW NOT ALL MEN ARE LIKE THIS).
It’s completely different.
Hispanic men are usually not afraid of saying things to women.
”That’s why I suggested some mandatory military time. For the wimpiest among us, even if they’re stuck at home doing civil service, at least they’d go through boot camp, and if more Americans were doing tours abroad that would man us up some.”
Depends on what role the military plays in national life. Again, its complicated. Wilsonians made an effort to render warfare ”illegal” in 1919 – a generation later, Nuremberg declared warfare to be illegitimate as an instrument of national policy. Of course, America throws its weight around with impunity, but it does so under the auspices of liberalistic universalism/’liberation”.
I don’t know how beneficial it would be to our national culture if young men were pressed into service to kill people abroad who resist cosmopolitan living, feminism, atheism, and socialist democracy. Seems like they’d end up just as indoctrinated as SWPL, with the added menace of them being inculcated with killer instinct in the service of a regime that (for decades now) is abhorrent.
In other words, military service ‘makes men’ only when its framed in a strong and enduring cultural and moral orientation – America isn’t Prussia, never has been. That is both good and bad.
then do an “interpretive dance” to properly convey
your
message
If you noticed, I was very careful to insert the phrase “nominally, at least Middle class White folk”.
And not all ‘Middle class White folk’ are SWPL caricatures. It’s 30% of the population of the ten biggest cities.
You weren’t trying to be nuanced. You were trying to be controversial in hopes that someone could respond the way I did because this is your favorite conversation. Roissy was absolutely right that it was troll bait.
I never made any generalizations about black people. I never said ‘all black people are this way’. But on average, black people are afflicted by the problems I mentioned at far higher rates than white people – which is why saying “All’s Well in Black USA” is a pretty ignorant comment on your part.
Graham Phoenix –
No.
Well yes. BUT men have done so because they’ve been ideologically lead to do so, by embracing entire and complete equality of women as their and societies legitimate goal, with all kinds of social manipulationg and affirmative action in the broadest senses of that phrase, to socially engineer that outcome – to the point where there’s something wrong if half of American CEO’s aren’t women, and half of our Senators, and our next President, and so on.
Instead men to go as far as I have in what I’ve said on this thread, above.
Ideas matter. Ideology and belief systems matter.
fucking jazzy jeezus
i see
another
nascent
race thread
@Doug
“Men are in general and at the apex naturally leaders of women, and dominant, both physically and socially. It’s high time we recognized these things once again, and encouraged men to take their natural and rightful place, in families, in schools and in work places…Will it take a military coup to bring this about? Or can persuasion work?
Let try persuasion.”
You know my position on this (total agreement). How do we begin to persuade? Blogs like this are preaching to the choir in many respects, which is not to diminish the importance of having this place to voice thoughts. Do we readers take what we have learned (or already know) to our real lives? Are men manning-up? Are women acting more feminine? I hope so. As positive as those changes would be they would be incremental at best. Legislation changes are far bigger persuaders and I don’t know if we can get the power/elite to see it our way. It takes a united movement and it needs some powerful backers – who would they be?
Perhaps it will simply be the women who grow tired of the ‘fight’ for equality. JJ from Feminist Philosophers visited a thread yesterday and says young women are hostile about feminism. That’s hopeful news. Unfortunately she had to leave early, I think a rational discussion regarding her views and our views would have been very interesting. Maybe she’ll drop by again. The site had linked here and they were told to stop by and play nice.
Wouldn’t be terrific to have an open discussion with women who probably remain very unaware of the disastrous consequences the movement has made for men? Could we be persuasive? Let’s hope so.
”Roissy was absolutely right that it was troll bait.”
It isn’t ‘troll bait’ – one thing Blacks have going for them (if anything) is that they speak frankly. Even if you hate niggers, you must give them their due on this point; they call it how they see it, as polite fictions don’t feature in their social milieu.
The colored fella is correct when he notes that the White middle class is irreparably fucked up. Were it not, we wouldn’t be having this conversation.
@ Thomas
I don’t know how beneficial it would be to our national culture if young men were pressed into service to kill people abroad who resist cosmopolitan living, feminism, atheism, and socialist democracy. Seems like they’d end up just as indoctrinated as SWPL, with the added menace of them being inculcated with killer instinct in the service of a regime that (for decades now) is abhorrent.
In other words, military service ‘makes men’ only when its framed in a strong and enduring cultural and moral orientation – America isn’t Prussia, never has been. That is both good and bad.
So you think the average military guy is an indoctrinated SWPL? That doesn’t sound right to me.
The counter would be to say that it is selection bias. The military doesn’t ‘make men’, but males who are already ‘men’ are the only ones who would join a volunteer army.
Which is right? Can the challenge and discipline of the armed forces turn a beta boy into an alpha man? I think it has some effect but who knows.
Just curious, how did you come up with this figure? And do you mean 30% of the white population of the 10 biggest cities or 30% of the white population of all America?
Obsidian – im a black male myself and im sure you can chime in on this , but the reality is that this role reversal IS in fact happening in the black community , it just is happening slower and on a much lower scale . notice this new skinny jean, scarf wearing, colorful clothing trend that has arisen over the last year or two. culturally, the black community is in fact matriarchal, which by definition is connected with a role reversal
They fight and become strong or are crushed by the stronger race that takes their women and displaces them genetically, culturally, and politically.
Oh yes it does. Male vegetarian = dickless pussy beta, guaranteed, no exceptions, not least because he’s probably doing it at the behest of some female.
Once again, I’m having a really hard time understanding what the issue is here. Okay, there’s a bunch of yuppie-dudes getting in touch with their feminine side. Got that, and yes of course it’s funny and kind of sad, but making it more than that is just really paranoid.
Everyone has a choice whether or not to buy into what everyone else is doing or what society wants/expects from you. You either buy into it (and become a yuppie) or you don’t.
I guess what I’m saying is that I really don’t see what about this situation seems to be inciting actual anger in Roissy and some of the posters here. It would be like if I got physically “angry” and worried every time I saw a butch lesbian wearing a flannel…..or a really manly type of guy with a submissive wife and 10 kids.
I just don’t see what the anger and paranoia is all about. If these dumb asses want to live like chicks, so what? It’s funny, but not some serious matter of women overthrowing the world….I mean, life isn’t fair….either join the pack or go your own way, but why have anger and hatred about it?
Just curious, how did you come up with this figure? And do you mean 30% of the white population of the 10 biggest cities or 30% of the white population of all America?
It was completely off the top of my head (or out of my ass). I meant 30% of the white population of the 10 biggest cities. I have no idea if it’s right or not, but I think my broader point – that it’s a small portion of men, no more than 1 in 5 – is correct.
Mandy –
I’m Anglo (in the broader sense you mean) and neither am I. So is Roissy, more or less.
The difference is the macho culture versus the chivalrous one, or UK derrived version of that. Feminism has expanded the most male self limiting and self checking aspects of that.
”So you think the average military guy is an indoctrinated SWPL? That doesn’t sound right to me.”
No, I don’t think he is. In the combat arms, he’s a tough White kid who has proper masculine instincts. Unfortunately, those instincts are being exploited by people who think he is an obsolete throwback who is best used as cannon fodder in superfluous misadventures overseas.
The point is that he’s dying for people who fear and loathe what he ‘is’ while imposing their vision of utopia in the Near East by force of arms. Seems like a shit deal.
Try this for an alternate take. The cookout I went to was cooked manly enough by the host, assisted by me. No limp wrists. The girls retired indoors to gossip. However, these PR girls and Hill staffers were, for about 50% of the group associated through the hostess, wife of the host. The host was alpha/social enough to have as many friends as his super-charismatic PR-gal wife.
On the other hand, at your BBQ, the hostess was probably the central thread to about 80-90% of the guests. This could lead to dispirited men having no one to really play with. Chris Rock had a routine about that, women realize their men need play dates, as their women introduce them and pawn them off, “you guys like sports, right?” As the lead alpha-female, all your hostess’s friends would normally cue off of her while the men would be sort of left to their own limited social devices.
That must be why black men who speak frankly about black failings, like Bill Cosby, are excoriated by other blacks…
“All our problems come from whitey’s racism” is definitely a fiction, though I wouldn’t call it a polite one.
Tarl, you’ll have to speak from your own cultural viewpoint and not for everyone. In my culture, we are vegetarians by default. It has nothing to do with masculinity or feminity.
Even now, around 50% of India is vegetarian.
People may disagree with me but I feel this is way too small a figure. I can’t speak for the rest of America but in the big cities I think its creeping up to 60% at least.
Unfortunately, those instincts are being exploited by people who think he is an obsolete throwback who is best used as cannon fodder in superfluous misadventures overseas.
Is that what you think George Bush thought? That our soldiers
were obsolete throwbacks best used as cannon fodder? Where the wars were right or wrong, I doubt George Bush held the soldiers in contempt.
The point is that he’s dying for people who fear and loathe what he ‘is’ while imposing their vision of utopia in the Near East by force of arms. Seems like a shit deal.
I wouldn’t feel so bad for them. They make the choice freely and very few of them die.
But whether or not it’s a shit deal, the question was whether or not they gain masculinity out of the experience? I think you’re trying to force this conversation down preconceived ideological talking points rather than letting it flow naturally
”That must be why black men who speak frankly about black failings, like Bill Cosby, are excoriated by other blacks”
Apples and oranges. Nobody is claiming Blacks aren’t constitutionally fucked up – the point is that you wouldn’t hear a bunch of Negroes convincing themselves and each other that they’re still men while living a SWPL lifestyle.
DC also has a lot of anti-SWPL, one third to one half of the Hill comes from traditional Southern and Western states. Grilling vegetables? Grilling veggie burgers? That is dispiriting. Even Pelosi’s LA eats meat.
Obsidian
So again-wassup wit the White folks? What happened?
Why do you even care? Niggas are more fucked up on average than White America. Whats’ up with your people?
Besides, as a racially paranoid black boy in America you should be damn glad these Whiter people/SWPL/racially castrated she-male Whities have pride of place among the middle and upper middle classes of White America.
The last thing you and your people need is excess, old fashioned masculinity breaking out all over White America.
Trust me, it aint in the best interest of you or your people.
And I think we both know why.
White Girl,
Ahimsa is dickless.
roissy, how DO you get yourself invited to this crap?
next time, bring some organic, dry-aged, grass-fed, sustainably raised rib eyes and chew with your mouth open, please.
i agree with whoever pointed out that the women are not acting “masculine” per se, just acting un-feminine and extremely cunty.
while i don’t sip white wine spritzers at a BBQ while dressed in a floral sun dress, I always make sure cleavage is tastefully displayed. Otherwise, its not a party.
Yeah, but that’s still the exception and not the norm among Angle men who aren’t blue collar, especially in comparison to Hispanic men on average. I just think it’s an inevitable part of moving up in class. The few white collar hispanic and black men I know don’t really seem to have their women in check all that well either to be honest.
”Is that what you think George Bush thought?”
Thinking probably wasn’t his strong point. I know that the names in his war cabinet read like a page out of the Tel Aviv phone book and not one of them (token goys included) ever heard a shot fired in anger when he was of conscription age.
I also recall the last 20 years or so and realize that the Beltway elite hates the military establishment – so they replaced the Al Haig types with twats like that clown who let himself be dressed down by Sen. Feinstein in the presence of witnesses.
Tazzy Bee,
Yes, I’ve noticed the socalled Black Hipsters, but they are in the distinct minority. I am sure if we went out accross Philly, my hometown, over this past weekend and took a look at the dozens of cookouts taking place, what you’re talking about could have been tallied on one hand. Trust me.
Moreover, the business about the Black community being matriarchal needs some explaining. First off, its artificially created, first thru Slavery, next thru Jim Crow and finally thru the Great Society. Given the same tools to advance as White Men, Black Men quickly assume leadership positions in the family as Doug has stated in his comments to Mandy.
In any event I am finding the current discussion of the reasons why nominally Middle class White folk are going thru this gender reversal thing. Afterall, Black folks live in this country too and again for the most part, one is not likely to see what Roissy saw this weekend. We need to be much more incisive.
Comments?
O
What about David Deida? Please don’t tell me you guys think he’s masculine and view him as some sort of “mentor”???
I hear he’s gaining ground in the PUA scene. Perhaps the new agers saw through his B.S. and he has nowhere else to go now.
Let’s see if he starts to “masculinize” his mannerisms now.
@doug1:
“I’m Anglo (in the broader sense you mean) and neither am I. So is Roissy, more or less.”
What I said was more of a generalization, and not a rule for everything.
“The difference is the macho culture versus the chivalrous one, or UK derrived version of that.”
Well, to some extent, macho culture does contain elements of chivalry.
Sure, men might say things to women, but if one man were to try to hurt one or force himself on one, her male relatives or boyfriend might just go after him, and he will really regret his actions.
” Feminism has expanded the most male self limiting and self checking aspects of that.”
Another article that annoyed me about feministing- women complaining about men whistling at them, or shouting things at them from cars.
Seriously, lighten up.
From a “white girls” perspective, although black men’s physiques appear more masculine and muscle toned than other mens (in general, there are always execeptions), their concern over their looks does come off as somewhat feminine.
Joe
People may disagree with me but I feel this is way too small a figure. I can’t speak for the rest of America but in the big cities I think its creeping up to 60% at least.
It’s really a tough thing. In NYC you have a writer at GQ or a digital strategist at an advertising agency who are super SWPL. Than you have a finance guy or an ad salesmen who eat big steak dinners, go get drunk and run cavemen game.
In DC – where I’ve never lived – I’d imagine it’s the same thing. You have some super SWPL’ers and some super steakhouse guys. And a whole bunch of people in between.
Which faction has a bigger population? Probably the largestis the big in-between who aren’t trendy enough for proper SWPL hipness and aren’t rich or masculine enough for the uber-red meat chewing crowd.
But they’re growing at an alarming rate, faster than white hipsters. Kanye, Wale, Pharrell have all been contributing to it. Especially among the 25 and younger set.
Thomas – nevermind. It sounds like you’ve got yourself firmly inside your box of preconceived ideas and you’ve locked the door behind you. Makes for a boring conversation.
Two observation:
1. How can a flame be flaccid? It’s a nice sounding phrase, but it’s kind of meaningless. You can’t make fire beta, dude.
2. The grill is the all-important focus here, as some readers have commented and roissy agreed. How a man handles his grill is the measure of his primal understanding of himself as a man.
I never realized how important this is until my brother-in-law was over for dinner when we decided to grill. While the dude is a marine, I couldn’t repress the desire to dominate the situation and keep his ass parked on the bench while I coaxed the flames into licking that bloody meat. Nothing will bring out your inner alpha like a grill, people.
So, yeah, S_A…
There is a dynamic. There are a bunch of over-educated nancy boys in DC. There are also a bunch of over-educated, high T-girls in DC. The high-T girls seem to collect the nancy boys after spending their 20’s being pawned off between the more manly guys in DC … as some would say, alphas, naturals, and guys with game.
@White Girl:
“From a “white girls” perspective, although black men’s physiques appear more masculine and muscle toned than other mens (in general, there are always execeptions), their concern over their looks does come off as somewhat feminine.”
It’s ok if they’re masculine looking, though. Everyone cares about their appearance. There’s just a difference between the scene kid with a BMI of 15, who chews gum because he’s afraid he might actually gain weight, and who wears girl jeans to make a statement, and a manly man working out and wearing wife beaters to show off his man arms.
Huge difference.
@Joe:
“But they’re growing at an alarming rate, faster than white hipsters. Kanye, Wale, Pharrell have all been contributing to it. Especially among the 25 and younger set.”
You can’t forget NewBoyz and all the other new rappers popping up on the West Coast with their “jerkin songs.”
Plaid shirts, skinny jeans, the whole lot.
yeah, Thomas sort of wooshed himself off the page with those comments. The HuffPost called,they want their crazy back.
”It sounds like you’ve got yourself firmly inside your box of preconceived ideas”
No, you’re right. A global police dept. that kills Bedoins under the auspices of ”freedom”, ”womens liberation”, atheism, and conspicuous consumption commanded by a pack of post-Tailhook political appointees who prioritize PR over the lives of the men under their command is a fantastic apparatus to confer masculine virtue on youngsters. I need to be more open minded and maybe even begin doing things like taking womens’ opinions seriously.
Haven’t black men always been more fashion conscious than white men in this country? Some might consider that a feminine trait.
”The HuffPost called,they want their crazy back.”
You nailed it. Tons of Jew criticism at HuffPost, I mean its just a simmering cauldron of political anti-semitism. Its obvious I’m a HuffPost liberal.
aoefe—
It’s a crucial beginning though. Even that didn’t really exist, in any way that attracted a lot of young men, and quite a few young women, until Roissy created Roissy’s.
I don’t thing it’s ready yet, but that’s the way to be thinking, you wonderful woman you!!
Oh yes!!
Seeking Alpha,
The reason why I didn’t even dignify Roissy’s dumbass “trol bait” comment was because, duh, he put himself out there like that for me to even bring the topic up. In other words, he opened the door on the conversation, I merely walked through. If he didn’t want to go there, he could have talked about something else.
Nor do you have any idea what I’m thinking about, w/all due respect. For example, I don’t think all Middle Class Whites are SWPLers, however, I do think its safe to say, and that some here would agree, that almost by definition they emanate from the at least nominally middle class White group, yes? I mean, we’re not talking about the Ricci family here. So, my mention of “nominally, at least, Middle class White folk” was an attempt to keep the focus on that which Roissy shined a light on in his description of a cookout he attended.
Your comments wrtBlack folk were in fct gratuitous and had really nothing to do at all w/what I was saying. Again, your lack of actual, on the ground experience w/your fellow citizens belies any presentation by you as a thoughtful and studied individual. Again, I cite Poussaint: for many White Americans, they way they view issues of Race in America is a mental disorder, a disease.
They really do need help.
At any rate, I am hopeful that we can stop the pissing contest and actually take up my direct question:
Wassp with certain Middle class White folk that they act in the manner Roissy has described? And why hasn’t this happened in Black America?
Do you have any ideas, Seeking Alpha? Think real hard before responding now.
O
Seeking Alpha,
The reason why I didn’t even dignify Roissy’s dumbass “trol bait” comment was because, duh, he put himself out there like that for me to even bring the topic up. In other words, he opened the door on the conversation, I merely walked through. If he didn’t want to go there, he could have talked about something else.
Nor do you have any idea what I’m thinking about, w/all due respect. For example, I don’t think all Middle Class Whites are SWPLers, however, I do think its safe to say, and that some here would agree, that almost by definition they emanate from the at least nominally middle class White group, yes? I mean, we’re not talking about the Ricci family here. So, my mention of “nominally, at least, Middle class White folk” was an attempt to keep the focus on that which Roissy shined a light on in his description of a cookout he attended.
Your comments wrt Black folk were in fact gratuitous and had really nothing to do at all w/what I was saying. Again, your lack of actual, on the ground experience w/your fellow citizens belies any presentation by you as a thoughtful and studied individual. Again, I cite Poussaint: for many White Americans, they way they view issues of Race in America is a mental disorder, a disease.
They really do need help.
At any rate, I am hopeful that we can stop the pissing contest and actually take up my direct question:
Wassp with certain Middle class White folk that they act in the manner Roissy has described? And why hasn’t this happened in Black America?
Do you have any ideas, Seeking Alpha? Think real hard before responding now.
O
Oh okay, this is where the disagreement is coming from I guess. To me, in NY the finance guy is still pretty SWPL too, just not as extreme a case as the GQ writer, who is “super-SWPL.” He probably watches Daily Show. Even a lot of big city Republicans come off very SWPL to me. In comparison to their super-SWPL brethren they may seem super manly due to contrast, but compared to the rest of the country theyre definitely closer to the SWPL end of the social spectrum.
At the end of the day 60% of NY State men voted Obama.
Thomas
No, you’re right. A global police dept. that kills Bedoins under the auspices of ”freedom”, ”womens liberation”, atheism, and conspicuous consumption commanded by a pack of post-Tailhook political appointees who prioritize PR over the lives of the men under their command is a fantastic apparatus to confer masculine virtue on youngsters.
You’re like a weird self-hating version of Jon Stewart. If I get really, really sarcastic, people lose track of what I’m saying and whether or not it makes sense.
The MOTIVES of the armed forces have no bearing on their success or lack thereof of making their soldiers more masculine.
That’s why you’re in a box. Not because you believe what you do, but because you’re so wrapped up in being ‘controversial’ and ‘challenging’ that you can’t see you’re arguing something completely different.
”To me, in NY the finance guy is still pretty SWPL too, just not as extreme a case as the GQ writer, who is “super-SWPL.” He probably watches Daily Show. Even a lot of big city Republicans come off very SWPL to me. In comparison to their super-SWPL brethren they may seem super manly due to contrast, but compared to the rest of the country theyre definitely closer to the SWPL end of the social spectrum. ”
Exactly. Thank you.
Mandy –
I had a feeling you might say something like that. I almost put in such an acknowledgment but got sidetracked by something at work.
You’re right of course about that. There’s a different flavor though. There’s no reluctance to display male dominance of the right kind, if it’s accepted, over women. In UK derrived version, it almost has to be invited first, rather than accepted eventually.
it’s that prison yard iron they throw around
it’s all for you
when on
parole
O
Black men are complaining left, right and center over their women being masculine, loud, controlling, etc. In fact, black women got a bad name because of all this very vocal, very visible complaining on part of black men, who say they are just responding to Black womens’ motto: “niggas ain’t shit”.
There is a gender war going on within the American community.
So much so that white women are considered “submissive” in comparison. LOL! Where they got that idea, I have NO idea.
Also, regarding BBQ, many black people I know are vegetarians. In fact, the more afro-centric a Black person is, the more likely he/she will be a vegetarian or vegan.
Seeking Alpha–
Forget that idiot Thomas, please. You’re too valuable to waste on that crap.
What do you think of what I’ve been saying on this thread, and aoefe, and Mandy?
O., you’ve had so many perceptive observations since I’ve been reading this blog that it genuinely surprises me you haven’t figured this one out yet. A certain percentage of white people, I’d say about 30-35%, feel so incredibly guilty about racism, sexism, homophobia, and patriarchy that they’ve essentially convinced themselves our culture is and always has been rotten to the core, and none of the old ways are worth saving. It’s an entirely irrational response motivated by guilt. It’s also a completely self-centered response, in the sense that a lot of these people don’t actually do anything to rectify past injustice – in a warped, perverted kind of way, the act of being disgusted by their own heritage makes them feel better about themselves. Meanwhile, they can’t run away from the fact that their heritage is as much a part of them as their own skin, and they can never get away from it. They all need therapy.
This hasn’t affected Black people so much because Black people get a free pass to express whatever negative, ugly behavior they want to. Some of the most racist, sexist, homophobic people I’ve ever met have been black people. So sexism and the traditional division of roles hasn’t been clamped down upon in the Black community like it has in the White community.
There’s your answer.
With regards to the masculinity and SWPL-ness of finance guys-it has alot to do with what part of the industry they work in. Investment bankers and analysts (particularly newbies) tend to have the most SWPL habits, mainly because they’re Excel monkey bitches with no life. The traders and salesmen tend to fit the red-meat-eating alpha portrait better.
Great comment Fabian. Spot on!
Its too bad Roosh wasn’t there so he could have read some “Slam Poetry” to the dickless swpls,
http://www.rooshv.com/
That would have given them something to talk about……..
Actually what would have been better would be for some real motorcycle-gang-thugs to set up shop nearby for a rival picnic, purposely invoke an incident, beat up the swpls (male and female), and to eat their veggie burgers right in front of them while keying their cars/busting out their windows, and insisting to the police that the herbs started it, and the thugs insist on pressing charges.
It would be even better if it was an ethnically diverse motorcycle gang so the gang members could claim racial discrimination from the herbs and moanas.
No, S_A, you’re too valuable and you should respond to what *I’ve* been saying…
*Hormoaning*??? I nominate you for best new name.
Aoefe and kalliope gave me somewhat of an epiphany the other day. This is the moment to share it.
It occurs to me that men’s rights has been a man’s club, seeing women as the enemy.
It occurs to me that masculinising women and emasculating men has been a substantial crime against women as well as men.
It occurs to me that women have been unfairly neglected, especially because they hold the key to the movement’s success.
It occurs to me that the biggest reason why extreme feminism succeeded was its support by men.
It occurs to me that the biggest reason men’s rights movements can succeed is being supported by women and the credence lent to it via the endorsement of women.
Women now have power. However, you have power over them. You have immense power over them. Crudely put, what is referred to by our amusing host as the ‘gina tingle’.
You have shown them happiness. You have shown them the joy of being feminine.
You have neglected to make them understand the reasons for this.
You have neglected to deprogram them.
You have neglected to tell them there could be more.
You have neglected to tell them what is reducing the amount of real men and real women.
Believe me, they will be angry. They will want justice and correction of the balance. They will follow your masculine lead.
Your wives, your girlfriends whom you leave hopelessly half-immersed in the zeitgeist. Deprogram them.
Recruit them.
Harness their power.
Then you may actually win.
Use feminism to WIN.
You who cry how dares a woman tread upon this ground; perhaps that is the luckiest and most significant thing that has ever happened.
Obsidian –
The reason why I didn’t even dignify Roissy’s dumbass “trol bait” comment was because, duh, he put himself out there like that for me to even bring the topic up.
Exactly what part of the above post called out for your views on race? It didn’t. You just like to play that game.
A big part of that game has to do with throwing out lines like this:
Again, your lack of actual, on the ground experience w/your fellow citizens belies any presentation by you as a thoughtful and studied individual. Again, I cite Poussaint: for many White Americans, they way they view issues of Race in America is a mental disorder, a disease.
and then contrasting it with coy, baiting comments like this:
Wassup wit nominally, at least, White folk?
Please explain?
or
Think real hard before responding now
Your answer was already provided for you by your brotha DA
The white people aren’t trying hard enough to convert the black people.
Or more accurately, they don’t care enough to convert. The role reversal of a select group of urban, middle class white Americans is the product of an intentional prostelytizing of a specific ideology. Why would they care if a bunch of poor and lower middle class minorities took it up or not, as long as the elite did?
It sounds like you’ve got yourself firmly inside your box of preconceived ideas and you’ve locked the door behind you.
How’s your processing of immigration-restriction arguments coming along?
@backdoorman
Ebay is your friend! Just search for “mccain palin 08″ scroll down find the t-shirts.
Actually I think Fabian’s answer is more accurate
How’s your processing of immigration-restriction arguments coming along?
Actually I made some pretty nuanced arguments about the subject. I said that we can agree that it has a negative cultural impact, we disagree that it has a positive economic impact, and how these two factors should be balanced is a challenging but important public policy question.
But I know you were just pulling my leg, so it’s okay.
Joe,
Please don’t believe the hype. I can show you and anyone else here far and away Brothas who look in dress and act in demeanor more like Beanie Siegel than Kanye West. Trust me.
Kanye, Pharrell, etc, at al, are a niche market in the Hip Hop world. Go out in Newark, Motown, Chitown, NYC’s different boroughs, down in the Dirty South, like St. Louis, or ATL or Memphis or Houston; head over to LA or Phoenix, and back over to B-More, Philly, Jersey City, compare and contrast, add it all up as to who you see more of in raw numbers, and holla back the results.
Oh, and as for White Girl’s question, which is a good one, I think the question is inverted; the focus should really be put on why so many White guys have such bad clothing and aesthetic tastes. Any ideas?
O
Joe
Oh okay, this is where the disagreement is coming from I guess. To me, in NY the finance guy is still pretty SWPL too, just not as extreme a case as the GQ writer, who is “super-SWPL.” He probably watches Daily Show. Even a lot of big city Republicans come off very SWPL to me. In comparison to their super-SWPL brethren they may seem super manly due to contrast, but compared to the rest of the country theyre definitely closer to the SWPL end of the social spectrum.
Well know we have to figure out what the definition is. If it’s strictly along the lines of agreeing with stuff on SWPL, the NY finance guy isn’t. If you are defining SWPL as just, in general, a cosmopolitan or urban lifestyle and attitude, then that will always be most urban guys.
And I would bet most finance guys did not vote for Obama. I sure as hell didn’t.
@ Bhetti
“It occurs to me that women have been unfairly neglected, especially because they hold the key to the movement’s success.
It occurs to me that the biggest reason why extreme feminism succeeded was its support by men.
It occurs to me that the biggest reason men’s rights movements can succeed is being supported by women and the credence lent to it via the endorsement of women.”
Yes.
Really.
SRSLY.
yeah, don’t confuse SWPL with merely being urban. It’s more of an urbanized, post-American, reflexive leftist and feminist, and perhaps unmasculine state of mind.
Doug
Absolutely right. I’m going nuts trying to respond to five different people. I wanted to the quote you were responding to yourself when you wrote this:
It’s a crucial beginning though. Even that didn’t really exist, in any way that attracted a lot of young men, and quite a few young women, until Roissy created Roissy’s.
I agree. I think it does a lot more than preach to the choir. First, it does convert some people. My attitudes have certainly changed as I’ve understand the reasons behind the advice given here. The reasoning makes sense, so I’ve accepted the advice more readily.
More importantly – and I know people will throw a hissy fit for just mentioning the name – this blog serves a similar purpose to reading Ayn Rand. It’s often too extreme – almost to the point of distastefulness – but it puts in words that gnawing sense of something amiss that you’ve always felt but never been able to verbalize. It arms you with the rhetorical tools and the conceptual framework to better analyze the world, even if you don’t come to all the same conclusions as Rand or Roissy (as few do).
damn html
where’s a paki when i need 1
this is in part because post-modernism has replaces notions of individual responsibility with ideas of collective guilt and responsibility. under the multi-cult framework white is guilty and black is victim; that’s it, end of story.
the second part of what fabian said is right on, and this is the part to which you race realists should pay attention. all this black-white/male-female reversal hasn’t amounted to a real reversal at all. black still make up an over-sized share of the underclass and women are as unhappy as ever.
if you want a change then you’re going to have to begin by promoting viable alternatives. all the bold-faced misogyny and racial cheer leading accomplishes little, if anything.
”this blog serves a similar purpose to reading Ayn Rand. ”
OK, it makes sense now. This is a Rand-ian blog. God help us.
“It occurs to me that the biggest reason men’s rights movements can succeed is being supported by women and the credence lent to it via the endorsement of women.”
LMSAO
@Doug
It’s a crucial beginning though. Even that didn’t really exist, in any way that attracted a lot of young men, and quite a few young women, until Roissy created Roissy’s.
No doubt this is valuable, no doubt at all. I’m learning every day.
In my workplace I am always looking ahead to potential future problems even when in the midst of current ones. The goal is to eliminate future conflicts by finding solutions before they even show up.
Here it’s certainly recognized as to what the current issues are, much discussion has been had on what brought about the problems, as well there have been predictions on the future fall of civilization but is there any consensus on solutions? This is not meant as a criticism. I’m truly interested in what the actual goals are (for men) and how you guys think they could be accomplished.
Side note – Cohesiveness allowed the women’s movement to start, it’s pretty fractured now but they made huge strides in the meantime.
Confession – I recognize my weaknesses in forming logical arguments it reveals itself to me when I write here, I can hear it in my head, but it’s harder for me to put down. I hope you’re getting my drift.
P.S. The PUA stuff I totally get. I think men should learn Game – it levels (or attempts) to the playing field. This pursuit is outside the questions I have above.
In the words of the Great Chef Eddie Murphy, “Now THAT’S a fire!”. Looks like we got us a nice convo goin’ here. Let’s address a few points:
Fabian-while what you say certainly seems plausible, I think it really comes down to the “clamping down of traditional roles” you spoke of wrt Black folks, that bedevils certain types of Whites. I really don’t think the “Isms” have anything to do w/it, on either side. Its about Feminism and the desire on the part of many Anglo White guys, to give in to that, which may indeed have a genetic/evolutionary basis. If so, a Taliban-like resurgence of the Masculine isn’t likely, if ever.
White Girl,
I too know Black vegetarians, but for the most part they are in the minority, and as you point out tend to orbit what my buddies call the “Insence Crowd” the Neo-Soul, Afrocentric, “snaps all around” types of Black folk who are in some ways, on the periphary of Black life as well. Most Black folk are reliable meat eaters, and dine on their fair share of hot dogs and burgers this past weekend, you can be rest assured about that.
As for the battle of the sexes in he hood, well that’s certainly nothing new, and unlike in White America, there’s very little guessing games or Cloack and Dagger crappola needing to be played-brothas call sistas bitches and ho’s in a heartbeat, and sistas say niggas aint shit to brothas all the time.
And yet, for all that arguing and fussin and fightin, in the end, the vast majority of Black Men and Women wind up together. Reminds me of that tune by Alicia Keyes, “No One”.
O
OK, it makes sense now. This is a Rand-ian blog. God help us.
Poor reading comprehension. I said it serves the same purpose. Most people here aren’t Rand-ian.
@doug
“It’s a crucial beginning though. Even that didn’t really exist, in any way that attracted a lot of young men, and quite a few young women, until Roissy created Roissy’s.”
OOops sorry, should have put your words in quotes in my reply above… jeesh.
“Tons of Jew criticism at HuffPost, I mean its just a simmering cauldron of political anti-semitism.”
Yes, it is. Except there they call them “neoconservatives” instead of Jews.
@bhetti
Oh girl you’re a brave one!
And I like it!!
White Girl – Haven’t black men always been more fashion conscious than white men in this country?
No. Blacks in America developed their fashion sense by copying White American and European styles.
Blacks brought very little fashion sense from Africa that is valued by the modern world.
And remember blacks consciously or unconsciously are desperately trying to overcome the stereotype of black as = gorilla, savage, inferior, dirty, poor, rural, etc.
Aping, so to speak, the White man’s fashion sense is one way blacks can counter these negative images. Not that most of them do anyway.
Some might consider that a feminine trait.
No doubt male homosexuals on average are more fashion obsessed than normal men.
White Girl – So much so that white women are considered “submissive” in comparison. LOL! Where they got that idea, I have NO idea.
From the actual behavior of actual White women in comparison to black females.
”Yes, it is. Except there they call them “neoconservatives” instead of Jews.”
Gotcha. Mainstream media is a bastion of anti-Semitism.
SD – Yes, it is. Except there they call them “neoconservatives” instead of Jews.
Neoconservativism was created by and for Jews.
It’s a Jewish right wing, Israeli-centric answer to the question – Is it good for the Jews?
SWPL definition? Why debate it. Just go to the website that created the term, stuffwhitepeoplelike.com. If you enjoy many of the things on that site, you are SWPL. Many NY men regardless of political affiliation are, but Obama votes especially are guilty of being SWPL.
So let’s look at voting record: 60% of NY State men voted Obama. That’s 60% of the whole state’s men, not just the city, so that includes a looooooot of red counties. Therefore if you isolate just isolated NYC, which is much more blue than the rest of the counties in the state, the percentage of men who voted Obama must be even higher than 60%, maybe approaching 80%.
It’s reasons like this I think the SWPL Men in big cities, at least NY, HAS to be over 30%. Those pro-Obama numbers are just too high.
When it comes to “masculine” and “feminine” we probably all have our own pre-conceived ideas.
For example, David Deida, who is a champion of the “sexual polarity” theory (did he come up with that or is he parroting someone else?), sets himself up as both a masculine-essence man AND an expert on these matters, yet he screams FEMININITY to me.
He strikes me as a very feminine-essence man who is trying to overcompensate in order to appear masculine.
Women dominating a conversation does not strike me as “masculine” because women are communicators. The part of our brain that deals with communication is more turned on than the same part of the brain in most men.
So what would be “masculine” about a woman dominating a conversation?
This is all very confusing to me.
@Doug1:
Well, yes, there’s a definite difference in that situation. I think, like most of you have said over and over, once dominance is established, it’s ok to behave in a chivalrous fashion. You’re not doing them *for* her to love you, you’re doing them to protect the woman who loves you.
Or maybe I’m mixed up.
@askjoe:
“*Hormoaning*??? I nominate you for best new name.”
Are you a Nirvana fan?
I’ve been to these types of affairs in DC and I fit the demographic you mentioned except that I’m a little older. I don’t dress the part though, I usually prefer a “wife beater” with a pair of cut-offs. It’s funny how the wife’s and girlfriends clutch their purses when I first enter the scene, like I’m some sort thug. Once I enter into a conversation and they realize I’m not what they thought they really warm up to me. Most of the time the men are spindly girlie men types, me on the other hand can bench press her and her girlie man. Talk about women flirting with you, get them out of site of their “girlie men” and it’s on, makes for a fun day. Deep down these DC girls want a real man.
Thomas – Gotcha. Mainstream media is a bastion of anti-Semitism.
Mainstream media is essentially a Jewish country club with a fair share of shabbos goyim in the mix.
”Mainstream media is essentially a Jewish country club with a fair share of shabbos goyim in the mix.”
Correct you are.
It’s reasons like this I think the SWPL Men in big cities, at least NY, HAS to be over 30%. Those pro-Obama numbers are just too high.
Well don’t forget female votes and minority votes. White men certainly make up less than 50% of NYC, probably less than 30%.
SWPL definition? Why debate it. Just go to the website that created the term, stuffwhitepeoplelike.com. If you enjoy many of the things on that site, you are SWPL.
Just looking at the first page…
Vespa Scooters – not finance-guy
Bob Marley – not finance-guy
Hating People Who Wear Ed Hardy – 50/50
Mad Men – def finance-guy
Moleskine Notebooks – not finance-guy
Funny/Ironic Tatoos – not finance-guy
Taking a Year Off – not finance-guy
Sea Salt – 50/50 depending on if he cooks
Ugly Sweater Parties – def not finance-guy
So there you go…
Thomas and Willard are too cute together. They need a sitcom.
You should see Willard flirt with LadyRaine on her blog. ;]
“That is the whole issue, its the men who have abandoned their masculine core. Its fun to criticise the strong women in this case but it has not been created by them. They are only filling the void, which is what women will always do, its what they do. I would like you to talk more about the men and why they have retreated, why they are emasculated?”
@Graham Phoenix –
There are a few reasons.
One is, as doug has pointed out, feminist ideology is very, very deep in the SWPL population described here by Roissy. It’s a part of the air they breathe, and they have been indoctrinated with that since college if not earlier. The ideas are ubiquitous, and they amount to a radical devaluation of men and all that is masculine. The ideology, in fact, sees masculinity as being toxic and a social pathology.
Another is that many men do not relish conflict with women. Psychologists will tell you that men and women have very different physiological responses to conflicts with each other — men tend to “flood” with angst, their heart rate soars, and they get very stressed., None of these is measured in women. The speculation is that men are wired to seek female approval, and are stressed at female disapproval, whereas women are wired to manipulate men by means of that. So when women changed the tune of the song in terms of what they were demanding, many men simply complied, to avoid stressful conflict with women. When women are demanding emasculated men, which General Grrlpower types do, then men will do what is asked of them.
Yet another is the pervasive continuation of chivalry. Not holding open doors, but rather the general tilt that favors women and their concerns over men and their concerns. When you couple that general tilt with feminism, you get a society that is dripping with disdain for men, masculinity and anything manly.
All of this has impacted very strongly the SWPL population, because it is the SPWLs that are most heavily indoctrinated by feminism, and it is among the SWPLs that more women will demand emasculated men as *husbands*/*partners*, while preferring to *bed* unreconstructed masculine men.
O,
All vegetarians are in the minority in this country, not just the black veggies.
Most people chowed down on meat BBQ over the weekend, whether white, black, red or brown.
I don’t correlate vegetarianism with femininity because in my particular sub-culture, everyone is a vegetarian and the reasons go back centuries. Its not some sort of new age, airy fairy, feminine phenomena.
SWPL (hilarious). One of the things white people like in this country is meat! Vegetarians are a minority, but growing, thank goodness!
sad… so very sad
gotta love Zeets
–An Asian girl overheard the conversation and sat down next to Zeets. She was the most feminine of all the women at this cookout.–
So what did that Asian girl do? A number of people rag on Asians, but I will tell you that Asian women kick ass. My halfie wife is the most amazing woman in the universe. She is so incredibly loyal that she is trying to import a woman from Thailand to clean our house, cook our food and polish my cock. That is not a joke. How many other women would support their man to such a degree as to find a live-in mistress.
For all of the men out there who are full-fledged Betas, I am going to post this information one time. I suggest you treat this information like gold, because no one else is ever likely to offer such detailed advice. Don’t look this gift-horse in the mouth and don’t act like a f*cking pussy and wimp out. Most likely you are Beta because you lack testosterone. Male levels of testosterone are 25-45% lower today than in decades past, depending on the data set (and if you believe it). Chances are you know that you are not the man your grandfather was.
Here are signs of low-T:
1) you are unsure of yourself
2) you are very intelligent
3) your are a normal goofy white or Asian guy
4) you are committed to family and envision yourself with one woman
5) you are very deferential to others
6) you are basically a civil person who doesn’t want to take too much and thinks suburban life is the greatest life imaginable
Now when I use the term Low-T, I am not referring to clinical levels; my gauge is more general. If you meet the criteria above, then chances are you can advantage testosterone therapy to greatly increase your manliness. There is no need to buy your testosterone illegally. In fact, you are insane if you buy any illicit injectible drug. If you meet the criteria above, then your levels are most likely low enough to warrant therapy. Most smart white guys are in the range of 375-500, which sucks. Fortunately, anything below 500 is easy to treat at an anti-aging clinic.
I am posting my protocol, followed by my results:
Daily Routine AM:
5g Fish Oil
1 capsule cranberry concentrate (important in case estrogen increases your prostate size; you don’t want a UTI)
1 DIM Plus by Nature’s Way
Daily Routine PM:
5g Fish Oil
1 Liv 52 tablet for liver health
1 DIM Plus by Nature’s Way
25mg Zinc
Weekly Routine
100mg Testosterone Cypionate (rotating to four positions on the body to avoid scar tissue)
100 IU HCG 3x week
First three days after shots
3 additional Natures Way DIM (taken at one time around 4pm for intense horniness at 7pm)
Note: DIM is required in higher dosages on first three days after shot to metabolize estrogen which is the libido killer. I also take one additional Liv 52 with the additional DIM.
Results of Protocol Above
The 10g/day of Fish Oil was the magic addition to my protocol (3g/day was worthless). I suffer from a health condition and the fish oil has helped tremendously (although it lowers gains in gym) to relieve that condition and to skyrocket by libido (maybe by alleviating the inflammation).
Since perfecting this simple protocol I am once again an exceptionally confident man. I walk into any room and do not feel the need to bow my head. In the bedroom, I am a beast among mortals. In the past three days I have screwed my wife so hard so many times that she cannot sit comfortably. Who watches TV when there is sex to be had. Television is for wimps; making your woman beg for cum on her face four times in one day- that’s manly.
I cannot tell you how different the world is when your T-Level is around 900-1200 ng/dl vs 400 ng/dl. I have no idea what my level was prior to my illness, but it’s impossible that is was 900 – 1,200 ng/dl. The euphoria of a high T-Level (when it’s working) is amazing. Of course, the key is to get it to work for you; you can have sky high t-levels and feel like crap. It took me years to find the protocol that worked like magic.
If you want to relieve yourself of your worthless BETA existence, then consider going to PrivateMDLabs or any similar site and order a T test (do not use saliva tests). Get your blood drawn at night when your T-Level will be lowest, but when your Alpha needs are highest. If you are low, then consider T-therapy asap. In my opinion, any risks associated with testosterone therapy are complete and utter bunk compared to the benefits; however, consider your own situation first. The cost of T-therapy is as low as $50/month. Please note, however, that it may negatively affect your fertility so use the HCG to maintain testicular function or wait until you have all the kids you need.
Of course, my advice is not a substitute for your own edification or advice from a knowledgeable physician so make your own choices and live by them. I cannot stress that last point enough; first admit your BETAness, then quantify it, then decide if you want treatment. I have provided you with a protocol that enables me to always hold my head high, to be proud and to make my wife so hot that she is constantly finding new lovers for us. Of course, most you will not be so lucky to find such a woman. However, you are lucky enough to have someone spend an hour telling you the honest truth about how to cure yourself of BETA status.
Seeking Alpha,
You asked exactly what part of Roissy’s post called for me to opine in racial terms? Uh, I dont know, the apparent fact that he seemed to be among all or narly all Whites of a certain type, which he alluded to himself in the post, and which prompted me to ask the question.
Moreover, I don’t make sweeping statements about White people, in fact I try very hard to be as specific as possible, because I’m quite aware of the fact that all Whites are moonshine swilling yahoos, for example.
I stand by what I said to you and my citation of Poussaint because most Whites simply do not know Black folk in any real way in order to make thoughtful, considerate statements. In fact to see the words of some here and elsewhere from my White brothers, its enough to make one embarrassed for them. Almost.
And as for DA’s quip, lol, its as per usual, another one of his non sequiturs-Black folks have long been aware of and exposed to “White” middle class norms for decades-I just got finished telling you that most Black folk, including folk like DA ironically enough, are at least nominally middle class themselves. Yet one is highly unlikely to see in the hoods accross America, what Roissy saw this weekend at that cookout.
The question has to be: WHY?
O
Masculine core??? I see some of you must be familiar with Deida.
Do you agree with me or not that this guy is airy fairy and pansy-ish?
In fact, the women I know who are attracted to him are similarly airy fairy.
What gives?
How did he become a spokesperson and representative of “masculine core”.
@WhiteGirl:
“I don’t correlate vegetarianism with femininity because in my particular sub-culture, everyone is a vegetarian and the reasons go back centuries. Its not some sort of new age, airy fairy, feminine phenomena.”
Exactly. Certain cultures limit what you can/can’t eat, and I have a few friends that are vegetarian for those reasons.
Although, some do choose to rebuke their culture and adopt the “American way of life,” which removes the taboo of eating hamburgers.
I confess I got my name from Nirvana’s EP. My tastes in music don’t really include Nirvana anymore though.
I’ve been reading this blog for the past 1.5 years, and Obsidian never fails to try to turn a thread into some inane discussion about how the topic at hand relates to “black folk”. Kind of annoying.
“Here it’s certainly recognized as to what the current issues are, much discussion has been had on what brought about the problems, as well there have been predictions on the future fall of civilization but is there any consensus on solutions? This is not meant as a criticism. I’m truly interested in what the actual goals are (for men) and how you guys think they could be accomplished.
Side note – Cohesiveness allowed the women’s movement to start, it’s pretty fractured now but they made huge strides in the meantime. ”
@aoefe –
By far the biggest issue we have is rampant, raging disunity among men when it comes to any issue involving women. It may appear that we have some kind of basic unity here on some key issues, but among men as a whole — no way. Most men are dripping with chivalry and steeped in the culture of de facto post feminism. Not ideologues, of course, but simply accepting of the status quo, and governed by the culturally imprinted instinct to defend women against any criticism from any men. The disunity among men regarding these issues is by far the biggest issue we face, and the only way we can address it is by raising awareness.
We can’t even begin to talk about goals until more men realize that there is a problem to begin with, and we’re not there yet.
I just got finished telling you that most Black folk, including folk like DA ironically enough, are at least nominally middle class themselves
Do you really know this or are you guessing?
From a cursory look, median black income is 33k and as a nation we’re at 50k, meaning median white income is somewhere in the neighborhood of 55-60k.
It doesn’t really matter. Your reason for bringing up race was beyond thin. You just get a rise out of it. Which is great. Most of the people here like to argue. But don’t get all high and mighty when you bring up your favorite topic – White folk mojo – and then throw a fit when someone points out the short coming of your community.
anyone watching the MJ memorial
“”I’ve been reading this blog for the past 1.5 years, and Obsidian never fails to try to turn a thread into some inane discussion about how the topic at hand relates to “black folk”. Kind of annoying.”"
I’m new here but there’s at least two posters who use the word “n*gger” and appear to want to bait black posters here into an argument.
Obsidian and the other black posters are wise and polite enough to not feed these trolls. One of the trolls appears to be trying to bait me too (over a few comments i made about black men that must’ve made him feel insecure) but I’ve not bitten and he gave up.
I’ve not seen anything written by Obsidian regarding race that is inflammatory.
White Girl
While certainly he’s better than the others about using unnessecarily vulgar language, this kind of stuff is what he baits
And at any rate, this is yet another interesting episode from the Annals of Roissy where I, as a working class Brotha cannot relate. In he hood, Men still deal w/the grill w/authority while the Womenfolk act in the manner Roissy has pined away for, and All’s Well in Black USA.
So, the question I must ask him and all others in the Grand Assembly is:
Wassup wit nominally, at least, White folk?
Please explain?
It’s his style. Coyly, cattily, make the discussion about the differences between black men and white men. He was the first one to bring the topic up today, right?
In a situation like this, it’s best to remember the words of a man far wiser than the rest of us:
“If the absurdities of a conversation we happen to hear begin to annoy us, we must imagine that it is a scene in a comedy between two fools.”
- Arthur Schopenhauer
Regardless of where you may (or may not?) fall on the political fence, these are words of immense wisdom. It’ll spare you a lot of misery.
Seeking Alpha,
And since you bring it up, just what *are* my “racial views”? Do you know?
O
The 60% for NY State number I gave was just men. 60% of NYS Men were for Obama, 40% NYS men were for McCain. I wasn’t including women. That was for the whole state including all those red counties in the west and north, so I bet in the more-liberal city, there was even a higher percentage of men for Obama. Even if you take blacks into account, that’s still more than 30% of white NY’ers being SWPL. Just look at how full all the Whole Foods locations are at all times and how they keep opening more.
@WhiteGirl:
“I’ve not seen anything written by Obsidian regarding race that is inflammatory.”
Hormoaning wasn’t saying that it was inflammatory, he just said that everything he says has to do with race.
I don’t have a problem with him, he seems to have intelligent things to say.
And since you bring it up, just what *are* my “racial views”? Do you know?
I didn’t bring it up, did I? I never said you have views one way or another. Just that your racial discussions are always the same and rarely interesting or penetrating.
Zylonet (assuming you are not a spammer) — or, just start lifting weights.
DAMN.
I always thought that forums with lots of girls might be bad because, well, girls form groups and get all up in each other’s faces.
But…
Seeking_Alpha just burned Obsidian.
So…
I guess guys do it too.
The 60% for NY State number I gave was just men. 60% of NYS Men were for Obama, 40% NYS men were for McCain. I wasn’t including women. That was for the whole state including all those red counties in the west and north, so I bet in the more-liberal city, there was even a higher percentage of men for Obama. Even if you take blacks into account, that’s still more than 30% of white NY’ers being SWPL. Just look at how full all the Whole Foods locations are at all times and how they keep opening more.
Well then I guess you could be right. I still don’t think you can categorize the NYC finance guy as SWPL.
It’s just a big circle of hate here, Mandy.
Actually Roissy brought up race when he brought SWPL into the equation in this particular piece he wrote. So Obsidian is just responding to that bringing in SBPL.
Where I think Obsidian is wrong is in assuming that the gender dynamic in the African American community is what Roissy “pines” for.
When even brothers ain’t pinin’ for it, why would any other man?
I think what people are really pining for is a more asian centric type of male-female dynamic, NOT an African American one.
You mean like that draft-dodging Jew, Colin Powellstein?
White Girl – (by the way I’m confused… are you Indian, Caucasian or a mix?)
I wouldn’t really agree. SWPL is more of a culturally thing than a race thing. The ‘W’ is meant to be ironic. The site isn’t really about stuff white people like, but about stuff a specific group of liberal urban people like.
And it’s not just here. The kid starts every thread with something along the lines of ‘I can’t relate to what you wrote above. The brothas don’t have this problem Why did my white brothers have this problem. Wassup with that?”
It’s annoying, but not any worse than Peter’s GNP obsession. There’s no reason to react to it but, hey, who among us is perfect.
@nova
“We can’t even begin to talk about goals until more men realize that there is a problem to begin with, and we’re not there yet.”
Bringing this (the problem) to the attention to men is the first step then. Outside of this blog how can this be accomplished by those of you who do get it?
*aoefe says to herself – crap my project manager skills are creepin in…must work harder at being more feminine
Is everyone here purposely ignoring my comments about Deida or do you not know who he is?
Agreed. If white guys think white women aren’t submissive enough, they definitely aren’t going to want the dynamic black women bring. White women on average are more easygoing and less confrontational than black women. No one can emasculate like a black woman, with possible exception of a guidette.
“Bringing this (the problem) to the attention to men is the first step then. Outside of this blog how can this be accomplished by those of you who do get it?”
@aoefe –
Well the internet has certainly been a boon. Places like this one and other blogs, forums, and YouTube are reaching more and more men.
Another thing is to add it into the discourse in your own life, carefully. That is, don’t bring up men’s issues with your female boss (although she may be like you, she may very well not be) .. but bring them up with friends and so on. I know I slip in things into conversation with people all the time — not artificially but just with the flow of the conversation. If you can manage that, you can at least get some of the memes out there.
It’s working, slowly. Some of our memes are popping up in the MSM now, periodically. And comments left on MSM websites are often bristling with our memes. Even an unhelpful article like Reihan Salam’s article in the current Foreign Policy magazine help to raise the issue (even if the solution proposed is incorrect).
There are many ways to spread these ideas, but people need to be willing to do so.
@Mandy XD
“Seeking_Alpha just burned Obsidian.
So…
I guess guys do it too.”
First time you noticed chickie? That stuff is happenin all ’round you. Girl AND guys can get up in each other’s faces – it makes life exciting, doncha think?
@Seeking_Alpha:
“It’s just a big circle of hate here, Mandy.”
I vote we all hold hands.
And sit in a circle.
And talk about our “feelings.”
…
…
…
Actually, that would be really, really funny. And weird.
Peter’s GNP posts are more interesting than today’s discussion.
@aoefe:
“First time you noticed chickie? That stuff is happenin all ’round you. Girl AND guys can get up in each other’s faces – it makes life exciting, doncha think?”
Well, not really. I’ve heard guys talk about how their friends are this and that, and they seriously sound like girls when they do it. Then they say,”Oh man, us guys don’t have to worry about drama the way you girls do.”
Irony.
It’s just funny on here for some reason.
I don’t know why.
Maybe all the testosterone?
I don’t know.
””””””””on July 7, 2009 at 1:10 pm Backdoor Man
Everyday, I kick myself for not buying a McCain or Palin tee-shirt last fall. Of course, people would think I’m some ironic DC hipster.
Your assessment of DC couples is on the mark. I’ve had discussions lately with female colleagues who have basically chided me for marrying a foreigner, who they rightly view as more feminine and passive. The implication is that I can’t handle a tough, independent American woman. It’s not that I can’t handle them….it’s that I don’t want to handle them. What’s attractive about a girl who acts like a man?””””””””””””””””’
Oh dam Roissies post and now this is on it.
But yea men have a part too play too. Like when I went on R&R and the amazon turned into a ball busting bitch. Because the guys still treat her like gold no matter how she acts.
Seeking Alpha,
According to household incomes, Black folks in the main would be considered at least nominally middle class. But there’s more to the story, since Joe the Plumber can and often does make more than Amy the Schoolteacher-who’s middle class here? If we go solely by what one makes, the definition can get quite elastic.
That’s why, for me, the term “middle class” means a lot more than mere money. It means a complex of attitudes, behaviors, and norms, that one associates with the middle class, and which is why I mentioned DA within that context-despite his low earning job, he has decidedly middle class roots and aspirations and attitudes. And for the most part, so do most Black people in 2009. Yes, there is a sizable underclass, an urban Black core. But, thankfully, they don’t make up the bulk of Black USA. Take alook at any of Tavis Smiley’s State of the Black Union forums, and you’ll see this yourself.
And as for your statement about my need to bring up racial themes, I find it interesting that neither White Girl nor Mandy seem bothered by it, but you are-and that’s something I’d like to explore. You suggest that I’m slyly attempting to draw a comparison btw White Men and Black Men in my question, when in fact, I had no such intention in mind; I was think of both White Men AND Women, and why that same thing hasn’t happened to Black Men AND Women.
Also, the reason why I often bring up race is because I want to make it very clear that my world is not the same as Roissy’s, or PA’s, or yours. And that in order for me to maximize Game, it must meet the demands of the world in which I live. Yes, I know a great deal about White folk-far and away more than most of you know about Black folk-but I don’t feel the need to be opaque in order to participate in the discussions here. Being Black is a significant part of who and what I am, and I won’t depart from it in order to make White folks feel comfortable. If that makes you or any other White person, perhaps mostly guys, uncomfortable, then that’s too bad. America, perhaps more than any country in the history of human beings, is obsessed with race. In that regard, I am hardly unique, and often am saying a lot of things many of us-Brothas anyway-rarely say outloud around White(r) guys.
Finally, as for your assertion that I’m somehow gunshy about the foiables and real problems inherent in Black America, please. What you talk about in abstract stats and online trivia I see in flesh and blood on the regular. I am no stranger to it nor do I make any excuses for it.
What I take issue with you and so many other Whites, is that EVERY SINGLE FUCKING TIME the word “Black” comes outta your mouth, its immediately followed by the absolute worst of Black folk. Its as if you and others simply refuse to even consider the fact that Black folk DO have a nice time on the 4th of July too, you know. Or fall in love. Or learn Game in its formal sense. Or read. Or think. Its as if the whole of Black existence in America can be summed up in an American inner city. Its silly, simplistic and reductionistic, and veers off into the problematic in a way that makes one consider the very real possibility of a mental disorder. Which is again, why I cited Poussaint. You should check him out.
O
Here’s a dynamic that I find interesting.
For years we’ve heard about aging white men going to Asian countries in order to find brides (or ordering them off the internet), because of the perceived idea that Asian women are more “feminine”, “submissive” and “family oriented” than white American women.
Some of these men are still with their Asian bride and happy, while some have been used for their money and abandoned.
Now what I’m hearing is that young, white American women are increasingly becoming interested in Asian men due to their “family values”.
Maybe its a generational thing?
Seems that middle aged white American men are interested in “family values” and young white American women are too.
So then that leaves middle aged American white women and young white American guys who are into “dating”, “game” and “sleeping around”?
–Zylonet (assuming you are not a spammer) — or, just start lifting weights.–
I realized that I failed to mention something in my post, and on my return found the comment above.
First, addressing the poster above. How fucking retarded are you? How could you mistake my post for spam? Use your head. I am not selling anything. The two branded products I named, are well known for their efficacy.
As to your advice to start lifting weights – it is worthless for enhancing T into the top 1%. Tons of powerlifters are low-T BETA men. Lifting weight’s barely nudges t-levels and most people who train, overtrain so their levels are actually at risk.
Second, to address the information I failed to mention in my post. If you have low-T and think you can use game to end-around women and society, over the long-term, you are mistaken. The physiological and psychological changes that accompany very high T-levels are effortless. Game takes time and effort and once you have scored, you will be back to your wimpish, head-hanging self. Chemical transformation is necessary and it’s powers are sublime; its the difference between an Accord and an F1 car. If you are a normal Beta you cannot imagine the feeling of raw testosterone coursing through your veins. It’s better than any bullshit game you throw forward; because it’s the real deal. You have no need to back down, you have no self-doubt, you don’t have to focus your time on how to trick women, because quite frankly you have the raw energy to get it done. Testosterone is a drug; if you have ever taken coke, then you know what drugs can do. There is no comparison to game and testosterone, but I am sure they would work well together. Trying to run run game while low in T is futile when legal, affordable medical intervention/treatment is available. Treat your body like a car: transform it from an Accord into a Ferrari F1 car. Then use game to become the Micheal Schumacher of pussy.
Fortunately/unfortunately, most of you Betas are likely to run from this advice just like you run from hot women. Hopefully, you will at least acknowledge your pathetic aversion to the truth so that one day you might be man enough to suck up your reality and do something about it.
Obsidian,
These behavior patterns are learned & reinforced in college esp grad school. Historically more whites have attended college & especially more white families have attended for several generations, so it’s much more likely that they’ve been heavily exposed to this kind of indoctrination.
Make any sense?
*”Now what I’m hearing is that young, white American women are increasingly becoming interested in Asian men due to their “family values”.”*
WTF?
Obsidian:
“Moreover, the business about the Black community being matriarchal needs some explaining. First off, its artificially created, first thru Slavery, next thru Jim Crow and finally thru the Great Society.”
Um… no.
1866, immediately after the end of slavery, it was ~28%. 1915: ~15% 1963: 23% 1969: 35% 1972: 44%
Now: 70%
el chief I couldn’t post on our blog need to change to wordpress or something.
of coure should have been ‘your’
“What would have been most interesting would be if General Girlpower had shown signs of real attraction to Zeets.
However, it’s often not nearly that easy.
These DC lawyer chick types can be very bright. And filled with endless amounts of ideological argument to counter male bravado. A lot of their available argument is male crafted. The left has tons of resources and brainy wordsmiths.”
Don’t you know that women are incapable of original thought? Most of them are excellent at copying existing ideas, tweaking it and passing it on as theirs. That’s why there are no great female philosophers.
In most circumstances the Gen. Girlpower would have liked the challenge. She probably was an x jerk whore who already got it out of her system and decided to settle down with those veggie burger eating androgens. I will never respect a man that eats veggie burgers. Men didn’t climb to the top of the food chain to nibble on a carrot.
Another well written and interesting post by Roissy.
Zylonet -
Weekly Routine
100mg Testosterone Cypionate (rotating to four positions on the body to avoid scar tissue)
100 IU HCG 3x week
Is the HCG you mention the same as:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_chorionic_gonadotropin
?
Also, if you don’t mind sharing, what was your health issue?
Askjoe, most of the women I know want to marry and have kids, not play “the game”.
These are the women who are interested in Asian, particularly South Asian men. There are lots of blogs on the internet as well by young white women engaged or married to South Asian men discussing these issues.
@Obsidian:
“What I take issue with you and so many other Whites, is that EVERY SINGLE FUCKING TIME the word “Black” comes outta your mouth, its immediately followed by the absolute worst of Black folk. Its as if you and others simply refuse to even consider the fact that Black folk DO have a nice time on the 4th of July too, you know. Or fall in love. Or learn Game in its formal sense. Or read. Or think. Its as if the whole of Black existence in America can be summed up in an American inner city.”
Quoted for truth.
I went to DC last summer for a special program, and got to meet other people around my age (and older) from all different states, some from different countries. As awesome as it was, there was some minority and immigrant hate going around, and it wasn’t necessarily coming from people in the rural South, like one would imagine.
I’d like to think that these people do not represent all the views and ideas that that particular region of the United States has to offer. But I do feel a bit uncomfortable when people start using the word “Hispanic” to mean “illegal immigrant.”
So I do understand what you are saying much of the time. You remind me a lot of most of my friends, who also happen to be black/Hispanic/mixed/etc. and deal with these kinds of attitudes from certain whites.
Z, what about hair loss from all that extra T?
Testosterone is important but lots of other things are also important yet not yet measurable.
Taking extra T will always cause your own natural T production to plummet and your testicles to shrink.
@King, What a way to ruin an afternoon dealing with the enforcers of the thought police. I’ve done it, it’s boring and makes other people uncomfortable. Plus, there is zero information absorption.
Capt. Napalm,
I’m sorry you listed some percentages and years but I’m not sure I know what your trying to illustrate. Please explain? Thanks.
O
King, I guess you’ve climbed to the top of the food chain to eat the flesh of animals that has been pumped up with hormones, thereby creating cancer in your body???
Unless you are hunting the animal yourself and it is therefore chemical and hormone free, you are eating disease. (Unless of course you buy free-range organic meat but that would require you to go to one of those androgynous healthy food stores you despise so much, LOL).
Research has shown that injected animals account for lower testosterone and sperm count in males who eat their flesh and drink their milk.
Watch out!
It just cracks me up that some men won’t eat soy (cos of its link with estrogen) but will consume meat and milk of animals. They have no idea.
””””’Seeking Alpha,
if more Americans were doing tours abroad that would man us up some.””””
The beauty of foreign tours is that men realize there is a choice. Puts them in a better position.
–Is the HCG you mention the same as:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_chorionic_gonadotropin
?
Also, if you don’t mind sharing, what was your health issue?–
The Wikipedia entry references the HCG that you may elect on t-therapy. The usage is to maintain testicular fullness and fertility. My health issue was related to liver problems and massive bouts of tissue inflammation.
–Z, what about hair loss from all that extra T?–
I don’t have that problem, so it’s not a concern for me. If you are susceptible to hair loss, then you have a choice. Live like in the suck lane, or get in the fast lane. As I write this, my last shot was Thursday; my hormonal profile is optimal today. The energy and raw power and aggression coursing through my muscles, vein and groin are massive. Hairloss would be a small price to pay for such benefit. I would imagine that many a men with T-levels around 450 lose their hair. So if that’s you, and hairloss is inevitable, then why not maximize your life’s enjoyment. Moreover, you can always try propecia as the evidence is rather solid that it works.
Obsidian –
and that’s something I’d like to explore
Okay, let’s explore it. Why do you think it bothers me that your first instinct is to bring the discussion to race?
It’s not race in and of itself. It can be an interesting topic. It’s the predictability of your comments, in my opinion.
I have a very nuanced view of people of different races. I’ve been friends with all kinds of black people. Trustafarian pot-smoking rich kids. Skinny, emo middle class kids. Rapping, slinging crack-in-the-hood kids. They were all very different.
If, in talking to you, I ever bring out the stereotypes, it’s because it comes from you first. You trot out the same tired stereotypes of gender relations in white and black communities and it rarely furthers the discussion.
it’s not that black men have been less indoctrinated per se; its that the people who shove feminism down people’s throats are SWPL women (who don’t have to be white to be SWPL—see Mandy XD) and the beta men who suck up to them.
This group will shove it down the throats of white people and, to lesser degrees, other people, but will never do it to blacks, lest they “criticize an oppressed culture” and potentially anger a group of people SWPLers inherent fear.
Its the same ethos that prevents them from criticizing and causes them to laud rap, BET, Soul Plane, or anything else created by black people. Its why suddenly people are silly enough to think Tupac is an artist; no SWPL would say otherwise, lest be a racist.
I remember watching the Real World: New Orleans (long ago, people) and it showed what happened when a white person did call a black guy on pretending his shit was intelligent. They made videos to describe themselves to the audience for a TV show they all worked on, and the token black guy just got on a keyboard, sans shirt, and spazzed out, yelling out nonsense while playing.
Everyone else just nodded along, but one blond girl told him it was shit and meaningless. It was like a bomb going off—he’d never been actually criticized for making up shit by white people, and had no defense. He slunk away, defeated.
The emperor has no clothes, people.
Mandy
I answered your question / partial challenge perhaps about male leadership and how that relates to high ability women rising to positions of leadership themselves here:
http://roissy.wordpress.com/2009/07/07/role-reversal/#comment-100929
Which I’m sure you saw.
You never got back with your thoughts or reactions to that. I’d really be interested in them.
I certainly think that women doctors or scientists or engineers should rise to the positions their abilities and priorities take them, without anydefinite ceilings or strong discrimination against women.
I also don’t think it should be a social goal that women equal or exceed men at certain levels or above in all or most fields. I don’t see why that’s progress. I think the balance of priorities of the sexes is naturally different and that should be celebrated.
I also think there are extraordinary women who should be able to rise very far including maybe the top and whose talents in the world of work and invention shouldn’t be wasted.
@nova/bhetti
“There are many ways to spread these ideas, but people need to be willing to do so.”
Yes I agree totally. I bring this stuff up frequently with men and women and perhaps because I’m a woman I’m not vilified for my opinion. In fact many women and men seem to enjoy my perspectives as refreshing etc etc.
Bhetti is right in many ways, women can be very helpful in support of men, but…(big BUT) men have to lead us. Some of us have arrived with your views on our own, whether it be disatisfaction with the current situation or some other personal self-discovery, many more will need you to lead her in the right directon. Frustration with womenkind in general will not an army make. Bhetti and some others here are easy recruits for sure, but my strong guess is there are MANY more just like us.
Hey it even fits the PUA Game – just indoctrinate as well as pump and dump!! Heh heh.
–Testosterone is important but lots of other things are also important yet not yet measurable.
Taking extra T will always cause your own natural T production to plummet and your testicles to shrink.–
Your post is nonsense. Sure other things are important, but what else takes 2 minutes per week and fundamentally transforms your life?
As for shutting down your natural production – so the fuck what. Chemical testosterone is a perfect replacement; there is no difference. Moreover, you use HCG to keep your testicular size.
The things you mention in your post, are exactly what identify you as a BETA. You are worried about insignificant details and missing the main fucking mission.
“But I do feel a bit uncomfortable when people start using the word “Hispanic” to mean “illegal immigrant.”
–Don’t worry, Mandy, with you around, “hispanic” will come to mean race-baiting, Nobama-loving moron.
White girl writes:
Now what I’m hearing is that young, white American women are increasingly becoming interested in Asian men due to their “family values”.
Any hard data to back that assertion (trend stats,etc.)?
Sounds counter-intuitive to me.
Zylonet -
How long you been doing the T-therapy?
Your comment re: lower T levels as compared w/ generations prior is food for thought. I don’t know if electing to artificially add T to the body via injection is the answer for most men (it IS pretty extreme, for the most part), but it brings about the question of how much our diet affects our bodies.
first, my thoughts on the post: too sad. too true. i would have liked to read tales of how zeets/roissy humorously pushed the envelope even further. roissy, what ever happened to that audio files idea? might have been funny to capture/post some of those conversations for posterity.
@bhetti- you wise young girl you. beautiful.
@S-A/obs- obs is not a racist, and his posts, even when they touch on race, are almost always on point re game, evo-psych, social relations, whatever the topic of the day. you’re not reading carefully enough, or you’re letting your obvious disinterest in black-american themes distract you from that. today, for example, the W in SWPL was a pretty plain hook, in the abstract, for a “WTF is up with that?” question. it’s a serious question posed in a simple way, and not really about blacks at all.
@fabian/obs/nova- fabian’s excellent post is part of the answer, but only part. white guilt, and in europe post-colonial guilt, exists because of specific historical reasons to the generations currently in charge. but that kind of guilt is only one aspect of the climate of political correctness. there are a couple other aspects.
first, the poster (i forget who) who talked about the cycle of prosperity/decadence/insecurity/fall had it right. the west is in a state of advanced prosperity and decadence, so female emancipation, unnecessary and damaging in traditional societies, seems fair and harmless. no external danger, no need to preserve traditional masculine values or prerogatives. the family unit is transformed and weakened. rome at its height is a model. nova and whiskey have posted better about this.
second is, in the U.S., any issue cast in the clothing of individual rights and freedoms always triumphs. it’s in the DNA of the country, the constuitution, the legal system, the culture, the belief system. any kind of collective good, especially a traditional (= non “progressive”) one, will never be allowed to block the flow of ever-expanding individual freedoms. the freedoms sound good, and they usually are, for most people; there’s no awareness of consideration of what’s lost.
rereading this, i see it isn’t very deep or coherent. i need to think about it some more. maybe others can pick up on these ideas and expound if worthwhile.
one more point on the generational argument re feminism. the founding mothers, young turks in the 60s, are now old ladies and a little more circumspect about their historical role. (someone posted an interesting link to a recent interview with Germaine Greer in that regard.)
social revolutions, analogous to political ones, have their own rhythms and cycles. the wheel turns, couterrevolutionary forces take root, and some sort of Kantian synthesis is established. The Reagan era and subsequent GOP worldview can be accurately viewed as a the counter-counterculture: an attempt at restoring the ancien regime and putting the 60s back into the bottle. or at least pandering to those segments of the population that want that.
anti-feminism, strangely, was not included in that whole set of issues. so i think that’s a useful place to focus. how would an anti-feminism, or at least a feminist-masculist synthesis, take root politically – in a real way, not just blowing steam on a blog? in a way that anti-tax, anti-welfare, all the anti-Warren Court issues, did in the 80s?
i don’t have the answers – just posing the question. sorry, this isn’t my best post. a bit distracted today.
neocons are mostly jews, but jews are not mostly necons.
Neocons try to claim they somehow represent the interests of jews and therefore any critisim of them is antisemeitc, but it is just not true.
Some of the best critics of neocons (and the Israeli Lobby) are other jews, inluding Glenn Greenwald.
Don’t fall for claims that necons = jews. It doesn’t. I hate neocons (or their philosophy), but like many jews and other politicals views held by jews.
Also, many jews don’t like neocons either.
Obsidian- You may be right in the sense that most people don’t base their daily behavior on a consciously thought-through set of philosophical points. I’m biased toward seeing things that way because I’m one of the minority that does. And I think other more educated White people have a greater tendency to do this too, probably because we have a long tradition of doing so. If you’ve read some of my other posts from days gone by, you’ll know I’m not a big fan of using Evolutionary Psychology to explain complex human behavior. I favor the historical/contextual approach to understanding why things are the way they are. While I acknowledge people have certain drives motivated by our evolutionary past, these drives can be partially or totally controlled by our own individual choices, and by the pressures of culture. So from my perspective the statement you made about feminism, put in different terms, is this: what cultural force is causing white men in America to be more susceptible to the pressures exerted by feminism than Black men? I think it’s definitely a multitude of factors, and I stand by my assertion that one of them is the way bad behavior is excused in the Black community more than it is in the White community. That may be so because the Masters are still acting like Masters, and the Slaves are still acting like Slaves. That is, White people can’t shake the idea that they’re superior, and hold themselves to higher standards than Blacks, while Blacks can’t shake the idea they’re inferior, and hold themselves to lower standards. I think there is some real merit to this idea. Old thought habits die hard, whether you’re the plantation owner or the laborer working in the fields. I’m just taking a stab at an explanation. I don’t want to hijack this thread into a race discussion so I won’t say any more.
I will say this: when it comes to the two big issues of racial justice and feminism, I think our culture as it existed in 1960 could’ve handled either one separately without going into this downhill slide we’ve seen. It was the rapid one-two punch of both movements occurring simultaneously that has damaged our cultural self image in such a profound way. I honestly don’t know if we can ever recover from it.
Cheers.
Indian Girl claiming to be White Girl – So then that leaves middle aged American white women and young white American guys who are into “dating”, “game” and “sleeping around”?
That leaves the vast majority of middle aged White women dating and relating to middle aged White men and the vast majority of young White American guys dating and relating to young White women.
What is it you find so difficult to understand?
Mandy! The Dingbat – But I do feel a bit uncomfortable when people start using the word “Hispanic” to mean “illegal immigrant.”
Me too, I prefer the term “illegal ALIEN”.
Seeking Alpha,
You say I engage in racial stereotypes. I don’t think so, but please by all means, explain what you mean, w/examples? My question in this thread was meant to explore why certain White groups act as they do, and brought up my own as point of comparison.
Ok, your turn.
O
””””””Thomas
”So you think the average military guy is an indoctrinated SWPL? That doesn’t sound right to me.”
No, I don’t think he is. In the combat arms, he’s a tough White kid who has proper masculine instincts. Unfortunately, those instincts are being exploited by people who think he is an obsolete throwback who is best used as cannon fodder in superfluous misadventures overseas.
The point is that he’s dying for people who fear and loathe what he ‘is’ while imposing their vision of utopia in the Near East by force of arms. Seems like a shit deal.””””””””””
I don’t know thomas they get to kill babies too with artillary and 2000 pound bombs so it has its advantages for sure. Prescision strikes do not happen unless it is a man a soldier with a rifle. The man can differentiate a lot of times between kids and adults artillary and bombs can’t. Why I say if we are here to help. It should only be a man and his gun surgically killing. Or a computer controlled gun surgically killing. But yea a artillary round shot into a city is not only going to kill the “terrorist”
Now perfect war yea your gonna be trying to kill everyone so it won’t matter.
–Zylonet -
How long you been doing the T-therapy?
Your comment re: lower T levels as compared w/ generations prior is food for thought. I don’t know if electing to artificially add T to the body via injection is the answer for most men (it IS pretty extreme, for the most part), but it brings about the question of how much our diet affects our bodies.–
Five years. And it’s not extreme; you only think that way because the wimpy Doctors and politicians want you to believe that testosterone is dangerous. In fact, testosterone matched to intelligence is a gift to society for it enables men the confidence to speak up to B.S. ideas. What is infuriating is that a cheap, effective treatment is denied to so many because of the large social misinformation machine. Testosterone is key to male health. Many a depressed man has become fully normal with a simple 200mg injection. I have read and counseled with many man on that very issue.
As to why male T-levels are low, no one knows. It could be related to plastics, aerosols, non-stick pans, estrogens in the water. Trust me though; injections are nothing. Millions do it everyday for insulin or MS.
I didn’t say the black skinny jeans hipsters were the majority. What I and others have said is that they are a very fast growing subgroup of black people right now, especially in the 25 and under set. The number of skinny jeans hipster looking blacks compared to last year or even 3 months ago is dramatically increased.
In the post pubertal life cycle of most men, their T is highest when they are least dominating, that is adolescence.
You say I engage in racial stereotypes. I don’t think so, but please by all means, explain what you mean, w/examples? My question in this thread was meant to explore why certain White groups act as they do, and brought up my own as point of comparison.
For racial stereotypes – it certainly feels like you’re constantly discussing a distinction of the smooth brotha in charge of the grill and his woman versus the hen-pecked, anxious white guy. Other commenters might disagree, but it sure feels that way.
The reason I don’t like that line of reasoning is because there are people of both colors who fit those stereotypes. Even now, you said ‘why certain White groups act as they do’. Why not say ‘why certain groups act as they do’? SWPL is as foreign to me as it is to you. So why discuss ‘my brothas’ this and ‘my white brothas’ that, when we can just discuss the smooth guy versus the hen-pecked guy?
I don’t see how the race dimension adds anything.
Maurice writes:
how would an anti-feminism, or at least a feminist-masculist synthesis, take root politically ..?
Don’t know about the US but in Europe the solution is pretty obvious: open the borders to Muslims, encourage them to increase and multiply, rinse and repeat for three generations, and …
.. bingo!
Sharia law here we come.
Maybe another thread can be opened to discuss race relations, we are going far off topic here.
Regarding role reversal (the topic of the thread) and this whole “masculine core”/ “feminine core” thing, did you get this from David Deida?
Does anyone here find David Deida’s vibe to be “masculine core”? If so, how?
Also, culturally speaking, “feminine” and “masculine” will hold different meanings in different cultures. I myself am surprised to learn that eating the flesh of animals is considered “masculine” by some people here and being a vegetarian is considered “feminine”.
Regarding the person wanting data on White American Women seeking South Asian Men, I have no data. Only the real life examples in my family and friends circles as well as the blogs of happily married women on the internet.
The bottom line is that these particular women are seeking men from stable family backgrounds and family oriented cultures.
The problem with dating cultures is that with so many choices (or the illusion/hope/fantasy) of so much choice, nobody is satisfied and always feels “I could’ve gotten better”.
Women and men both who are sick of the jungle and the “game”, seek out partners who are stable and come from stable backgrounds.
White and black American family life, for the most part is ONE BIG HOT MESS.
That is why men and women both are looking to the East.
The numbers are small but increasing.
Zylonet -
Five years. And it’s not extreme; you only think that way because the wimpy Doctors and politicians want you to believe that testosterone is dangerous.
It’s extreme in the sense of injecting a drug into your body, at least for the “average” beta male citizen. Good point about insulin injections though (since that is socially acceptable).
You wouldn’t happen to have any links to studies/information of T levels based on generation would you?
””””””””’Wonka,
I never realized how important this is until my brother-in-law was over for dinner when we decided to grill. While the dude is a marine, I couldn’t repress the desire to dominate the situation and keep his ass parked on the bench while I coaxed the flames into licking that bloody meat. Nothing will bring out your inner alpha like a grill, people.”””””””’
What brings out your inner alpha is chopping down a tree then chopping that fucker into pieces in front of your woman and then lighting that shit on fire. Then watching the chicken drip the fat on the fire after you stuck a dirty stick through it and crudely laid it over the fire between two other sticks.
But yea maybe the grill comes close.
http://www.charlespoliquin.com/Supplements/testosterone.php
I have also worked very closely with endocrinologists and an anti-aging clinic; most, but not all, of the physicians acknowledge there is likely a significant decrease today from generations past.
@doug1:
“I certainly think that women doctors or scientists or engineers should rise to the positions their abilities and priorities take them, without anydefinite ceilings or strong discrimination against women.
I also don’t think it should be a social goal that women equal or exceed men at certain levels or above in all or most fields. I don’t see why that’s progress. I think the balance of priorities of the sexes is naturally different and that should be celebrated.
I also think there are extraordinary women who should be able to rise very far including maybe the top and whose talents in the world of work and invention shouldn’t be wasted.”
You’re one of the most brilliant people I’ve ever met.
Yes, this is how it should be. I always think it’s weird when people start shouting,”YEAH GIRL POWER WE’RE DOMINATING x FIELD.”
I mean, maybe that can be attributed to gender differences in some cases, but for the most part, I think it’s some sick gender war nonsense people are stirring up, and it isn’t fair to boys/men who can do just as well in that field.
Re: Obs & Seeking Alpha -
Even now, you said ‘why certain White groups act as they do’. Why not say ‘why certain groups act as they do’? SWPL is as foreign to me as it is to you. So why discuss ‘my brothas’ this and ‘my white brothas’ that, when we can just discuss the smooth guy versus the hen-pecked guy?
I don’t see how the race dimension adds anything.
This pretty much sums it up. Why add race into the mix when the main topic is about gender?
@ SA “Well then I guess you could be right. I still don’t think you can categorize the NYC finance guy as SWPL.”
I was skeptic too until I noticed the flareup of anonymous comments on Dealbreaker right around September 15th of last year. The Gordon Geckos were a slim minority.
O
The women act masculine in blue collar America as well. The redneck women are more likely to support McCain but just as mouthy and often divorced/single moms who enjoy bad moutthing the kids dad publically.
The blue collar men do skew towards more masculine than their Ivy League peers because a lot have guns and/or military service or fish. These traits seem less common in the SWPL upper mid group.
Thomas
I agree that it is not so much men acting like gossiping women but rather neglecting to act like men. They retreat and are afraid to tell it like it is for fear of losing their job or getting dued.
Maybe the full role reversal is just a big city or upper middle class phenomenom but the men I am around are not imitating women, they are just not standing for masculinity.
Seeking Alpha
In addition to wealth, and abundance of processed foods, I suspect TV helped get us here.
http://www.relax7.com/library/deity.php?PHPSESSID=3c9c799fc366f697f0b2aee05e3087fe
Willard Libby
I agree about neo-cons and the media. Criticizing Israel or allowing white gentiles any sense of cultural pride or group awareness is verbotten.
“Maybe another thread can be opened to discuss race relations”
Maybe do it on another site.
Joe,
Noted; but again, I would say that they represent at best a narrowly defined niche market that is Hip Hop. For example, name me some of the clothing labels that Black Hipsters wear? I can name you stuff like Phat Farm, South Pole, Enyce, Rocawear, Azure’ Jeans, Akademiks, State Property, Sean John, etc et al. These are easily recognizable names of clothing lines that are associated w/Hip Hop, and especially among the very same age group you mentioned.
And even on the streets, who are you more likely to hear booming out of cars-Kanye or Pharrell, or say some vintage Gangstarr or Jay-Z? To ask the question is to answer it if one actually hangs on the streets of the cities I mentioned earlier.
Now don’t get me wrong. I like both Kanye and Pharrell. But when it comes to serious street cred, I can tell you, they aint it. They may one day be, but they aint now, nor have they been in the past-if anything, they appeal more to Black Women than Black Men.
O
@lurker:
“–Don’t worry, Mandy, with you around, “hispanic” will come to mean race-baiting, Nobama-loving moron.”
Because I talk about race ALL THE TIME, and I worship Obama.
Oh yes.
Sometimes, lurker, I think you just target me because you’re 12 and think it’s funny.
@willardlibby, the living fossil:
“Mandy! The Dingbat”
It’s not my fault you’re sensitive about your age, old man.
“Me too, I prefer the term “illegal ALIEN”.”
It would be pretty cool if you were abducted by aliens.
You know, that way, no one would have to hear you talk anymore.
@ lurker:
i think you’re reaching with that real world example. david from the real world is not the living embodiment of black culture. he’s some dude who took himself way too seriously and made stupid video. i don’t know anyone who was afraid to say that. that song is still a running joke with my friends ten years later.
even dave chapelle gets the joke and had david sing that ridiculous little jingle on his show when he did the ‘mad real world’ skit.
besides all that, david’s song made for great reality tv: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lDvr7d5qZUw
I was skeptic too until I noticed the flareup of anonymous comments on Dealbreaker right around September 15th of last year. The Gordon Geckos were a slim minority.
Dealbreaker is like the Gawker of the finance world. I keep it in my Google Reader so I can stay up on finance-related news but the comments are incredibly catty. My experience from the guys I’ve met on the sell side is nothing like that.
Zylonet -
How old are you, if you don’t mind sharing?
One thing that everyone is missing here;
If women go back to not competing with men in the upper echelons of their careers and purposely keep themselves a step or two behind in order to prepare themselves for marriage and family, as well as cultivating whatever notion of “feminity” is currently in vogue right now….. what is the guarantee that they will get a “good man” who will provide for them and be faithful?
This is the conundrum. Western culture is currently not set up in a way that supports a woman in a dependent role.
Believe me, this cougar/feminazi/CEO/chew-em-up-and-spit-em-out woman is a stereotype and a minority.
Most women want love, stability and family. They want men who will stand by them through thick and thin (literally, LOL), and Western culture right now is NOT producing that type of man.
Western culture is producing PUAs and alpha wananbes rather than loyal, loving, stable providers.
So why should women not focus on career and financial independence when their is no guarantee?
Being gay is the NEWEST COOL THING!!! …
On the eve of the new Bruno movie, I lament that the comedian has missed his window to market his product effectively. Lines like this arouse hearty guffaws from my “sensible” friends, but to a majority, I’m toeing the line of political correctness.
Flaming homosexuality has become a revered sort of politico-religious platform that must not be mocked by the SWPL culture. This stance has grown in fervor exponentially since Sascha Baron Cohen created his character 8 or 10 years ago. Who would have imagined that he’d be alienated by gay sympathizers above the crunchy cons?
… so I go to the GAYEST state of all… ALABAMA!!!
I myself am surprised to learn that eating the flesh of animals is considered “masculine” by some people here and being a vegetarian is considered “feminine”.
Either you are trolling or extremely ignorant. Meat is valued as masculine achievement among all cultures, even by chimpanzees.
For example, name me some of the clothing labels that Black Hipsters wear?
I bet more kids under 25 know BBC or Bathing Ape than Azure’ Jeans or Akademiks.
No Jack, I’m not being ignorant or trolling. I grew up in a vegetarian majority part of India. This notion of veg = feminine and non-veg = masculine is not there.
Seeking Alpha,
Why do I have to mention the racial groups? Because this is supposed to be the place where “pretty lies perish” and clearly, this is an issue among certain groups of Whites, is it not?
And, why did I mention how I’ve personally seen Black Men handle the grill in comparison to the guys Roissy spoke of? Because again I’m presenting a point of comparison is all. Could I have mentioned a White working class guy? Yup. But you see, I know Black guys better, and that’s what I decided to roll with.
Again, I think this idea of being “colorblind” is silly, something to be expected of kids but not fullgrown adults in my view. And I see that as something good to learn from.
O
White Girl
First rate comment, imho. Unfortunately, there is little guarantee that a reliable nice guy will step up at the right moment to provide a girl with the Stable Home Experience. However, not so long ago, it was much more likely. There is much to think on here. One simple beginning is “Guys will be nice when nice guys get laid.”
White girl -
Western culture is producing PUAs and alpha wananbes rather than loyal, loving, stable providers.
I think the majority of men are still beta, and loyal, loving, stable providers.
The conundrum you mention is more that women don’t desire this type of man.
“Dealbreaker is like the Gawker of the finance world.”
Even the ‘Fashionista,’ per se.
My own firsthand experience was different and in line with yours. While the veil of anonymity surely brings out a response bias, the phenomenon was enough to make me cringe. Just to be clear.
Mr. M, what TYPE of woman doesn’t desire a loyal, loving and stable provider?
Sure, in the teens and twenties it appears that most Americans are into “having fun” and “sleeping around” (another reason why the USA might lose its Super Power status sooner than later),
…. but usually by the late 20s and early 30s women want to settle down with a stable partner. Am I wrong in assuming men at some point also want the same?
What I see is that both men and women are scared of being hurt here. Both are very defensive and protective of the hearts and egos. Both have trust issues.
I blame it on the culture of dating and too much (perceived) choice.
People are not raised to be married here. They are raised to be seriel daters.
“I mean, maybe that can be attributed to gender differences in some cases, but for the most part, I think it’s some sick gender war nonsense people are stirring up, and it isn’t fair to boys/men who can do just as well in that field.”
@Mandy –
Indeed. As doug said so well, there should not be artificial barriers either way, but neither should there be the assumption that something is amiss unless it is 50/50. I think it’s closer to the truth that men are generally better at some things, and women are generally better at others — even within the academy. That doesn’t mean “to the exclusion of the other sex” — it just means that we shouldn’t expect every field to be 50/50.
That’s why the current charge of the feminists about the STEM fields is so off base. It assumes that the dominance of men in these fields is due to discrimination, without really caring a whit that women dominate literature, psychology, sociology and so on. The focus should be promoting people to do well at what they are good at, not artificial parity quotas.
==================
“Most women want love, stability and family. They want men who will stand by them through thick and thin (literally, LOL), and Western culture right now is NOT producing that type of man.
Western culture is producing PUAs and alpha wananbes rather than loyal, loving, stable providers.
So why should women not focus on career and financial independence when their is no guarantee?”
@whitegirl –
The only way that changes is if the family law is put back together. It was feminism, remember, that wanted easy divorce, and we can see why — women are the ones who are divorcing their husbands 70+% of the time. If women were so serious about stability and family, this would simply not be the case.
It’s *not* the case that most of these divorces are because the husbands are philanderers or abusers or addicts. If you talk to marriage counselors, it’s because women are bored, have fallen out of love, and want to find another man, while taking the kids with them. That is the antithesis of wanting family and stability.
The memes are all over the culture now from 40 something women: marriage is boring, romance and excitement are where it’s at and so on. Sandra Tsing Loh wrote about this last month in The Atlantic about how her and her suburban SWPL friends are all bored to death with their “kitchen bitch” husbands. Cristina Nehring just published a book saying that women should eschew marriage, commitment and stability for passion, romance, ane excitement — no joke.
The problem in western culture is not that men have abandoned families and responsibility, it’s that women do not want a stable lifestyle any longer, are very restless in marriages in their 30s and 40s, are interested in pursuing other men for passion and excitement, and are initiating the lion’s share of divorces as a result — divorces they are encouraged to seek due to the wildly imbalanced family law’s tilt in favor of women who are mothers. Even when they find stable, responsible men, they get bored when their own sex drive revs up in the 30s and 40s, and divorce in large numbers.
Sorry, but pegging the current situation in the west on the behavior of men is beyond laughable.
Obsidian, once again, not denying a majority of hip-hop and hip-hop fashion is what you describe. And not denying the hipsterish hip-hop blacks are a narrow subsection. But once again, that latter group is currently the fastest growing subset and is starting to influence the rest of hip-hop. The young kids are getting faux hawks to death, wearing colorful ironic 80s wear with skinny jeans, dressing like the Cool Kids and Retro Kidz. The young kids don’t listen to vintage GangStarr.
And thanks to the influence of Kanye and others, even Jay-Z has recently been getting more hipsterish in his fashion, as you can see here:
http://frescodaily.blogspot.com/2008/10/jay-z-rocks-out-in-hipster-chic.html
“more kids under 25 know BBC or Bathing Ape than Azure’ Jeans or Akademiks”
yeah nigga
i wear a bathing ape, not air nigga
it’s like five hundred dollars for a pair nigga
what you fallin out your chair nigga?
don’t stare nigga! uhhh
””””””Aorfe,
Here it’s certainly recognized as to what the current issues are, much discussion has been had on what brought about the problems, as well there have been predictions on the future fall of civilization but is there any consensus on solutions? This is not meant as a criticism. I’m truly interested in what the actual goals are (for men) and how you guys think they could be accomplished. ”””””
Solution have china exterminate everyone who is not asian that is the solution.
White Girl just completely missed the boat on this blog if she thinks that today’s modern gal is desiring loyal, loving, stable providers.
I’m not even being snarky (well, guessing that these gals are more obese than anything else and relying on a third-world preference for said heft would be sort of snarkish) but even David Deida would have to agree that at least the modern big city career gals that are skewered on this blog are looking for beta-doormats.
Why do I have to mention the racial groups? Because this is supposed to be the place where “pretty lies perish” and clearly, this is an issue among certain groups of Whites, is it not?
And what pretty lie have you helped perish?
I’m not saying lets be colorblind, I’m saying let’s be interesting.
I mean, let’s break down what you wrote. A working class black guy can’t relate to a SWPL BBQ? Obvious. Black guys deal with the grill? Obvious. Your third point – Roissy ‘pines’ for a girl who acts ‘black’ – is counter-intuitive, but hardly interesting.
What did you really say that was interesting or helping pretty lies perish?
Anything is better than baggy jeans falling off of the ass.
the business about the Black community being matriarchal needs some explaining. First off, its artificially created, first thru Slavery, next thru Jim Crow and finally thru the Great Society
I’m not denying that slavery, Jim Crowe etc. have had their influence, but a matriarchal societal structure exists in many, many parts of Africa and has existed there for some time. Well before the slave trade.
It goes along with the low-paternal-investment strategy so common in many African tribes. There are all sorts of reasons for this, many of them morally neutral, but to suppose that the loose family structure of black American culture has been “imposed” upon them is to take a myopic view of history and the transmission of cultural norms. Alot of the dysfunction we see in American black families (high rates of illegitimacy, high criminality, excessive alcoholism, etc.) has its roots in tribal African norms. To be sure, the imposition of the welfare state in America has exacerbated the problem among American blacks (and others), but contact with the white man did not “cause” these pathologies.
As Steve Sailer has written, if one were to attempt to analyze blues or jazz music without reference to African tribal rhythms, you’d be laughed out of the room. Same goes with black family patterns.
””””””””””””’White Girl
“”I’ve been reading this blog for the past 1.5 years, and Obsidian never fails to try to turn a thread into some inane discussion about how the topic at hand relates to “black folk”. Kind of annoying.””
I’m new here but there’s at least two posters who use the word “n*gger” and appear to want to bait black posters here into an argument.
Obsidian and the other black posters are wise and polite enough to not feed these trolls. One of the trolls appears to be trying to bait me too (over a few comments i made about black men that must’ve made him feel insecure) but I’ve not bitten and he gave up.
I’ve not seen anything written by Obsidian regarding race that is inflammatory.”””””””””””””’
White girl is a super troll and one of the reasons extermination is the only way. You can’t just kill one cockroach.
Agreed. The 35-plus hip-hop set has much different musical and aesthetic tastes than the under 25. I’d add LRC, BAPE and Ice Cream to under-25 hip-hop hipster fashion too. And now Kanye’s Air Yeezy sneaks and LV brand of shoes.
And to be clear, my two favorite CDs are Full Clip and Reasonable Doubt – so I’m with Obs on my hip-hop preferences.
But the black hipster – skateboard P – is definitely on the rise.
Mr. M, what TYPE of woman doesn’t desire a loyal, loving and stable provider?
The problem is: women want it all (addition: whatever suits their emotional needs at that time).
Sure, maybe when a woman has a child and is specifically in need of a loyal loving and stable provider. So, maybe from birth till about age 5 of said child. However, like Novaseeker explains above, they will grow tired/bored/weary of a husband who is not “alpha” enough, even though he is loyal, loving, and a stable provider.
I blame it on the culture of dating and too much (perceived) choice.
People are not raised to be married here. They are raised to be seriel daters.
Agree. Its also a problem of divorce being too easy and too beneficial for the side of women.
Like i said, women want it all and with the popular media mantra, they are ENTITLED to it as well. The current level of an average woman’s expectations are through the roof.
””””’Seeking_Alpha
White Girl – (by the way I’m confused… are you Indian, Caucasian or a mix?)””””””
White girl is tood by the way he he he
‘
Hormoaning,
Black people on the whole basically suffer from congenital narcissistic personality disorder. They have no interest in anything but black people and how non-black people view black people. Any convo they initiate that’s not about them is something like the old chestnut “well, enough about me, tell me–what do YOU think about me?” They contribute nothing to the thousands year old discourse of the West (tace, Thomas Sowell)–they are exclusively parasitic on its philosophical and technological developments.
Like most people with NPD, they also show no interest in or conception of what the quieter, more reserved people around them may think of them, only insisting that the people around them reflect their inflated self image back like good little mirrors. The fact that whites loathe and despise them in direct relationship to how much contact they have with them is below their radar, having bought the line that “racism is just ignorance”.
Askjoe, if betas are loyal men who are more likely NOT to cheat on their wives, then it makes sense that family oriented women would prefer them to “alphas”.
I find it hard to believe that the majority of American women in their 30s don’t want love and stability. Yes, they want excitment and romance too, but they want it with a loyal partner. If they are bored with their husbands there are ways to put the spice back into the marriage. Countless books are written about that.
I meet men and women all the time who really just want STABILITY but are so beaten down by the system, the game, the relationship matrix that they put up defenses and act like they don’t want all that – just to cover up all the hurt inside.
When I tell people about India’s arranged marriage system, the responses have gone from shock and disdain to curiousity and awe, all within a short period of time.
People are hurting.
Men and women don’t trust each other anymore, but they want to.
What is the solution?
Carolus Reconditus:
Yes. It is better than feminism, at least for heterosexual men, and probably the only realistic alternative. The biggest critic of Muslim immigration here in Norway is Bruce Bawer, an American homosexual immigrant. He seems to be opposing Islamization mostly because he is gay. The rest of us have nothing to worry about, I think, though we should convert in time to avoid dhimmitude.
Women want it all? And what to men want – half?
Please.
Ugly men with low social skills are paying LOTS of money to learn “game” in order to pull in the most “hot” and socially fit women they can. Yet they want them to be loyal and submissive home-makers too!!!
Please don’t tell me women want it all but men don’t.
Let’s get off the race thing here!
If your an American, it don’t matter if you’re black or white – your a product of a messed up family system and that is where your insecurities lie. Bottom line.
seeking_alpha:
Fucking awesome. everyone here just seems to listen to rock/trance/techno/metal.
My two favorite hip hop c-d’s are Illmatic by Nas and Lifestylez Of The Poor And Dangerous by Big L.
–Zylonet -
How old are you, if you don’t mind sharing?–
35
Yea Illmatic is definitely up there. The only Nas CD I really like, but an obvious classic.
I had Lifestylez on my iPod but accidentally deleted all my music. I still have The Big Picture though.
We never bring luggage / we go shopping when the plane lands
If you change black to white, that kind of sounds like a race realist as well!
And still no one answered my question:
Is David Deida “masculine”?
What is he, some sort of God around here that nobody dare say anything about? Or do y’all not know who he is?
White girl -
Instead of trying to debate, go check out novaseeker’s blog. And the links he features to other blogs. Read.
That should answer most of your burning questions.
White Girl – I have never heard of him. Who is he?
**Ugly men with low social skills are paying LOTS of money to learn “game” in order to pull in the most “hot” and socially fit women they can. Yet they want them to be loyal and submissive home-makers too!!!**
Shit, most men went to college because they thought that having an upper middle class life was enough. Then they move to DC and have to compete with VK and Roissy (i.e, female voluntary hareming).
tip for the gals, put down the cupcakes, be nice to the awkward guys, get married before you hit the wall, read R’s pondering of GNC (generous, compassionate, nurturing).
I’ve only read Deida, never heard or saw him, so I have no idea if he’s feminine or not. Great writer though.
@Gunslingergregi I’ll check it out and switch over if necessary. Cheers
Seeking Alpha,
David Deida is a new ager who is currently jumping ship over to the PUA scene as some sort of “guru”.
He was the one who popularized this concept of “sexual polarity” along with terminology like “masculine core” and “feminine core”.
These terms were bantered around here so I though y’all were familiar with him.
He’s one of the most UN masculine men I have ever encountered LOL.
Definetly trying to overcompensate.
Check out his videos on youtube to see what I mean. But the women in the audience are SPELLBOUND. (they see their own “feminine core” reflected in him, I guess).
Askjoe, If girls put down their cupcakes to be nice to awkward guys will the awkward guys marry them and be faithful?
Gunslinger
“White girl is a super troll and one of the reasons extermination is the only way. You can’t just kill one cockroach.”
Did you know that female cockroaches only need to mate once in order to fertilize all of their eggs But they can hold onto them and have babies long afterwards.
What type of game would you use on a woman who could do that?
WG, glad you asked, they just might do so.
If its true that married women are becoming “bored” with their husbands and are willing to sacrifice stability for excitement, there may be a way of getting that excitement and maintaining stability.
Polyamory or polyandry (polygyny for the husbands as well, to be fair).
But not that many men or woman can deal with that. We are all too possessive and jealous.
Still, there are some couples who have that arrangement.
Zylonet -
Was doing some reading re: testosterone levels… I wouldn’t be surprised if the suggested drop in T levels is primarily caused by diet on 2 levels.
1) chemically altered food
2) obesity
I do have a question, are there any side effects you’ve noticed on your personal self? Increased anger/aggression/yelling? Can’t be all peaches and cream..!
White Girl said:
“Most women want love, stability and family. They want men who will stand by them through thick and thin (literally, LOL), and Western culture right now is NOT producing that type of man.
Western culture is producing PUAs and alpha wananbes rather than loyal, loving, stable providers.”
You’re obviously new to this blog. The vast majority of western men are exactly what you describe. They are referred to on this site as “Beta”. The problem with being beta is women don’t want beta men until they are ready to settle, which is usually when they are in their 30’s and have spent the last 10-15 years sleeping around. And when they finally settle their feelings for their beta husband are lukewarm at best.
I don’t know about you, but I don’t find other people’s leftovers very appealing.
The betas, decent men who got no play in their 20’s, usually end up either bitter and self-hating, or they try to become PUAs.
This post from craigslist sums up the idea pretty well:
http://www.craigslist.org/about/best/lax/483318927.html
Hi Arpagus, thanks for your reply. you write:
[Islam] is better than feminism, at least for heterosexual men, and probably the only realistic alternative.
It’s an interesting perspective. When will Western conservatives reach the ‘ tipping point’ and say: anything — even this Koran hocus-pocus — is preferable to the feminazi-dominated society we live in.
One can express the whole issue in value-free terms and state: Islamic societies are more adaptive in evolutionary terms than our own.
If you were a gene, where you prefer to be? In a burka-covered body, or in a bikini-uncovered one?
To ask the question is to answer it.
My main problem with muslims is their anti-alcohol hangup.
Time for another single malt …
White Girl
There are no doubt a lot of 30 something Western women who are suddenly looking for “stability”. The problem is that when they were younger and hotter they made it brutally plain that such stability turned them off sexually.
Now, they simply appear ridiculous. Their looks are evaporating, they give hints they are tired of staying in shape and tired of working full time and so now they would like to go part time and get fat with the committed support of some “lucky” stable sort of guy that she already convinced is a sexual/genetic reject in her eyes.
Kinda sad, but kinda laughable.
this thread is fine. youve been doing a stellar job going off topic all afternoon
Mr.M, I already addressed the issue of testerone levels with regards to pumped up meat and milk when someone equated meat eating with “masculinity” (what a crock!)
If one wants to be truly healthy in ALL ways, they will go as organic and natural as possible.
Get out and garden or raise your own crops, that will increase your testosterone levels in two ways.
The only reason why a man would have to increase his testosterone in artificial or extraneous ways would be because he is living a sedantery lifestyle couples with eating chemically drugged up matrix food.
American culture in a nutshell right there and one reason why I find typical “alpha” American men unattractive.
Apple? Steve Jobs is the most alpha of all tech dudes. If I had the opportunity, I wouldn’t be afraid to introduce my girl to Bill Gates or Linus Torvalds, but I would definitely be afraid of the Jobster.
White Girl -
I was speaking with a friend (female) about the affect of diet on testosterone. She posed the question to which I had no idea…. since you seem the expert, what is the related affect of the poisoned food on estrogen (or women)?
maurice–
The whole culture lead by the left but PC supported to a considerable degree except at the bleeding edge by even most respectable conservatives has been aimed at building up the confidence of everyone in America other than white (non Latino) males, and building up their actual educational and ecomomic success, in both cases often at the expense of white males. This finally seems to have had notable effects on gen Y white males and to some extent on gen X. I don’t think it did too much on the boomer generation of white males.
As part of this process it simply has not been cool in upper middle or aspiring circles for men to act too dominant towards women.
As well there is this phenomenon of competitive altruism, that feigns guilt over ancestors transgressions (which have in fact not been uniquely bad in the case of white men, they’ve only been history’s most successful people, certainly in the utterly transformative last several hundred years (with other high points as well g. Greco Roman times). The more caring you are about helping other groups, when yours is on top, the higher status you can achieve in the world of competitive altruism. Some less with it somewhat lower down actually also do internalize the paraded and trumpeted guilt, as well (the fools).
The transgressions include ones against women, by participating in the PATRIARCHY, at least through one’s ancestors and just by virtue of being a member of the white and on top male group. So white men, who are the ones culturally target by this PC worldview, strive to show how they themselves are NOT at all “patriarchal” or sexist, etc. Boomer white males didn’t nearly so much, unless they were really leftist. They just half heartedly played along a bit, indulgently. Not so gen X males, most of them.
Dana, have you lost your mind? There are many examples of Black Americans who have given contributions to the world, one who’s life is being celebrated today-Michael Jackson. But then we can add MLK, Bill Cosby, Oprah, Wynton Marsalis, Malcolm X, etc, et al. I mean really, you need to get w/Poussaint.
Cannon, didn’t knew you liked NaS and Big L! That’s wassup, I like em two, & my two fave NaS albums are Illmatic & Stillmatic.
White Girl, never heard of this David Dierda, hope I spelled his name right, & I’ll probably look him up later on. But what I will say right not is that just about any Man who’s before a group of people and speaks well, will attract Women like a magnet. Women are wired that way.
O
“yeezy” what that fuck kind of pretend word is that
any faux guilt-ridden swpl who buys a black racist’s sneakers
just to fit in with
the “bros”
deserves to be sentenced to a life of cooking for bigmouths like Lady Raine and White Girl in unholy matrimony.
yeezy – lmfao
Mr. M, I’m not an expert, I’ve just read some articles about chemical meat and milk’s effect on sperm count and testosterone. The effects on everyone would be cancer and so many other things like ADHD and what-not.
As much as we can we should go all natural and organic, as much as our circumstances allow. Growing one’s own food is the best though.
For all the betas crying that women just want to sleep around in their 20s but settle down when they hit 30s and start to age, well, isn’t that what men do too?
How can it all be the women’s fault?
Islam is not a solution, believe me. Islam is not the only way of life that calls for sexual restraint and family values.
Wow 281 responses in the few hours or so
Uncle Gabby -
Nice craigslist post.
I had to peek at who David Deida was…here’s a video…no I haven’t watched it all, but looks like it might be interesting. He’s not overly masculine sounding, but maybe his content is awesome.
Video: David Deida 90s teachings in Byron Bay
baptize her in
SKYY
*presto* instant Jobs Repellant
or, just tell Jobster
you gave her
HEP-B
Yeezy is Kanye’s nickname.
that’s cute
david dukes nickname is
deezy
His content is not “awesome”. He may make a few good points but nothing awe inspiring and a lot of it is corny.
Again, there is something about these new age guys that act a certain way because that is the way they think they will attract new age, holistic women. But then, because they themselves are so airy fairy, they “train” the women to be even doubly airy fairy so that they can feel “masculine”.
Then, airy-fairy-ness is equated with “spirituality” and if you are not airy-fairy woman you are not considered spiritual and “not comfortable being a woman”.
You’d have to be in the middle of this particular sub-culture in the US to know exactly what I ‘m talking about…. but its there.
And these are the peeps that are inspiring the PUA experts right now.
I wonder what percentage of the attendees were positive for HSV-2?
White Girl -
As much as we can we should go all natural and organic, as much as our circumstances allow. Growing one’s own food is the best though.
I agree. I’ve recently been trying to eat grass fed free range beef/bison/poultry and appreciate the affects. Gonna try a full blown organic diet for 3 months and see how my body feels.
As for growing one’s own food, man what about all those bugs/birds that eat my tomatoes! (speak from experience from when I was a kid)
For all the betas crying that women just want to sleep around in their 20s but settle down when they hit 30s and start to age, well, isn’t that what men do too?
How can it all be the women’s fault?
I can tell your understanding of the situation is a little offbase. Honestly, read some blogs…its enriching, at least.
Also – only a small portion of men are ABLE to sleep around with women at their will. The majority, the betas, really don’t get that much ass despite what you think. They might WANT to, but I think we can both agree women generally have easier access to sex should they want to.
”””””””And as for your statement about my need to bring up racial themes, I find it interesting that neither White Girl nor Mandy seem bothered by it, but you are-and that’s something I’d like to explore. You suggest that I’m slyly attempting to draw a comparison btw White Men and Black Men in my question, when in fact, I had no such intention in mind; I was think of both White Men AND Women, and why that same thing hasn’t happened to Black Men AND Women. ””””””””””””””””””””””
Well I was just talking to the hr chick about how I thought it was sick that the camp manager calls the amazon boss. She was like my black buddy calls her boss. I was like wah then she said he loves being bossed around by woman. She said he probably is just used to being around woman. I had to go and vomit.
he has a penchant for blonds with cooking skills, and is rumored to be hung like a hamster. you will LOVE him
White girl writes:
Islam is not the only way of life that calls for sexual restraint and family values.
Islam does NOT call for sexual restraint among alphas who manage to collect up to four wives in fulfillment of God’s holy will.
However, it sucks for beta, gamma, and delta males, because the beta, gamma and delta women have already been hoovered out of the marriage market.
Nothing left for them but sheep and goats.
now folks, THAT is some
nutty, koo-koo crazy STUFF
that
is how you do
humor
@ doug:
again, it’s a mistake to frame this as a white male thing. in reality, this new paradigm acts against all beta males, not just white males. there’s an implicit argument that black and latino males have made all these gains at the expense of white men. if you believe that, please cite some evidence; real evidence, not just antecdotes.
Obsidian, I’ve read the black out of wedlock birth rate blamed on slavery, Jim Crow and (usually from conservatives) the Great Society. The percentages indicate that it has gotten worse, but pretty much from the 60’s on up, which doesn’t negate, obviously, the Great Society bit, but it does indicate that the two most commonly given causes for it are not. It was less common amongst those black Americans who had just gotten out of slavery than it is for white Americans now.
The Great Society certainly was an enabler, in my view, as it put the government in competition with black men for the monetarily influenced affections of women. It may have sped things up, much like the promise of alimony for married women who were thinking of divorce, but it was not the be all end all of it.
(Something not frequently brought up is that married black women are apparently having fewer kids than married white women. Not a good sign either.)
While the OOW birth rate may have been high, relative to whites before the 1960s, it was relatively consistent. (If I remember correctly, the spike from 15% to 25% happened after the New Deal). The collapse of the black family happened after the 60s as did the beginning of the white family cave in.
So, with all that, I can’t agree that the OOW birth rate was artificially created. The OOW birth rates in black countries is pretty similar. 86% in Jamaica, 70% in Barbados (1990) and so on.
Current white OOW birth rate isn’t artificially created either and its getting worse.
One problem with the typical comparison methodology, is that it can devolve into a us/them dichotomy so everyone is arguing about who is going to drown first and why while neglecting the more salient fact: we are all going to die.
That video of Deida you linked to was exactly whats wrong with America.
My god, these people are lost and confused!
If Deida is such a relationships expert how come he’s aging, bald and not married with kids yet?
The blind leading the blind.
@Fire
“he has a penchant for blonds with cooking skills, and is rumored to be hung like a hamster. you will LOVE him”
that
is how you don’t
do
humor
Zylonet, very interesting.
About 3 years ago, I got very interested in foods, diet and weight training to lose weight and improve my power and endurance in martial arts training.
One of the first things I discovered was the facts about soy and it’s estrogenic effects in inhibiting testosterone production.
I cut almost all unfermented soy out of my diet…and if you look at just about any and every food product out their, there is some form of soy derivative in it. Thanks to federal subsidies of giant, multinational agriculture corporations, soy is the top crop in the world today…which is why soy is found in almost everything.
“Vegetable oil” and soybean oil and soy lecithin are in just about every food product imanginable….including meat from animals fed soy.
15-20 years ago, soy was only found at health food stores for the niche market of vegetarians…now it’s in every fucking thing.
Anyhow, once I cut out all soy products as much as possible, and I began eating almost exclusively free range meat and dairy, I’ve noticed a big boost in my libido and stamina. Big time. When I was 33 years old, I was already falling into the content with sex once a week complacency. I’m sure I was on track to be a viagra candidate by the time I was 40.
Now I’m 36, eating a clean, organic, saturated fat heavy, protein/low-carb/high vegetable diet, and I feel like I have the libido I had when I was 18. While I’m not banging my wife 4 times a day like you are, our sex life is even better now than when we first started dating as young adults…we both lost weight and both of our libidos have picked up dramatically from something as simple as diet change and cutting soy food products out of our diet as much as possible. (Of course, I’m sure it helps that I learned that I was being a fucking pussywhipped beta with my behavior, and once I corrected that, my wife actually lusts me again…)
Even though I haven’t even thought of going the T-Therapy route you advocate, I do notice a distinct difference in my strength training, martial art training, and my sex life. I’m quite positive that the proliferation of soy in the food supply has a significant effect on lowering the natural T levels.
Tagging along with the Testosterone pharmacology, I’ll add a vicarious experience. An male acquaintance commented on the mismatched libido between himself and his wife, which effected him to the point of depression. Interestingly, his MD hadn’t drilled down to the possible cause of his depression. His wife had chronic shoulder pain and no libido. I offhandedly recommended he have a conversation with his doctor about using an anti-androgen instead of an antidepressant. He researched it himself, found an online UK pharmacy, and started on a small doss of Androcur.
Three months later, he reported
-almost complete loss of libido, which he was very happy with
-depression gone after 4 years of antidepressant use with minimal efficacy
-hair regrowth on his head that family members had noticed
-lucid wet dreams
-no breast enlargement
I haven’t seen him since, so have no longer followup. To me the interesting question is whether the addition or “subtraction” of testosterone in men could sometimes be more effective than the antidepressants; this is out-of-school for me, so I’ve no better impressions.
holy spitfuck christ
I can actually hear this bitch getting stupider over the interwebz.
It’s all you see on DISCOVERY “Health” channel – some mewling, tender beta trained from birth to be holding the hand of some fat sow while she pushes out some cottage cheese-covered fetus in the birthing room.
American women are obese piggies with no shortage of trained Stepford beta providers to cook, clean, work, do dishes and rock the cradle while she watches Oprah, dishes dirt with her cunt-coven of cattle
and ‘finds’ herself
at Applebee’s
watch it blondie.
I’ll learn to speak Canadian – just to talk dirty to you while I redden your asscheeks
Stillmatic
I knew there was a reason we didn’t get along.
Stillmatic was not very good at all. Nothing bothers me more than the chorus to track 4
“I got a bunch of bullets and a bag of guns I pass ‘em to my niggaz c’mon”
CORNY.
But Illmatic is one of the best ever.
Second that firepower…
Most women THINK they…want men who will stand by them through thick and thin, as this is the feminist paradigm indoctrination they have been inculcated with since birth by our socially engineered society.
But it is in their basic feminine nature to reach true happiness and fulfillment by finding a man they deem worthy, so that they can stand by HIM through thick and thin.
Doug1 writes:
The more caring you are about helping other groups, when yours is on top, the higher status you can achieve in the world of competitive altruism.
Very nicely put — I’ve entered it in my ‘quotes of the year’.
But isn’t all this off-topic? I’ve only been here for three days but I thought that this site was for pussy-seeking males, not for high-falutin’ egghead stuff like this,
The same thing is happening in Australia and the UK. My theory is this
In the age of no-fault divorce why would any man sacrifice 30 years of earnings, all his time and energy and all his assets to look after this?
http://tbn2.google.com/images?q=tbn:f94Cyv1vzlBPKM:http://pictures.directnews.co.uk/liveimages/Old%2Bwoman_1096_19055375_0_0_5970_300.jpg
Unless he’s a completely cuckholded beta that is?
30 something women know that the only way of locking in their lifetime pension, healthcare and housing card is to dominate the family and social scene to such a degree that they guys have no other outlets and no other options.
On the other hand – I have freedom – live on a holiday island and have a greatt boat and money to travel so I can have 2 summers per year
If y’all really want to rev up your energy levels try a plant based organic RAW FOOD eating regimine.
Can’t go all raw (many people can’t) try at least 50% and use Super Foods.
Also, breathing techniques, yoga, and there are other techniques out there for men specifically, not going into those details here.
But the majority of men you consider “alpha” pale in comparison to men who are living like this.
Anyone on a SAD diet (Standard American Diet) cannot be alpha, male or female, in the true sense of the world.
No need for artificial testosterone or grilling LOL.
But you do what you can with what you know. But the more you know, the more you can do.
Firepower writes:
some mewling, tender beta trained from birth to be holding the hand of some fat sow ..
Firepower I have just snorted my third single malt through my nostrils on reading this jesus how rarely does one encounter genius these days.
White Girl – bullshit on the vegetarian. We humans are omnivores by biological design. While I agree on the organic, natural food angle, vegetarianism is not the optimal diet for the human body.
Yep – sometimes the engineering is like the sci-fi flick.
Invasion of the Body Snatchers – where everyone is podpeople, blindly following a drive.
Our feminized culture turned the white male concept of “mercy” into free handouts to sows & moocows and ultimately – women engineering men into Alan Alda
Joe – Yeezy is Kanye’s nickname.
Firepower – david dukes nickname is deezy
According to lurker Mandy’s nickname is cuntrag.
She’s also known as the Cuban Einstein or The Girl Without a Brain.
I know I have encountered – in you – true genius, taste, style and substance. No – gravitas. Gravitas for grasping the soul of wit.
Genius may be indeed rare, but the true appreciation of it
rarer
still
@fire
I’ll learn to speak Canadian – just to talk dirty to you while I redden your asscheeks
Well then you’ll be colouring them not coloring them just for starters.
mu White and Asian on average, also tend to have the very nasty habit of a kind of Asperger’s tunnelvision myopia that won’t even allow them to see or contemplate anything else
hey now!!!
Is this really Obsidian posting? I think it’s a troll posing as Obsidian.
@seeking alpha- drug use is lower amongst blks. Try again.
Only one thing a man can become as a vegetarian. A FAG.
@Dave from the Hot Place
“But it is in their basic feminine nature to reach true happiness and fulfillment by finding a man they deem worthy, so that they can stand by HIM through thick and thin.”
Yes Sireee! Exactly.
Hot? Nawww, that would be Vegas, Arizona and So. California.
No, it’s a perfect, sunny, blue sky, 79 degree summer day here in the islands.
Joe, and the SAD diet is making people what – empowered Alphas full of healthy glow and energy???
Dave Hawaii, its not a matter of everyone on the planet becoming vegetarian. I’m simply stating that if you want to feel and look your best – add as many organic plant based RAW foods and “super foods” to your daily diet as possible.
Don’t cut out the meat, just add the plant based raw and super foods.
Everyone who does this gets such results that they just keep adding the plant based raw and super foods until they compromise most of their diet.
It does WONDERS for the body and mind.
This type of ignorance about food and nutrition is one of the biggest turn offs in beta men who are trying to be alpha.
” I GRILL therefore I am masculine. I am not vegetarian, therefore I am not a fag”
yeah, convince us some more.
LOL
insecure and ignorant. what to speak of low energy and unhealthy.
You want improvement? I’m offering a way that you can improve. Take it or leave it but don’t knock it till you try it.
That’s just corny ignorance.
Carolus Reconditus—
The great majority of Islamic marriages around the world are monogamous ones. Only something like 3% or less are polygamous. However Islam and Islamic countries do allow polygamous marriage, as everyone knows, to up to four wives. Islam is probably much better for the average beta male in Islamic countries than the situation now prevailing for gen Y in the Anglosphere. Once they are married, anyway. But betas aren’t doing so well these gen Y days pre-maritally in the Anglosphere either. Muslim countries and Muslim groups within the West are clearly Patriarchal societies, and men clearly rule in domestic relations, or are supposed to. The Arabic word for man, Bhetti tells me, means “God of the home”.
(I am not a Muslim. My background is Christian, though rather Deist (raised Episcopalian). I have developed an online relationship with a Muslim girl, supplemental to my live together one with a Catholic girl.)
Oh ok then. That’s cool.
White Girl–
What convincing evidence, other than your Hindu beliefs?
””””””””””””””””””””””””’dana
Hormoaning,
Black people on the whole basically suffer from congenital narcissistic personality disorder. They have no interest in anything but black people and how non-black people view black people. Any convo they initiate that’s not about them is something like the old chestnut “well, enough about me, tell me–what do YOU think about me?” They contribute nothing to the thousands year old discourse of the West (tace, Thomas Sowell)–they are exclusively parasitic on its philosophical and technological developments.
Like most people with NPD, they also show no interest in or conception of what the quieter, more reserved people around them may think of them, only insisting that the people around them reflect their inflated self image back like good little mirrors. The fact that whites loathe and despise them in direct relationship to how much contact they have with them is below their radar, having bought the line that “racism is just ignorance”.
”””””””””””””””””””””””””””
Dam
I see the same insecurities in white men with regards to food and their “masculinity” here as the insecurities in black women with regards to their “feminity” and black men dating out.
Maybe beta white boy alpha-wannabes should hook up with sistas and the two groups can hash out their insecurities together.
Zylonet:
“As to your advice to start lifting weights – it is worthless for enhancing T into the top 1%. Tons of powerlifters are low-T BETA men. Lifting weight’s barely nudges t-levels and most people who train, overtrain so their levels are actually at risk.”
Not according to this:
http://www.ergo-log.com/traintest.html
“According to the researchers, regular weight training raises testosterone levels by forty percent. ”
Apparently, immediately after heavy resistance training, there is a drop in T because of muscles “soak” up the existing circulating T.
Also, according the article, it takes a few weeks of resistance training for this increase in T to appear.
Again Doug, its not a case of promoting vegetarianism as there are plenty of unhealthy and even obese vegetarians who do not exude energy or “glow”. Its about organic plant based RAW and super foods.
I have myself as living proof and everyone I know who has gone this route. There’s plenty of research and data on the web. I’m not going to do your reading for you.
But if you really want to know, try it yourself. There is no teacher like experience.
””””””mandy been here a while
Gunslinger
“White girl is a super troll and one of the reasons extermination is the only way. You can’t just kill one cockroach.”
Did you know that female cockroaches only need to mate once in order to fertilize all of their eggs But they can hold onto them and have babies long afterwards.
What type of game would you use on a woman who could do that?””””””””””’
See above where you asked question.
*The fact that whites loathe and despise them in direct relationship to how much contact they have with them is below their radar, having bought the line that “racism is just ignorance”.*
er, ouch. the website stuffblackpeopledontlike takes a contrary view by offering that black people have contributed greatly to western society by excelling in the ability to place of a ball through a plane defined by a goal. So, Thomas Sowell notwithstanding, I think that view point clearly ignores such important contributions.
Tizzy bee notice this new skinny jean, scarf wearing, colorful clothing trend that has arisen over the last year or two
It’s better than the excessive jewelry, t-shirts longer than dresses and jeans hanging around their knees.
Joe But they’re growing at an alarming rate, faster than white hipsters. Kanye, Wale, Pharrell have all been contributing to it. Especially among the 25 and younger set
There have always been blks who did,listen to, and enjoy things outside of so called “ blk culture”. The difference is now they have a uniform as well as few stars to model themselves after.
Mu Seeking Alpha,
The reason why I didn’t even dignify Roissy’s dumbass “trol bait” comment was because, duh, he put himself out there like that for me to even bring the topic up. In other words, he opened the door on the conversation, I merely walked through. If he didn’t want to go there, he could have talked about something else.
Mu didn’t write this^^^. That’s not his writing style. Roissy check the ip address, I’m sure that’s not mu.
Obsidian–
Chic noir just reminded me of how absurd I thought that when I first read it. It’s absurd O. Asperger’s is a syndrome or spot on the autism spectrum that relatively few suffer from. The great majority of higher IQ folks do not get there by having some of this, even in it’s mild form. A few do. Seeking Alpha CERTAINLY doesn’t in any way shape or form. He has quite a lot of social perceptiveness in fact.
@Dave in Hotter than Canada
“Hot? Nawww, that would be Vegas, Arizona and So. California”
Yes but you’re still haawter then us.
I get my fats and proteins from plant based foods. The best and most healthy source of fats and proteins.
Again, I’m not saying go cold turkey. I’m saying simply ADD plant based RAW organic foods and super foods to your already existing SAD (Standard American Diet). You will want to keep adding more and more.
This will open a door for you into the realm of optimal nutrition. You got to start somewhere.
@doug 1
“I have developed an online relationship with a Muslim girl, supplemental to my live together one with a Catholic girl.”
And you have an evangelical follower….ok ok it was in a past life…oh wait does that make me Buddhist?
they also excel at destroying buildings – enitire city blocks – and the cities themselves
without ever learning to operate bulldozers. or
get up before
noon
White Girl, while it’s true that a vegetarian diet you promote is better than the SAD, over a long period of time, without artificial supplementation, you will develop nutritional deficiencies by avoiding animal fats and protein.
You can attribute personal experience if you are a person that used to eat the SAD, and switch to an all raw, organic, plant based diet, as you are no longer eating the corporate produced crap that is literal poison that is the standard fare of today’s food, mass produced to fatten up the sheeple.
My problem with the “RAW” diet approach is that you actually will get more nutrient “bang” from your vegetables if you sautee/bake them in a good fat, like Grade A butter from free range pastured dairy cows, or extra virgin olive oil.
Many vitamins and nutrients in plant foods are fat soluble, so, by cooking with healthy fats, your body can absorb far more nutrients than you typically get from eating them raw.
“I have developed an online relationship with a Muslim girl”
… there’s no such thing as “relationships” on line.
Is anyone else getting hungry? How bout a good BB-Q? Or wait a pig roast at Dave’s in Hawaii!! Who’s in?
Eskimos eat a diet that is overwhelmingly animal based. They are fit, they have great lipid profiles, & a low incidence of atherosclerosis. The thing is, the animals they eat hardly ever eat cereal grains.
Why SHOULD anyone go cold turkey OR “slowly taper” off of eating animal foods? If your sole reason is health, and not cultural or religious, than you are vegetarian for the wrong reasons.
@Whitegirl
“there’s no such thing as “relationships” on line.”
Why ever not?
poor guy: you’ve been dealt the worst of both worlds
Dave, like I said, not everyone can eat 100% RAW and I am not saying you HAVE to.
For some people the 80/20 rule does the trick; 80% raw, 20% cooked. For some people 50/50. You have to experiment and find what works FOR YOU.
All I’m suggesting is that SAD people ADD some healthy, organic, plant-based RAW and super foods to their daily intake.
This will open up a lot of things for them.
“For all the betas crying that women just want to sleep around in their 20s but settle down when they hit 30s and start to age, well, isn’t that what men do too?
How can it all be the women’s fault?”
@White Girl –
Because, as was explained above, the situation in the casual sex market is *not* equal. People are pointing this out to you left and right, and you’re not listening. The point is that these betas are *not* sleeping around in the 20s because the women pass them over — they are not sexually attractive to them at that point in their lives when their own mate value is high and they can shoot higher for sex partners. Many of the betas are left sexless in the 20s.
Then in the 30s, the same women want to settle down, and have many more sexual partners than the guys they want to settle with, who are the same guys that were not ghood enough for sex in the 20s. That’s because, as I pointed out above, women can drift up the male food chain for sex in a sexual free market — and they do.
So it’s not at all the case that “men are doing it too”. The only men who are, are the ones who can pull that off, and that is a much smaller % of men than the number of women who are doing it.
Why SHOULD anyone go cold turkey OR “slowly taper” off of eating animal foods? If your sole reason is health, and not cultural or religious, than you are vegetarian for the wrong reasons.
I’m a vegetarian for spiritual/ethical reasons. I am an advocate of healthy organic, plant-based, raw and super foods for health and apha reasons.
”””””””””””’The Older Man
The same thing is happening in Australia and the UK. My theory is this
In the age of no-fault divorce why would any man sacrifice 30 years of earnings, all his time and energy and all his assets to look after this?
http://tbn2.google.com/images?q=tbn:f94Cyv1vzlBPKM:http://pictures.directnews.co.uk/liveimages/Old%2Bwoman_1096_19055375_0_0_5970_300.jpg
Unless he’s a completely cuckholded beta that is?
30 something women know that the only way of locking in their lifetime pension, healthcare and housing card is to dominate the family and social scene to such a degree that they guys have no other outlets and no other options.
On the other hand – I have freedom – live on a holiday island and have a greatt boat and money to travel so I can have 2 summers per year
””””””””””””
oh jesus god I need to go die now.
WG – look, I agree with your points for the most part…but I am literally sick of the whole “VEGETARIANISM” is the ultimate diet nonsense.
Unless it’s your religious or cultural upbringing, saying vegetarianism is the optimal diet, or, as you said:
The best and most healthy source of fats and proteins I HAVE to call bullshit.
That’s just wrong.
Yes, it’s certainly better than the fast food/convenience food/dining out culture…but there are a multitude of reasons as to why you are misguided on this.
Our physiology has hydrochloric acid producing stomachs, a feature found in nature in all carnivorous and omnivorous species. Our bodies produce that specifically to digest and utilize animal proteins and fats.
Our dentistry includes canines, which are designed solely for the purpose of ripping and tearing FLESH…not chewing cud.
What light is light, if fat be not seen?
What joy is joy, if meat be not by?
Unless it be to think that it is by
And feed upon the desire of consumption
Except I savor it in the night,
There is no music in the nightingale;
Unless I chew it in the day,
There is no day for me to look upon;
It is my essence, and I leave to be,
If I be not by its greasy nourishment
Foster’d, illumin’d, cherish’d, kept alive.
I fly not death, to fly her deadly doom:
Tarry I here, I but attend on death;
But, fly I hence, I fly away from life.
– Pupuspeare
Jesus Christ have you ever had a nightmare while awake.
That shit should be used once a day to cure the beta.
damn – do I have an entire catalog of regrets
to leave you with
That picture of that old lady suffering with a tube in her nose is one reason why many women do not find American men to be ideal family men.
Go on. Make fun of your grandmothers who I’m sure you would rather put in homes where they will be neglected and possibly abused rather than take care of them like real men.
No man in his 30s will be married to a woman like that, by the time she reaches that age, guess what? You will be older and sicker and uglier to. Or do you think at 90 you will be able to finally convince and alpha 20 something female to take care of you?
This disrespect and disregard for the elderly and sick is one of the MOST DISGUSTING things about American men and why you are not considered suitable marriage material for any family-oriented woman anywhere on the globe.
I feel sorry for your moms and grandmoms.
Go on in your illusions that grilling BBQ once a year makes you “manly”.
Taking care of your elders in need is what a “real man” does.
Ahh, let me guess…the great moral equivalency between animal life and human life!
Is the lion immoral for eating the impala or the wildebeast?
Is the tiger immoral for eating the pig?
Is the baboon immoral for eating the antelope fawn?
Of course not.
That is the cycle of life…life feeds on life.
All those predator/prey species have one thing in common – they all have canine teeth and hydrochloric acid in their digestive tracts…just like us humans.
Embrace your biological reality…after all, if animals were not meant to be eaten, than why are they made out of tasty, healthy meat?
The hr chick look like that except younger like 28.
Too many comments to read. Nice description of a male/female dynamic common in the U.S. (and Northern Europe).
Now your just hyperventilating and using cheap, feminist shaming language. Must be the GLOW of your ethically and spiritually superior, plant based diet!
BTW- how many REAL women stick their elderly relatives in nursing homes?
Gunslingergregi
Solution have china exterminate everyone who is not asian that is the solution.
It’s coming. Our effete liberal elite sits on its ass, while the dragon gets stronger:
Canines are designed to rip and tear live flesh from a carcas or even a living animal. Human teeth are not designed for that. Our intestinal track is also not short like that of carnivore animals. Overall humans are not designed to be carnivores, and certainly not DAILY carnivores.
I’m not hear to convert people to a vegetarian diet. Just ADD happy to the SAD and see the results.
And this is purely to become more “alpha” which is the goal of this blog, right?
Whether you become a full-fledged vegetarian or not means nothing to me. I have some knowledge of nutrition that can up your energy levels, thats all I’ve shared.
I know alot about energy, including sexual energy, but I’m not sharing that here.
””””””””Carolus Reconditus,
Firepower I have just snorted my third single malt through my nostrils on reading this jesus how rarely does one encounter genius these days.””””””””””””
”””””””’firepower,
Our feminized culture turned the white male concept of “mercy” into free handouts to sows & moocows and ultimately – women engineering men into Alan Alda””””””””’
On a minute by minute basis on this site apparently.
White Girl is the stupid SWPL cliche brought to life!
Dave:
natural != moral
feels (or tastes) good != moral
**PLEASE READ: (I truly hope this doesn’t get lost in the mix)**
I love this blog and I am a regular reader. I sometimes even make comments here.
While it’s a great and interesting source of relationship material, the comments section is like a zoo.
Too many discussions of race, and quite frankly while that can sometimes be interesting, there is far too much focus on white vs. black matters.
Typically, these issues devolve into the inferiority of African-Americans or some type of bashing of black men, black women, or the entire race. And most of it is based on unfounded ideas.
This blog has a lot of potential, promise, and appeal.
But the focus on race, and particularly the black bashing, drags it down into the trash.
And please, there needs to be more policing of inane, annoying, and ignorant commenters such as “White Girl” and “Lady Raine,” who come here, spew nonsense, seek attention, and post their lives away.
As someone who regularly reads comments, I sometimes feel that these two, and possibly the commenter “Mandy” originate with one source.
I’ve got news for you. Most vegetarians on this planet are not white but BROWN!!!
;”””””””White Girl
I see the same insecurities in white men with regards to food and their “masculinity” here as the insecurities in black women with regards to their “feminity” and black men dating out.
Maybe beta white boy alpha-wannabes should hook up with sistas and the two groups can hash out their insecurities together.””””””””
like I said super troll called it said the word insecurity in regardsto men over one million times must be from that feminist site.
from the evidence of her writing, we know White Girl to be, most assuredly:
1. first off, NOT white
2. a vegetarian for spiritual/ethical reasons.
3. an advocate of healthy organic, plant-based, raw, super foods for health and apha [sic] reasons.
4. a strident vegan
5. a hater of the penii
6. owner of 84 rescued Hindu cattle and/or deceased ancestors
7. lust-crazed, lubricated pursuer of the aoefee box
Does anyone here amongst us deny
she looks like an Ice Road Trucker?
Yes they are. You don’t know until you try…
That’s because we are not carnivores…we’re omnivores.
In all seriousness WG, you are mistaken. The Masai, and the Inuit are just two examples of indigenous peoples that thrived on an almost purely carnivorous diet.
Some free reading for your dietary edification: http://journeytoforever.org/farm_library/price/pricetoc.html
Yeah, that’s one of the reasons the dumbass SWPL types like it.
i hear ya bro, but O and chic be borrowin’ the banhammer. they thought they could use it to breach the doors at BestBuy and get another TV during the next civil ‘uprising’
White Girl
You are not sharing what you know about sexual energy? Hindus have been carving naughty object lessons in temple walls for what? 5000 years? Tantric ideas have been mainstreamed for decades.
Old women get taken care of by men according to how they related to men while they were young. That is just reality.
“White Girl is the stupid SWPL cliche brought to life!”
???
Hello. “White girl” is obviously not white.
””””””””””””””””””’
Tarl
Gunslingergregi
Solution have china exterminate everyone who is not asian that is the solution.
It’s coming. Our effete liberal elite sits on its ass, while the dragon gets stronger:
Chinese nationalism is also on the rise. The Internet has made young Chinese more nationalistic. The Chinese are acquiring resources all around the world and with them, willy-nilly, an overseas empire that threatens U.S. interests. The Chinese are building their Navy, a historic precursor to expanded ambitions and global conflict.
Think of China, Ferguson concluded, as Kaiser Wilhelm’s Germany in the years before World War I: a growing, aggressive, nationalistic power whose ambitions will tear through pre-existing commercial ties and historic friendships.
””””””””””””””””””””””””’
Yea and I am going to probably quit work to go and write my paper on how china can beat the us while playing the stock market. Hopefully they give me an honorary degree. The reason i am probably going to quite is because of affirmative action. I really can’t handle being the only fucking white boy anymore.
A little late to this party. But, collegeboy:
Huh?
Most of them with more than one wife?
Mathematically impossible, unless men are regularly killed or driven out of the area in droves.
Explain, please, how this region of yours magically has a f:m ratio of lots:1?
Obsidian
Hello from a Philly neighbor.
If all the white people disappeared tomorrow–what would happen to the power grid in the US within 6 months? the internet? the financial system? the military? the food industry? “healthcare”? the construction industry? the transportation industry?
Would Oprah make things go?
Black people no longer even do the scut work of civilization that’s so important, let alone create wealth or invent and maintain infrastructure and complex systems.
Now ask yourself this–
what would happen to the US if all black people disappeared tomorrow?
Firepower:
“5. a hater of the penii”
What are penii? The Latin plural of penis is penes, if that is what you meant.
Dave from Hawaii:
In all seriousness WG, you are mistaken. The Masai, and the Inuit are just two examples of indigenous peoples that thrived on an almost purely carnivorous diet.
That does not mean all peoples are adapted to that kind of diet. White Girl’s diet does seem highly superstitious, but there could still be something to be gained from moving in that direction for some of us, maybe.
And tarl this is a good thing as it would break my fucking heart to see asia turned into a bastardized version of the us.
Some points.
Doug & Chic: while I have no problem apologizing if I mischaracterized Asperger’s, but I stand behind the thrust of what I’ve said-there is a kind of tunnelvision, whatever its source may be, when it comes to some Whites’ views of Blacks, regardless of countless examples to the contrary. It is this myopia that I seek to address.
Chic: as I’ve said to Joe, the simple truth of the matter is that I can easily point out more guys here locally wearing State Property or LRg than those looking like Pharrell or Kanye West. In fact, most guys don’t even play their music in their cars/trucks. And throughout the USA, this is a similar situation. Kanye and Pharrell, while certainly a part of Hip Hop, simply aren’t dominant forces in it; Jay-Z is far and away a more dominant cultural force (Rocawear), so is NaS.
Capt. Napalm: yes, your points are what I thought you were talking about. I stand by what I said-Blacks were prevented by law from marrying during Slavery, and while OOW was always *slightly higher* than the White community during the Jim Crow years following Reconstruction, marital rates, which is really a proxy for the role of fatherhood in a community, remaind both constant and high, until the 60s as you rightly mentioned. Here, there can be no doubt-the Great Society played a powerful, direct and singlehanded role in dismantling the Black Family by displacing fathers. This is a fact, and its something that wasn’t occuring on its own to such a degree prior. This, plus the fact that for nearly a century Blacks sought to marry and raise kids together following the end of Slavery, leads me to conclude that what we see today is NOT a naturally occuring state of affairs, but a horrid social engineering move that has all but destroyed the Black family.
White Girl: I don’t have any problem at all with whatever you choose to eat, but what bothers me is the near-religious zeal vegans have-especially the White Hindu ones-in their approach towards non-vegans. They’re almost like Vegan-Jihadis, lol. Why can’t you just “do you” and leave it at that? If someone wants to get down, let em contact you offlist and take it from there. I just find the prosyletizing to be a huge turnoff.
Seeking Alpha: Stillmatic is important because in my view it ranks up there as one of the great comeback albums for a rapper, much like LL Cool J’s Mama Said Knock You Out. Of course NaS’ long career yielded many hits, but as an album I submit its one of his finest.
Maurice: thanks so much for the very lucid response to my earlier question. I still submit that there is something *in* White Men that doesn’t seem to be present in Men in other areas of the World to even want to hear Women out to begin with, much less give in as much as they have over the past few decades. Kevin McDonald has suggested that Anglo Whites in particular have an evolutionary bias towards individualism and away from group or clam affiliation, which accounts for why White ethnic groups have such a hard time getting their act together here in the USA. Its an interesting theory, to me just as good as any other in grappling w/this question.
Ok, that’s it. Holla back
O
White Girl:
“Men and women don’t trust each other anymore, but they want to.
What is the solution?”
The solution is to learn that trust is not necessary. This is where western society has been destroying itself. It believes that people can and should be trustworthy because of such sentiments as love.
If the benefits of betraying someone are greater than the consequences, humans will chose betrayal.
Western culture focuses on being nonjudgmental and forgiving, so there is no social sanction for betrayal. Any man that longs to trust his companion, or does so, is inviting himself to be cuckolded.
@Gunslingergregi
oh jesus god I need to go die now.
HI gunslinger. the reality is that the optimal time for a woman to divorce is up to about age 38,
when they have young children
when they have enourmous power, handed to them by society, family, and the state.
and when they are likely to get the house all the other assets and another guy
And dont they weild this power with joy!
After say 38 the power swings back into our court,
1) the kids are likely to be old enough to drive so they can come see us at our bachelor pad = much harder to withhold / deny custody
2) we have our prime income earning years still ahead of us.
3) we can still have many relationships into our 50’s and beyond (I know I’m doing it)
4) we free ourselves from the massive financial and and emotional burden of an old woman.
If you go to your local mall you will see hordes of them with their $200 Hairdos, and their $1000 outfits spending mountains of money on meaningless crap, behind every one of them is a beta who works like a dog to give them that money and then has to beg to go and play golf with his buddies once a fortnight and listen to that nagging for 30 odd years.
Believe me – 5 – 10 – 15 years of CS payments is cheap cheap cheap in comparison
“penii” is urban black ghetto slang for “Oreo writer” or one who tries, with their writing, to act white. It doesn’t translate well into Norse.
still, I’m appreciative you know that plural.
Regardless of race, ethnicity or culture, human biology is the same. Arpagus, check out that link I posted…free online book on the studies of a Dentist in the early 20th century, comparing the health and nutrition of indigenous populations versus those peoples that switched to a westernized, modernized diet.
God, you are such a fag. Seriously. And before you question my shit, I’m ex-Army and a current business owner in NYC — Nothing to fuck with. You are such a pussy. What kind of bitch goes to a bbq and whinges about social dynamics. Get off it. You are turning in to the shitty nerd who has a hit of a blunt and thinks that he can spit all sorts of knowledge. You are not an outsider. You are a fucking faggott.
1. Nobody left to translate Kat Williams’ stand-up
2. Window Security Bar industry in tatters
firepower–
rofl
White Girl
You will be older and sicker and uglier to. Or do you think at 90 you will be able to finally convince and alpha 20 something female to take care of you?
I agree with you 90 is stretching it a bit far..
Here is my plan
When I am about 65 I will go to the 3rd world and marry a 30 year old (who is considered old in the 3rd world)
I can then have a Second or Third batch of kids who will come see me at the nursing home when I am 90 ….where I’ll get them to read Reagan Biographies and Ron Paul books to me as I doze off to slumberland at 3pm in the afternoon….
Men act like sorta gay men (I notice this more, and more, and more) because women demand it. Look at the skinny jean thing that came out of the emo crowd. It’s gay, dressing like a woman (no, dude, I don’t want to see your ass or ass crack). It’s particularly noticeable among professional people, where any kind of masculine behavior gets people in trouble. I’ve learned to hold my tongue and say as little as possible, because of that (i.e. Women get hypercharged with rage over violating SWPL taboos). It’s certainly changed over ten years, since I’ve been noticing it. Ten years ago, there would have been a couple of guys at the grill, carefully prepped with marinated steaks and such, beers at the ready, with maybe a baseball game on the radio, or tunes. Women would have been making out with their boyfriends, not acting all “empowered.”
But clearly, this sort of behavior (men acting gay, it’s all over the place) is because most Upper/Middle class White women demand it, and find masculine behavior icky. Or — Women get EXACTLY the kind of man they demand.
Thomas — You mean Jews like Rice, Powell, Rumsfeld, and Cheney? Heck most Jews are so thoroughly SWPL Yuppified they’d cheer if Israel were nuked out of existence, while working-middle class White Evangelicals support Israel 100% (mostly because they share the same enemy — Muslims). Necons are Western populists like Cheney or Palin. Or Neocon #1, Ronald Reagan. MSM is a women’s medium, for WASPS/Catholics. Katie Couric or the View.
Obsidian — the breakdown I’ve seen in the WSJ is Urban Core — 60%, suburban middle class, 40%. So while there is a substantial amount of national Black Middle class, often seen in New Orleans Jazzfest (at other times they avoid the city, the birthplace in many respects of Black Culture, like the plague), most of Black America is still urban, poor, and dominated by single mothers and gangsta hard boys. Because obviously that is what Black Urban women want: gangstas. Heck we even have another rap murder feud, some guy named Dollah shot outside the Beverly Center.
Somewhat OT — If you’re not watching History Channel Expedition Africa, you should be. Fascinating dynamics. Bunch of SWPL folks, the older expedition head has a huge problem because the chick, who was once hot (Miami Dolphins cheerleader) but has not aged well in the sun or her thirties, has hooked up with the other dominant guy who’s clueless but aggressive and younger, causing huge dissension among them. It’s why women in a mostly male environment are a terrible mistake — you can see the fighting over her (and that she provokes).
Is it wrong that dana made my dick hard. I hope it is a chick.
There’s enough evolutionary evidence to suggest that humans advanced through the use of fire to cook meat and other food resources allowing calories to go to brainpower instead of digestion. That’s a huge advantage. Brains over guts.
Almost … symbolic.
gun i am lol a happily married one
Are men really paranoid about their wives cheating on them? I thought it was traditionally women who worried about their husbands. This is really the first I’m hearing of men collectively worrying about their women cheating.
Obsidian, Hindus are not vegans. In India I’ve not met one Hindu vegan (I guess you meant to say vegetarian???)
As you know there is a big diff between a vegan and a vegetarian.
Arpagus, what is “superstitious” about a plant-based raw diet? It’s highly nutritious (according to science).
Whether or not y’all go veggie or raw or not, at least don’t show your ignorance of science and basic nutritional facts for all the world’s women (who you are trying to attract) to see.
Women globally appreciate intelligence, intellect and analytical skills.
Who knows – your much waited upon “soul mate” might randomly by chance wander to this site. You will want to impress her, won’t you?
Regarding growing old with another old person and feeling like you have to take care of them when they are sick when you don’t want to (coz your sick too).
The answer lies in the extended family system OR polyamory. Take your pick.
Thomas and Willard are too cute together. They need a sitcom.
Hehe. You don’t like it when it’s your turn to step up to the guillotine huh.
Hollywood Hotsauce
anyone watching the MJ memorial
His poor daughter is a true daddy’s girl. She made me cry a bit.
whiskey “There’s enough evolutionary evidence to suggest that humans advanced through the use of fire to cook meat and other food resources allowing calories to go to brainpower instead of digestion. That’s a huge advantage. Brains over guts.
Almost … symbolic.”
yes
this why we COOK DOG in viet nam
and eat dog
we win war vs you with our brain and punji stick
Obsidian—
If individualism plays a role it’s a small one, contra MacDonald.
No, it’s much more that the left which has been followed in the media and educational institutions at all levels esp. over the last several decades of gen Y’s gestation (but MUCH less so that of even tail end boomers like me), has convinced white men that they should step aside as a group, and no longer trumpet group pride or even too much past accomplishments at least in a way that’s culture or race specific (there’s that ultimately shaming word to condemn anything like that you may have heard of, “racism”). All other groups are not only free to trumpet their areas of pride but encouraged to do so. This includes women as compared to white men. The women of other groups are encouraged to get all proud about their histories but then so too are their men.
This is very real and not theoretical. As I’ve mentioned before, look how quickly and thoroughly feminists backed down from their attacks on rap lyrics when black men hollered and black women tended to stay shut or be mixed in their reaction. Mostly stayed shut. Black men could be misogynist in their lyrics (according to feminists) in ways that white men can’t.
White men of gen Y have been taught NOT to be dominant over women in ways that black, or Latino, or Asian men are not in Anglosphere society. This was not true 50 years ago, or anyway much less true. Instead there were chivalrous codes of kinds of dominance that were ok, but kinds of deference and elaborte respect which was required. Well feminism kept all but the the useless and irritating aspects of chivalry but forced out any open subscribing to general male dominance — but FOR WHITE MEN ONLY. (Many East and South Asian men sort of tag along on this as the high status thing to do, but that’s their ethnic culture’s call to a large extent, in the way the Anglosphere PC does things. Again this is media and ed. establishment transmitted, and also by a lot of boomer feminist friendly families who gave birth to those gen Y white boys.
I said more along these lines addressed to Maurice as a devopment of what you’re reacting to of his here:
http://roissy.wordpress.com/2009/07/07/role-reversal/#comment-101203
“except maybe keith.”
True, I am fucking delightful.
Ground lamb makes the best burger.
Obsidian:
“White Men that doesn’t seem to be present in Men in other areas of the World to even want to hear Women out to begin with”
The Greeks thought the Romans were nuts for actually bothering to actually talk to their wives, although it was the Athenian Socrates who, while advising men to marry, said that if men marry well, they will be happy, if not then they’d be philosophers.
I suppose that each culture has devised its own method for trying to cope with the universal experience of feminine nagging. We tried giving them what they wanted. It does not seem to be working out quite that great.
keith
NO
DOG make best burger
White Girl
What kind of screen name is “white girl”? As if you’re representative, or talismatic, or the lodestone pointing the white girl way? What entirely undeserved arrogance.
I wonder why?
he he he
Hello Neighbor (Dana),
I’m sorry but I cannt answer your questions; I try to remain rooted in the realworld, and have little time or interest for make believe scenarios. Black and White folk are here to stay. We must grapple with this.
O
You mean like you have?
Sorry dear, but when you state that plant based fats and protein are the best nutritional source, you show your ignorance of science and basic nutritional facts.
dave
CORRECT
DOG equal best new trition source
I love pho.
“”"When I am about 65 I will go to the 3rd world and marry a 30 year old (who is considered old in the 3rd world)
I can then have a Second or Third batch of kids who will come see me at the nursing home when I am 90 ….where I’ll get them to read Reagan Biographies and Ron Paul books to me as I doze off to slumberland at 3pm in the afternoon….”"”
“”
Do you think that will work? From what I hear, women in the Asian countries that open to marrying foreigners are quickly becoming feminized. The Philipines is famous for gold diggers who really only want you for the money and I know men who have been used and abandoned by “submissive young Filipinas”.
And is it really true that women in Asian countries are willing to marry men twice their age or more? I know in India it is not done. First, marrying a foreigner is rare and looked upon suspiciously and second, a big age difference like that is looked upon suspiciously as well and not considered “ideal” at all.
I think polyagamous (andry and gyny) relationships are the wave of the future.
Right now men and women in USA are seriel daters and divorces. They have consecutive wives and husbands rather than simultaneous. Why not just switch from consecutive to simultaneous and make everyone happy?
whiskey–
No it can be done. It is done, and effectively.
However it takes skill and often nuance, as well as convincing masculine cred, to pull it off.
There’s a BIG tendency to want to undermine, or ridicule, or even punish it, that’s true.
But when done well, it also pays off big.
What is true is that the threshold for doing it is high. There’s not a lot of forgiveness. Though once you’ve est. yourself, there is. But not before.
That is not how things once were.
That’s not how the are now for blacks or Latinos in the workplace, before they’ve established anything. it’s just assumed and/or permitted.
You reading this too Obsidian?
Dave from Hawaii said:
This is a foolish example of men actually TELLING women what they want while at the same time laughing at women who attempt to do the same to men.
There is not one single bit of fact in your statement. There is nothing based in fact to say that women are “naturally” more inclined to stand by their man and be monogamous then men are. That is PURE myth and lacks any scientific basis at all.
If you are going to make a statement like that, you shouldn’t state it as science or fact, because it’s just your personal opinion and that of society (and in some cases religious belief). Just because you’re “used to” something doesn’t make it “natural”.
“Right now men and women in USA are seriel daters and divorces. They have consecutive wives and husbands rather than simultaneous. Why not just switch from consecutive to simultaneous and make everyone happy?”
Seriously. The woman is making some sense. Monogamy is unnatural for most people, especially men.
Hello. “White girl” is obviously not white.
No shit, sherlock.
thanks dude, you sould help finefantastic! develop her sense of humour.
but be warned: she is Canadaian
”””””””””Pho’ King
whiskey “There’s enough evolutionary evidence to suggest that humans advanced through the use of fire to cook meat and other food resources allowing calories to go to brainpower instead of digestion. That’s a huge advantage. Brains over guts.
Almost … symbolic.”
yes
this why we COOK DOG in viet nam
and eat dog
we win war vs you with our brain and punji stick””””””””””””’
What is lobster or crab or shrimp but sea bugs and we cook em and eat em.
“”Sorry dear, but when you state that plant based fats and protein are the best nutritional source, you show your ignorance of science and basic nutritional facts.”"
Mama can’t do everything for you Dave. You will have to do your own research and reading on this topic. Plus, my “superstitious” comment was not aimed at you, it was aimed at the young man who said that.
You don’t need to indulge every comment of mine with a reply. Follow the Greeks why don’t ya?
Zeets sounds like the type of guy who should be behind a plough.
White Girl
Fred on Everything.
you win war
with McNamara
Maybe white girl is in this?
Does anyone else notice a severe lack of reading comprehension from the “offensive” female commentators here?
Its like…any type of logic just flies over their heads? I don’t get it?! Aren’t women rational, logical, intelligent human beings??!?!!??
Oh, and it’s totally over the top to say that humans are meant to be carnivores just because we have the ability to eat meat. Early man ate raw animal flesh and very few even cooked it. Furthermore animals today are filled with chemicals, steroids, and organisms that weren’t present back when people were “tearing open flesh” of animals with their canine teeth.
So to say that modern man is “meant to eat meat” is false. A modern man is not consuming anything more than “kinda similar” to the meat early man was consuming so to base whether it’s healthy or not on “well the cavepeople ate it” is really pretty stupid.
“I think polyagamous (andry and gyny) relationships are the wave of the future.
Right now men and women in USA are seriel daters and divorces. They have consecutive wives and husbands rather than simultaneous. Why not just switch from consecutive to simultaneous and make everyone happy?”
@WG –
Both men and women are naturally sexually jealous. Monogamy may not be “natural”, but pair bonding is. The reality is that we are wired to both pair bond and cheat the pair bond — and so we are each wired to mate guard and police the pair bond, too.
Even leaving aside such basic realities, an open relationship runs the very real risk of either partner leaving for the lover. This is especially true for women, because women tend to be the ones who are the serial monogamists, and who fall in love with their lovers, whereas men seem to compartmentalize and want to have wife and mistress.
Tsing Loh is simply a recent example of this. Had an affair and admitted in print that she simply could not replace the romantic memory of her lover with her husband any longer — she couldn’t go back, once she had the lover, she was basically done with her husband.
The idea that we can somehow magically open our relationships to polyamory and everything will be fine is simply wish thinking. Human sexual jealousy is real for most people (the number of people who choose open polyamory is tiny). The prevalence of cheating is not an indicator that we are moving toward polyamory, it’s simply an indicator of how we have basically destroyed marriage. If we were moving towards polyamory, you wouldn’t see cheating, you would see a good number of couples openly leading consensual open marriages — where there is no “cheating” precisely because everything is allowed.
How many marriages are like that today? Almost none. And I don’t see anyone seriously pushing for that, because the reality of human sexual jealousy and the wired tendency to mate guard. If widespread polyam were coming anytime soon, there would already be more of it being openly practiced (again, cheating doesn’t count, because cheating takes place on the sly — something completely different from polyam).
only on TV
hahahahhahahahahahhahahahahahhahahahahahha
–Now I’m 36, eating a clean, organic, saturated fat heavy, protein/low-carb/high vegetable diet, and I feel like I have the libido I had when I was 18. While I’m not banging my wife 4 times a day like you are, our sex life is even better now than when we first started dating as young adults…we both lost weight and both of our libidos have picked up dramatically from something as simple as diet change and cutting soy food products out of our diet as much as possible. (Of course, I’m sure it helps that I learned that I was being a fucking pussywhipped beta with my behavior, and once I corrected that, my wife actually lusts me again…)
Even though I haven’t even thought of going the T-Therapy route you advocate, I do notice a distinct difference in my strength training, martial art training, and my sex life. I’m quite positive that the proliferation of soy in the food supply has a significant effect on lowering the natural T levels.–
Dave, good stuff. Glad to have found your comment in the mist of what appears to be a race war. I think you are on to something with regards to soy. One of my problems is severe eczema. I have been fortunate to respond to high dose fish oil. I follow a strict diet routine and last week I was rummaging through my supplement close and noticed a 1/4 full bottle of soy lechitin capsules. I added them to my am and pm pill boxes. Well, I started to break out in eczema patches not less than 24 hours later. I continued taking the lechitin for 3 days and the condition worsened. I stopped two days ago and the inflammation is receding. I should also mention that severe inflammation is a complete libido and energy killer.
I think there is definitely something to the notion that soy is a bad food product. I have also read that Chinese men who consume the most soy are less masculine compared to Chinese men who consume less soy.
Oh WG – I’ve done plenty of reading and research. I even offered you a great starting point so you can actually read for yourself why what you think is the truth is really not.
You don’t need to indulge every comment of mine with a reply.
No indulgences here, it amuses me to confront die hard veg heads like yourself with basic truths…like our biology which is certainly designed to eat animal fats and proteins.
I really could give a shit if you bother to check your preconceived notions and ideologically based dietary lifestyle. I post for the benefit of others.
Along with feminism and “climate change,” dietary conventional wisdom is one of the greatest lies of the modern era…and proponents of vegetarianism are amongst the most deluded when they emphatically argue that meat is bad for the human body…that eating only plant based foods is the best diet.
It’s not.
Tell me dear, how do you get your Vitamin B12? Your Vitamin K? And if you’re not sunbathing regularly, as a vegetarian, you are most likely Vitamin D deficient as well.
@Firepower:
“2. a vegetarian for spiritual/ethical reasons.
3. an advocate of healthy organic, plant-based, raw, super foods for health and apha [sic] reasons.
4. a strident vegan”
I thought you had to be one or the other (vegetarian/vegan), not both.
I mean, vegetarians can drink milk.
Bi-Vegansexuals have been known
to suckle from the teat
of willing coconuts
buckets of beta
semen
Please point to the “logical” comments. I’m seeing a lot of ignorant and racist b.s.
Regarding speculations on my identity, so far we have;
old
white
obese
consumer driven
Applebee’s patron
OR
non-white
lesbian
man-hater
animal rights activist or animal lover
OR
non-white, probably South Asian male
OR
TOOD
Hint: Occam’s Razor is your answer. Google it.
It’s worse than that, Z. It’s Japanese Housewives folk wisdom that when a women reaches menopause and loses her libido, they start to feed their husband as much tofu and unfermented soy as possible to kill his sex drive so he doesn’t want to bother her for sex anymore.
The chinese monks also ate a ton of soy so they could kill the distractions of their libido to focus on meditation.
It’s a complete myth that the oriental people eat vast amounts of soy in their diet. If they did eat soy, it was typically fermented, as in shoyu (soy sauce) miso, natto and tempeh. Fermentation breaks down the phytoestrogens that naturally occur in the soy bean. But unfermented soy, even when it is highly processed like the oil, lecithin and hydrolized or isolated protein, still retains those phytoestrogens that suppress testosterone production in both males and females.
“Do you think that will work? From what I hear, women in the Asian countries that open to marrying foreigners are quickly becoming feminized. The Philipines is famous for gold diggers who really only want you for the money and I know men who have been used and abandoned by “submissive young Filipinas”.”
True story. I’ve only been loosely following the conversation, but everyone should seriously (SRSLY) contemplate the kind of “traditional” woman who will marry a foreigner. Sure, there’re a lot of “traditional” women in the third world who have values that are, perhaps, akin to the values you’d like your future wife to have. But how many “good girls” (by said third world countries’ standards) are going to marry outside their culture and move across the planet to be with their lover.
Answer: None.
SRSLY! Even if the girl is not a former prostitute or something, she’s definitely not “traditional” if she’s marrying outside her super-traditional culture.
“I think polyagamous (andry and gyny) relationships are the wave of the future.”
Hmm.
Nope.
Zylonet,
I heard before that using t will speed up any disease in your body. Like if you where gonna get cancer. That shit will rage through your body instead of just grow.
But yea dude who told me that was still planning on doing it when he was 55 or so.
Sry, the previous comment was:
@ White Girl
Hehe, soy communion wafers for the Church…
Doug,
I read what you said, but I’m afraid I don’t follow, especially wrt Black/Hispanic Men in the workplace. If so inclined, please restate? Thanks.
O
””””””””””””””on July 7, 2009 at 8:30 pm Dave from Hawaii
I think there is definitely something to the notion that soy is a bad food product. I have also read that Chinese men who consume the most soy are less masculine compared to Chinese men who consume less soy.
It’s worse than that, Z. It’s Japanese Housewives folk wisdom that when a women reaches menopause and loses her libido, they start to feed their husband as much tofu and unfermented soy as possible to kill his sex drive so he doesn’t want to bother her for sex anymore.
The chinese monks also ate a ton of soy so they could kill the distractions of their libido to focus on meditation.
It’s a complete myth that the oriental people eat vast amounts of soy in their diet. If they did eat soy, it was typically fermented, as in shoyu (soy sauce) miso, natto and tempeh. Fermentation breaks down the phytoestrogens that naturally occur in the soy bean. But unfermented soy, even when it is highly processed like the oil, lecithin and hydrolized or isolated protein, still retains those phytoestrogens that suppress testosterone production in both males and females.”””””””””””””
That may be why the army started serving soy burgers which was when I stopped eating burgers made by the army.
@zylonet:
“I think there is definitely something to the notion that soy is a bad food product. I have also read that Chinese men who consume the most soy are less masculine compared to Chinese men who consume less soy.”
It is bad for women also; at one point, it became really popular because it was advertised as being able to get rid of PMS. Then, suddenly, it became terrible because it could be dangerous for women at a high risk of developing breast cancer.
I used to get my B-12 from dairy when I was a lacto-veg.
Now that I’ve gone vegan I get it from fermented products and from unwashed organic leafy greens.
Vitamin K – I love cabbage. I love saur kraut so that covers both K and B-12.
Vitamin D is produced within the body. Sunlight activates the production. I am in the sun regularly.
Really, this is all sooooooooooo basic.
Ask me something I have to think in order to answer.
LMAO…good one, DA, I think that’s the first time a post of yours ever got me to lol. Tell Bhetti to get on it and update the website…
Dave -
Correct me if I’m wrong but doesn’t the spray oil (Pam, for instance) have soy lecithin?
oh firepower. how refreshing it is to see you break through this soy discussion with buckets of semen.
””””””””””””””LILGRL,
But how many “good girls” (by said third world countries’ standards) are going to marry outside their culture and move across the planet to be with their lover.””””””””””””””””””””””””””””’
Answer all of them. But sometimes they are such good girls that the guy moves there.
Epoxytocin No. 87:
I was going to put wife/or fling, but didn’t so. I did use the term “wife” loosely. You could just as well say fling/partner/or wife.
The young men typically leave the area to find jobs else where. They travel to a bigger city.
obsidian: I didn’t like Stillmatic, i liked “It Was Written” way more. The track “I Gave You Power” is a great POV type metaphor.
Re: Marrying foreign wives…
what do you think about marrying a girl who is a 1st generation move to america? that is, one who retains there national culture. obviously, the older they move over the better (for maximum resistance to the SWPL).
I’ve been noticing 1st generation asian girls have pretty good attitudes for the most part.
They also arent vegetarian. (whew).
“Correct me if I’m wrong but doesn’t the spray oil (Pam, for instance) have soy lecithin?”
You actually USE Pam???
“”I’ve been noticing 1st generation asian girls have pretty good attitudes for the most part.
They also arent vegetarian. (whew).”"
American ignorance. Most Asians are NOT vegetarian dude.
sigh…
White Girl
of course men are afraid of their wives/gf’s cheating on them.
this is why women and non western peoples can’t create and maintain advanced industrial civilization–they are incapable of understanding its roots.
the most important aspects of civilization are intra-male trust and private property rights.
how does female fidelity tie into this? males cannot cooperate with other males if they are in constant competition with them for females or must live to gaurd their females from other males. advanced technological civilization requires enormous intra-male cooperation to acheive anything–huge shallow networks of men creating and managing complex systems that stretch across the globe and into space.
the genius of the west was the development of male RESOURCE (as distinct from female SEXUAL) monogamy and lifelong marriage. under this regime males could be virtually guaranteed at least female of their level unless they were severely defective–ie a retard or disfigured cripple. by being granted a paterfamilias style ownership rights over that woman, the male had a genuine stake in her wellbeing and the development of offspring he could feel was assuredly his own.
which leads to property. once a man has private property rights he has a stake in the future and the final disposition of tht property. without the assurance that any offspring of the woman to whom he pledges his resources are in fact his a man has little motivation to accumulate wealth and invest capital–these are FUTURE oriented activities and require a legacy to reach fruition.
this is the danger of female sexual liberation–it chops at the roots of the very civilization women leech off of for sustenance.
Oh WG, pride goeth before the fall.
Do you understand why “unwashed” is the key to getting your B12?
That’s because you’re getting the trace amounts of B12 found in insect shit and decayed insect bodies. lol
Here WG, do some reading like you urge everyone else to do…
From The Myths of Vegetarianism:
Me? I’d rather wash my organic greens and eat it with a nice helping of grass fed, organic beef.
(Sorry if this turns out a double post…I think the link got the original post caught in moderation)
Dave from Hawaii:
Thanks for keeping this diet-jargon-free. But would you mind, in more concrete terms, letting me know what exactly you buy, in what kind of stores, what to look for on the meat packaging, etc?
”””””””LILGRL,
SRSLY! Even if the girl is not a former prostitute or something, she’s definitely not “traditional” if she’s marrying outside her super-traditional culture.””””””””’
Best if former prostitute as she is grounded in reality, already had all the alpha cock she could get, plus has a logical side to her.
After going through all that and she still loves your cock and is still extremely feminin and has orgasms through vaginal sex then yea a keeper.
American ignorance. Most Asians are NOT vegetarian dude.
lol RLY? SRSLY.
Hah – btw, brown people aren’t asian.
White Girl – Vitamin K – I love cabbage.
May I introduce you to Mandy’s head?
dana just gave me a boner, as well.
hi dana. nice to meet you.
Mr. M – PAM is garbage…I don’t even know if it has soy lecithin or not…but it’s still garbage.
It’s a highly processed, chemically derived extraction method of the oil that makes it rancid and oxidized before you even heat it up on your stove top.
firepower–
despite my race realism–there only only two ethnes on earth i genuinely despise, Canadians and the Yanomamo indians of Brazil
yech
Dave –
Boo. Its so convenient too.
Old American men are also getting a bad rep in third world cultures for divorcing the women they bring back to USA with them. I know of a few cases and the womens families are really pissed and have done propaganda around their town to warn families about the possibility of this happening.
Flaky dudes who don’t know what they want give the rest of you stable, secure, pillars of truth a bad name.
Regarding first generation Asians. If you can break into the culture and very large, tight family system, ABCDs probably make good husbands. Don’t know about the women making good wives, but probably. But educated Indian women (all first genners are well educated) are career oriented. Family oriented yes, but career oriented also.
“Regarding speculations on my identity, so far we have;”
White girl is probably female and south asian. I am not sure why you chose a posting moniker which implies that you are white.
Do you even know that many white people? Your posting style doesn’t even resemble what a white woman would produce.
@ Gunslingergregi
“Best if former prostitute as she is grounded in reality, already had all the alpha cock she could get, plus has a logical side to her.
After going through all that and she still loves your cock and is still extremely feminin and has orgasms through vaginal sex then yea a keeper.”
I guess…that is one way to look at it.
But…
SRSLY?
LILGIRL -
I guess…that is one way to look at it.
But…
SRSLY?
SRSLY.
Dammit, my response to WG regarding her fallacies regarding plant sources of vitamin B12 and K got caught in moderation….and it doesn’t look like roissy is around to approve.
In short, WG, plant sources of B12 are B12 ANALOGUES, and they can actually inhibit the absorption of real B12.
Oh, and do you know why it is unwashed organic greens that provide you with B12? It’s because your getting it from trace amounts of insect shit, eggs and decayed material. lol
No thanks dear, I’d rather wash my veggies and eat a nice, organic, grass fed steak and free range eggs fried in free range butter from New Zealand.
An excerpt from my long post trapped in moderation….
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qVHRDdLr-dQ
Fitting new song.
Mr. M – use high grade butter. Star Markets carries Anchor brand butter from New Zealand that comes from free range pastured dairy cows. And it tastes hella better than PAM.
Once you start eating real butter regularly, you will find that you can’t believe you actually ever ate garbage like margarine and PAM.
no boners please lol, i’m married–just talk to me like i’m a guy so i don’t have to feel guilty posting here.
there are plenty of whores here to flirt with from what i can see
Dave – haha thanks, you read my mind.
dana – it was more of an intellectual boner, if thats any consolation. how did you come up with that thesis? im impressed a woman (so proclaimed…maybe too good to be true) would think like that.
Well, I guess western industrialization, technology and advancement is on its way out then coz the western world is a mess when it comes to relationships.
The strength in South Asia lies in its tight and extensive family roots.
I would advise every woman and man I know who is looking for stability and real family life to marry a Desi, but they are not open about marrying non-Desis, though it does happen. Also, there are some cultural issues when you marry into such a tight, highly structured, well organized and ancient culture. Cultural differences can be a source of stress. I know many Desi-non Desi couples. Some are working out splendidly (when the non-Desi agrees to everything the Desi family wants) and some are not working out so great.
Divorce is not permitted though, so you must be 100% sure.
But for fidelity and “family values” they can’t be beat!
Dammit, my response to WG regarding her fallacies regarding plant sources of vitamin B12 and K got caught in moderation….and it doesn’t look like roissy is around to approve.
In short, WG, plant sources of B12 are B12 ANALOGUES, and they can actually inhibit the absorption of real B12.
Oh, and do you know why it is unwashed organic greens that provide you with B12? It’s because your getting it from trace amounts of insect shit, eggs and decayed material.
No thanks, I’d rather get my B12 from my free range eggs and butter.
Dana – are you OMW reincarnated? she was another sensible married female commenter.
Mu two things:
1.the hispter thing has taken off in my neck of the woods. Maybe not in Philly but in other cities it has.
2.Although you and I don’t agree on everything, I generally respect you alot along with a few other male commenters like doug1, willmer, chuck, VG and my love lost Default etc… *sigh*
I peeped GNP trying to get you going the other day but you didn’t bite.
*pat on back*
For the most part, they bait you for attention and comments …but this time you were wrong. Your comment really does look as if you were baiting. Your comment was posted pretty early in the thread and it looked like you were saying look what I have nanana booboo thank God I’m not you. Look at the reaction your comment brought about from dana(female), willard, and fiabian.
Roissy is white, a large part of his readership is white and for now, the majority of this country is white. Everything can’t always be about “us” nor should it be. Roissy can only speak/write from a SWPL point of view because for the most part, that’s what he is.
He can’t give you the same thing that a blk PUA would. If you want PUA advice from a blk guy, there are a few of those around the net for you to read.
Furthermore, sometimes it just good to sit back and let other people speak. Every discussion or post doesn’t need to turn into the victim olympics . If seeking_alpha or whiskey wrote something about how their Jewish grandparents suffered during the Nazi occupation of Germany, it’s not your, DA or my place to interrupt him with stories of how our ancestors had it harder blah blah blah. Just let him have his say and listen to his side of things for a few minutes, it won’t kill you
@willardlibby:
“May I introduce you to Mandy’s head?”
So, I’m a Cabbage Patch kid, now?
Still younger than you, old geezer.
@dana:
You’re inspirational.
Whole Foods carries free range, preservative free meat…but their notoriously expensive.
Trader Joe’s carries some excellent, free range bacon.
Safeway here in Hawaii carries free range grass fed beef at about 6.50 a lbs.
I also raise my own egg laying chickens, and I let them run all over my yard so they can eat a varied diet, making their eggs rich in Omega 3 fatty acids, and a whole other host of vitamins. Basically, cheap, factory farmed chicken eggs are kept in pens under artificial light and fed 100% soy feed…putting those phyto-estrogens into your eggs.
I wasn’t exaggerating when I said that soy is in every fucking thing nowadays.
my buckets can
break thru
anything
dana there are plenty of whores here to flirt with from what i can see
Ladies pay this^^^ no attention, another round of troll bait.
Actually LILGIL, the third world prostitute is probably the best potential mate for the aging American man.
Those women are not in that business coz its their first choice, most were forced by life circumstances to enter it. What they really want, like all humans, is love and stability. If an aging American man can give them that and they can give the aging American man what he wants, I think its an ideal match.
The only drawback is STDs.
You know, aging American might be able to exercise their philanthropic gene by marrying third world prostitutes.
That would also put a stop to the exploitative third world sex tourism and sex slave industry.
Its a win-win.
after I’ve finished
he he he
@chicnoir:
By acknowledging it and telling us to ignore it, you’re giving her bitch-side unneeded attention.
When someone’s hiding little gems like that in their posts, pretend not to see them and compliment the good parts of it, if there are any at all.
””””””””””””on July 7, 2009 at 8:52 pm dana
no boners please lol, i’m married–just talk to me like i’m a guy so i don’t have to feel guilty posting here.
there are plenty of whores here to flirt with from what i can see”””””””””””
Yea but your the first poster I actually got a boner from lol
Since your married though yea it has since subsided.
Firepower:
That is…so wrong.
So, so wrong.
Regarding Dana’s little jibe…
Notice how the sisterhood quickly closes ranks with the possibility of insulting ANY female.
What chic, are you saying all the women that participate here are all classy, non-slutty types? lol
AFAIC, there is no shortage of whores here, including self-avowed and proud attention whores…
SRSLY!
SRSLY.
“”Oh, and do you know why it is unwashed organic greens that provide you with B12? It’s because your getting it from trace amounts of insect shit, eggs and decayed material.
No thanks, I’d rather get my B12 from my free range eggs and butter.”"
You pansy. You probably never get your hands dirty and carry bottles of anti-bacterial hand cleanser around with you as well.
ha ha.
America’s obsession with “bacteria” and germs.
oh dear, you done gone and insulted Dave.
oh dear.
ohhhhhhhhh dear.
Back to the topic of polyamory or polygamy.
Has anyone here ever been in a polyamorous relationship and what was the dynamic?
mr.m
i have spent my whole life studying civilization starting with sumer and always asked one question–why?
why here not there? why this culture not that one. why rome not west africa, 19th century england not sri lanka?
there are many angles from which to approach this question–ie, jared diamond’s gun, germs, steel thesis–which ignores property rights and gender roles.
but i looked at rome and colonial england and saw 2 things, great evidence of private property rights and their enforcement via contract and paterfamilias style hypermonogamous family ideal. though there was divorce in rome, most patrician families married “confareatto” (sp. might be off)–for life
the American modern mistake–in a nutshell, misunderstanding monogamy.
MALE monogamy was/is RESOURCE monogamy–polygamy isn’t about sex, it’s about supporting multiple wives and their offspring. a woman can be confident in such a society that her mate isn’t expending money on a nother woman’s child and doesn’t chafe so at the bit of ownership. she was assured of being cared for in old age and not discarded for a young new wife and couldhappily devote herself to home and hearth.
read about life in the harem, it’s a dysfunctional universe of fear hatred jealousy and resentment–not a happy home.
FEMALE monogamy has always been SEXUAL monogamy specifically to ensure that errant wives didn’t cause bad blood between men who had to work together and to ensure a man could confidently invest in his genetic legacy for the future.
i saw that this was the common thread of the west, and when this broke down, civilization wasn’t far behind
i love civilization–give me AC, razors, running water–abundant food, hygeinic cotton clothes, cars planes cell phones, antibiotics, lifesaving surgery
that such monogamy is unnatural is irrelevant–civilization is an affront and a rebuke to “nature”, a slap in its filthy murderous face.
dana –
for my reaction to your thoughts, please refer to firepower’s bucket analogy….intellectually speaking, of course.
Do the experts here think that if guys acted less “gay” and submissive towards these educated, high-T bitches, that the alpha females would be more attracted to them? Of are these women actually attracted to these kinds of feminine guys?
Jack -
Yes. No (partially).
@Dave from Hawaii:
“Notice how the sisterhood quickly closes ranks with the possibility of insulting ANY female.”
It just struck me as hostile. I wasn’t going to attack her or draw attention to it until chic noir did (that was rather ironic).
As it is, dana did say a number of intelligent things, so I decided to compliment her.
“What chic, are you saying all the women that participate here are all classy, non-slutty types? lol”
Oh dear, a certain name just came to mind. xD
I think you know who I’m thinking of.
“AFAIC, there is no shortage of whores here, including self-avowed and proud attention whores…
SRSLY!”
And I know who you’re referencing here.
LMAO…just as you deride people for making assumptions about you, you go and commit the exact same error.
Pansy?
Sorry, my little deluded veg-head, but I’m very much in touch with my natural design and place in the food chain.
I kill my own food, I clean it myself, and I eat it with gusto.
I’d rather clean off my vegetables and not have to rely on insect shit to get my B12.
@Mandy! xD- you’re right.
@dave in hawaii- Notice how the sisterhood quickly closes ranks with the possibility of insulting ANY female.
What chic, are you saying all the women that participate here are all classy, non-slutty types?
I only know the e-person of the females here and they seem okay to me.
I asked them to ignore the comment because it’s the female version of GNP to MU type race baiting comment.
AFAIC, there is no shortage of whores here, including self-avowed and proud attention whores…
but DA hasn’t commented much today.
SRSLY!
Passive aggressiveness is not an attractive quality in a woman thoughtless of a man. Anyway, the woman you’re referring too doesn’t comment much. She should not be hated because so many men here find her attractive and her boyfriend is hot.
“Has anyone here ever been in a polyamorous relationship and what was the dynamic?”
It’s my MO.
I like to have multiple girlfriends. I like for my one boyfriend to have multiple girlfriends. I like to share girlfriends with him. If he wanted, I wouldn’t care if he had boyfriends.
Anyways, I would like a willing man to marry me and have a few kids with me, get cut and then bang whichever other women he wants for the rest of his days. He won’t get them preggers and he can raise children with me. I will have girlfriends on the side and try to share them when I can. I am not interested in sleeping with additional men at all.
””””””””’Dave from Hawaii
I’d rather clean off my vegetables and not have to rely on insect shit to get my B12.”””””””
omg lol I don’t think that has ever been said before in history.
chic – LILGirl is one of my fav efemales here. She contributes a feminine quality to the commentary. I wasn’t insulting her…SRSLY, as she proudly wrote that she was an attention whore on her blog. lol
@dana:
“that such monogamy is unnatural is irrelevant–civilization is an affront and a rebuke to “nature”, a slap in its filthy murderous face.”
Precisely. You could say it’s the id, you could call “nature” the tendency for humans to be barbarian.
Take a look at the ten commandments; one could argue that not following the ten commandments is following nature. But society and civilization hopefully remove and condition us so we can function and work together.
I think I mentioned this on The DC Metro Crash post, but the main reason that our crime rates are decreasing is from trusting other people. Someone on here said that trust wasn’t necessary, but in reality, every day, every moment of our lives, we are trusting other people. We trust that people won’t beat us up and steal our things, we trust that someone won’t go psycho and kill people. And for the most part, people don’t, either from fear of the law, or from an ideological standpoint and understanding of property ownership, and that each man has a right to life.
The main issue, nowadays, is that our culture and our laws are changing in regards to marriage and relationships between men and women.
chic noir i have little or no use for the discourse of women, as i am neither one of your children or a man trying to bang you i also don’t have to pretend to listen to your blather.
Jack, depends on what you consider “feminine”.
I have recently found out that in the USA a vegetarian diet is considered “feminine” by some men. But my guess is that these men are 1. living in a cultural vacuum and 2. insecure about their “manhood”.
On the other hand, motivational speaker types like David Deida, John Gray, Michael Jacsz, all of whom state over and over that they are “masculine core” men, strike me as very feminine. Though uber-soft, sticky sweet, fake, airy fairy women find them “manly”.
Here on this site “grilling bbq” was considered “masculine”.
I think Americans are very confused about what is masculine and feminine and their concepts are often fused with sexuality.
Regardless of diet or concepts like “sexual polarity”, to me a man is masculine when he takes responsibility for his actions and choices in life and does the right thing.
This could mean stepping up to prevent an elder in his or his wife’s family from entering an old age home and bringing that elder home to live with him under the care and attention of him and his wife.
To me, masculinity has a lot to do with ethics, taking responsibility, and engaging with the world in a detached yet compassionate manner.
I think men and women of today, at least in this country are confused, don’t know who they are or what they want.
Its sad and very unattractive.
@dana:
“…a man trying to bang you…”
That was a little crude.
I haven’t met many women who use that word to describe the sex act.
they’re sort of both the same: mean little wilderness misanthropes in homespun skins
…but one has Hockey Night
napoleon chagnon would eat you
and not in that good way
White Girl
Do you think that will work?
of course it will –
1) I have done wieghts since 15yo – it reduces the aging process
2) the benefit of having gone thru swpl western divorce is that I have my assets and income well protected by trusts and corportae structures (I am in tax law and work for myself)
3) I will bring her back and train her to by my secretary and run the office after she has proven herself as worthy over a 2 year period – then if she is lucky I will marry her.
4) She will need to be able to drive a boat to get off the island without me (this I will not train her in)
5) our kids will have fantastic suntans (which is improtant where I live)
And most importantly
6) I have already got the nursing home and Reagan Books picked out.
””””””’White Girl
insecure””””””’
he did it again.
FeministX
Anyways, I would like a willing man to marry me and have a few kids with me, get cut and then bang whichever other women he wants for the rest of his days. He won’t get them preggers and he can raise children with me. I will have girlfriends on the side and try to share them when I can. I am not interested in sleeping with additional men at all.
Do you have any secretarial skills? can you interpret rulings and case law?
Do asian women leave their countries with men they are not married too? As American trash culture reached THAT far? Wow. Those who do must either be sex workers or not have families. Like I said above, I think it would be great philanthropy for aging American men to marry third world prostitutes and the fact that you will hand your business over to her is even better.
Best of luck Older Man!
WG – other than your vegetarian propaganda, I don’t really disagree with you…just your tone. You are yet again, just another female that has come to this blog, and addressed us from a tone of female superiority, talking down on us all as if we need yet another FEMALE to set us men straight.
You deign to tell us what is masculine.
You act as if what is attractive to you is some kind of standard we should all aspire to conform to.
Yes, much of what you lament about this country is certainly true. What you fail to realize is that the majority of the men on this blog understand EXACTLY how and why our society has literally begun to fall apart and decline…and it’s precisely because the feminine-matriarchal paradigm has become ascendant, and the traditional Patriarchal nuclear family has been decimated.
You talk about gender confusion here, you’re preaching to the choir.
But you can take your sanctimony and shove it up your gassy vegetarian bowels, because your female superiority complex screams out in everything you write here. Some of the problems we can attribute to our current civilization’s decline is in part due to men failing to stand up for themselves and buckling under this feminine superiority and contempt you practically drip with in every post.
dave to chic – LILGirl is one of my fav efemales here.
Dave I apologize. I thought you were slyly going after lilgrl.
White girl If your an American, it don’t matter if you’re black or white – your a product of a messed up family system and that is where your insecurities lie. Bottom line.
Here^^^ you speak too much truth for these parts. I notice that the more bitter commenters often come from broken homes. Too many parents want to “be happy” instead of doing what’s right for their children.
“pisses on the white girl”
That may be a first too but I don’t think so.
The girls are out to Bingo and the boys are gettin’ stinko,
And we think no more of Inco on a Sudbury Saturday night.
The glasses they will tinkle when our eyes begin to twinkle,
And we’ll think no more of Inco on a Sudbury Saturday night.
I fuckin hate Canadians.
Feministx
WHY THE HELL has it taken you until now to say so??????
Perhaps you are just coming to this view. If it really is how you want to manage your primarily lesbian desires, combined with (you say and perhaps you genuinely do hope, I can now maybe believe) hypergamous ones for one clearly alpha man to raise children with, it might really work.
I still have a problem with your hating men stance. If you seriously moderated that as well, hell.
How could you possibly not know that I for one would support you with views like this if I believed them? You’re a very bright girl who can and does think out of the box. At one point on this forum you tried to flirt with me in an eflirt only kind of way, after openly saying you thought my views about you were important for what this place thought of you. How could you not sense that saying something like this would lead me to believe you were trying a solution that could work?
I may have even suggested something like this to you once. I know I thought about saying it on here.
This makes sense for and with you Feministx. This could work. This way you really might attract a real alpha in a stable relationship that could work for both of you. An unusual one, yes.
If you make me believe this is real, I think I’m about to do, or am already well under way in doing, a 180 about you.
You may just find you have a big fan.
(How about dropping some of the general man hate though too, and become more compassionate there?)
dana
chic noir i have little or no use for the discourse of women, as i am neither one of your children
I dont’ have any children.
or a man trying to bang you i also don’t have to pretend to listen to your blather
We can agree to keep our distance then .
* handshake*
firepower, it was chagnons book that made me hate them. i had a bizarre histamine reaction to my stint as an anthro major–i came away from it loathing tribal people and wanting to exterminate them
mandy-i use male language to express to women what i think of them because in my mind i feel like a man that’s not attracted to women or interested in them for anything at all–consequently i understand how men REALLY feel about women they aren’t fucking–which is exactly what i expressed to chick noir. and because i am not a man and NEVER have to worry about trying to fuck a woman i can be honest–they can’t
don’t try to play suss out the troll, i am exactly what i say i am–from what i understand you are very young and quite bright, but pretty typically feminine in your mode of expression– i on the other hand am an older, fairly high T female lawyer type, an objectivist, an askenazi jew and an intj–outlier central.
@Dave from Hawaii:
“You are yet again, just another female that has come to this blog, and addressed us from a tone of female superiority, talking down on us all as if we need yet another FEMALE to set us men straight.”
If I ever do this, let me know please.
Dave, please. I stated again and again that I am not pushing a “vegetarian agenda” but was just suggesting to those who wanted more energy to ADD healthy foods to their SAD. It was you or someone else who got into the whole “vegetarian” thing which means for some reason you, or the others, felt threatened.
I have noticed this about non-veg people. I never make an issue around non-veggies about being a vegetarian. THEY are the ones who always make the issue with me. What gives?
Regarding my opinions on “masculinity”. Jack asked a question of the females here and I gave my 2 cents. It was a reply to HIM.
I don’t agree with you that the nuclear family is the solution to the problem, I think the nuclear family was actually part of the beginning of the problem and I think the Desi model of joint and extended families is ideal, if it could be tweaked somewhat for the West.
One of the benefits of living in a joint family system or having extended family nearby is help for young mothers and women suffering from post partum depression.
The lack of family connections in the US will be its downfall, nothing else.
All male/female issues spring from this.
but DA hasn’t commented much today.
David was playing grown up today. Plus, I’d rather lose at Madden ‘09 to my nephew than spend time on a topic that really isn’t compelling enough for me to consider writing comments.
White Girl
1) All this talk about “prostitutes” is just standard shaming language – please try something new!
2) She will not necessarily be Asian, there are many many more options. Who knows.. if chic noir really looks like her old thumbnail picture that she could be a candidate
3) She will definately not be a s3x worker. Just normal and traditional
4) She will not get the business, she’ll answer the phones take messages, open the mail and go to the post office.
5) My sons will get any / all the inheritance and be responsible for judiciously handing out any weekly allowances to any remaining womenfolk, based on how they well treated me, how often they visited me at the nursing home.
it would be great philanthropy
you are dead right it will be… I consider it my duty to gift to the world a future generation with a good classical education and right wing conservative values.
@dana:
Ok, just checking.
Even though you have a brusque demeanor, I do appreciate what you have to say. In fact, your attitude might drive it home better than the frills and flowers I might add to my comments.
That being said, you do make sense, and I think we could get along.
””””””””don’t try to play suss out the troll, i am exactly what i say i am–from what i understand you are very young and quite bright, but pretty typically feminine in your mode of expression– i on the other hand am an older, fairly high T female lawyer type, an objectivist, an askenazi jew and an intj–outlier central.”””””””’
Oh shit well I need one of those in my harem too. Just now know what to look for.
So dana what is your iq.
WAIS or Stanford Binet?
i’ll let you judge the static g from my content. no internet credentials
Normal and traditional Asian women do not leave their countries with foreign men they are not married to.
Now, here in USA and possibly Latin America you will find women willing to leave their hometowns and families to go off with men they are not married to who can still be considered “normal and traditional” perhaps.
Its kind of like that “slut defense” posing we were talking about yesterday here. i.e. the standards are set low as to what is considered “normal and traditional”.
And the pros comment was not meant to “shame” , why should it? It was in response to what another commenter wrote, that the only Asian women who would leave their countries with a foriegner would not be the “good girls” (by THEIR country’s standards). In USA, anything goes.
And there would be absolutely nothing wrong with marrying a prostitute. They are humans who need love too.
older man,
You have planned on every eventuality it would seem. So tax preparer huh.
Interesting.
“WHY THE HELL has it taken you until now to say so??????”
When did I ever say anything different? Perhaps I didn’t lay that all out in one post before, but that’s the way my relationships have been and will continue to be.
“(How about dropping some of the general man hate though too, and become more compassionate there?)”
How about no.
“If you make me believe this is real, I think I’m about to do, or am already well under way in doing, a 180 about you.”
Suit yourself. But I fear that if you don’t continue to spew venom towards me, then I might have some incentive to waste more time on this blog.
@FeministX:
“I like to have multiple girlfriends. I like for my one boyfriend to have multiple girlfriends. I like to share girlfriends with him. If he wanted, I wouldn’t care if he had boyfriends.”
I once was friends with a girl whose boyfriend allowed her to form sexual/romantic relationships with other women. He was allowed to do the same with men. The only difference was that he couldn’t have other girlfriends and she couldn’t have other boyfriends.
They’re still together, and it’s been five years.
yep – don’t dissuade just yet. We’re expecting a blogpost with plenty of pics from the Jaclyn Smith bikini Collection
If I ever do this, let me know please.
You couldn’t succeed at it even if you wanted to. innocent littlemandy.
I’ll concede you didn’t really push that…but understand that it’s rather common to run into militant vegetarians that act as if their diet is the one true way to salvation, and that meat eaters are subhuman maniacal murdering maniacs.
Also, when you make assertions like plant sources are the best sources of proteins and fats, I will not such falsehoods go unchallenged. Many vegetarians frequently point to the abomination that is factory farming, and it’s inhumane treatment of the animals, the crowded conditions, the chemically altered feeds and hormones, and the environmental degradation, and use that to indict meat eating in and of itself as unwholesome.
Sorry, you cannot paint that all with such a broad brush. I eat fish caught fresh from the sea, I eat pigs I catch living in the rainforest and I raise my own chickens so I control what foods I eat…and any vegetarian that tries to tell me that such a diet is inferior to a strictly plant based diet, I’ll laugh in their face.
Yes, there are plenty of beneficial plant sources of protein and fat – nuts, avocado, coconut etc…but the meat and fat from free range animals eating there natural diets is second-to-none in providing bio-available vitamins and nutrients.
Mandy, if you want your ideas to be taken seriously by men in print you have to drop all moonlight and magnolia, it’s the ;iterary equivalent of flashing your tits. If you are young and pretty most men won’t hear a word you are saying in person, so it won’t matter–but they can’t see you in writing so you can actually have real conversations about your ideas with them.
Mandy, if you want your ideas to be taken seriously by men in print you have to drop all moonlight and magnolia, it’s the literary equivalent of flashing your tits. If you are young and pretty most men won’t hear a word you are saying in person, so it won’t matter–but they can’t see you in writing so you can actually have real conversations about your ideas with them.
White Girl
And there would be absolutely nothing wrong with marrying a prostitute. They are humans who need love too.
but they have no other skills like office / professional skills, homemaking / cooking / caring skills etc etc.
Personally I’d rather marry a 6.5 who could
1) Teach my kids how to read and play piano
2) Make the house a loving wholesome environment for them to grow up in
Than a 10 who had none of these essential skills.
Gunslingergregi
older man,
You have planned on every eventuality it would seem. So tax preparer huh.
you will note the 2 go hand in hand…. It is very common / almost the rule in traditonal societies for the first son to get the inheritance…. the’ve long figured out that a mans death could be hastened by a wife who saw a paycheck at the end of it.
How is Iraq going? are you out yet?
Only North America or Western Europe would interpret polyandry or polygyny in a solely sexual way.
This is why it will never work here. No social cohesion, direction or higher goals in life other than orgasms and being “happy”.
“1) Teach my kids how to read and play piano
2) Make the house a loving wholesome environment for them to grow up in”
I can play the piano. But I won’t marry you. I’m out of your league. Therin lies the rub.
You are yet again, just another female that has come to this blog, and addressed us from a tone of female superiority, talking down on us all as if we need yet another FEMALE to set us men straight.
One of the most unpleasant things you discover once you get into game is just how increadibly arrogant most women are beneath the polite, pleasant front they present to the world. They get away with it because there is an incredible amount of male stupidity and pigheadedness for them to point to, but they never think to do the kind of intense self scrutiny required to make accurate judgments. Men often think badly, but women don’t think at all.
thursday–women are arrogant for the same reason blacks are, no one ever tells them what they really think of them.
Feministx–
Will you ever stop fronting?
You never said anything like this before on here with respect to how you would treat your husband, and allow him, and try to facilitate even, and so on. Not once. Never. Not once. Show me where you did. Quote and link.
As for simultaneous lesbian relationships, well sure. I think you may have implied or said that you sometimes did go that way. It certainly doesn’t jar with what you did say.
How about then you’re still going to have big problems with almost any self respecting alpha. You can have strong views on alphas versus beta men, no probs, but to hate and devalue men as a gender to the extent you seem to, probs.
Such nastiness towards men at your core.
(I did not spew venom at you. Rather I cooly analayzed you and found a whole lot of your sexual self description with respect to men contradictory, false, constructed on the fly, and so on. A lot of men and women as well on here tended to agree with me. Some just liked your body pics.)
Fabian While I acknowledge people have certain drives motivated by our evolutionary past, these drives can be partially or totally controlled by our own individual choices, and by the pressures of culture
I agree
A bax- Alot of the dysfunction we see in American black families (high rates of illegitimacy, high criminality, excessive alcoholism, etc.) has its roots in tribal African norms
This is false Sir. Illegitimacy is frowned upon across Africa. There are very few ethnic groups where illegitimacy is not viewed negatively. It you took the time to read about African culture you would know that many tribes pull the bed sheets to look for blood on the wedding night or they have some other measures to discourage females from having premarital sex.
Some tribes/ethnic groups aren’t as stringent on virginity but they discourage females from “getting around”. The example, Maasai allow unmarried women up to three partners before marriage.
abax
To be sure, the imposition of the welfare state in America has exacerbated the problem among American blacks
The welfare state brought about problems because women could not have a man, husband or boyfriend, living with in the home and collect a welfare check.So if you were a stay at home mom and your husband’s suddenly lost his job because the company sent the factory over seas or to another state, you had to make a choice.
You can either get rid of your husband and collect a welfare check to support your children or you can keep your husband but do without money and food. I should add that welfare recipients weren’t allowed to own some types of appliances like toasters. If they had one, they needed to hide it when the social worker came around. The same thing with a man if a woman dared to keep one in the house.
What was formally taboo became normal because a number of families found themselves in the same boat. If half of the people around you are having children and no husband, it’s no longer revolting. If anything it’s the new normal, after all everyone else is doing it.
That type of reasoning, explains a large chunk of human behavior.
DA added some pieces to the welfare problem as well, you can dig thru the archives for more info.
Collecting a welfare check for 1 year would have been no more harmful than collecting unemployment for 1 year had that anti-man mandate not been added to the qualifications.
FYI, Most black people who are Mu’s age have grandparents who were/are married.
As S.eve Sailer has written what he knows very little about …Black people. There are plenty of Black people on this site for you to cross check things he has written about blk people before you quote him. A lot of the stuff he writes about Black people(culturally) is simply preposterous.
@DA- I like when you’re an adult who makes non game comments.
Doug1 wrote…
“These DC lawyer chick types can be very bright. And filled with endless amounts of ideological argument to counter male bravado. A lot of their available argument is male crafted. The left has tons of resources and brainy wordsmiths.”
True. However, at a deeper level they know its BS. Engage and you might be surprised to discover how shallow their belief goes because its based on group reinforcement not reality. Their “ideological argument” is impervious to reason because its a rationalization — you have to get them were reality hits them in the face, why are they attracted to and fuck the jerks and a-holes? Why are you so unhappy DC Lawyer cunt?
Still here contemplating leaving like I do every once in a while.
That is why I am making the wife financially stable on her own so she can be free to decide to stay with me or not with no thought about money. See if it works out. Got to test em. Got to make sure you really got a one in a billion. he he he
I guess I do have white mans disease.
Why sometimes I think I may be a plague on asia to an extent. I really don’t want it to turn into us type shit divorce laws stuff like that. although I can see the seeds when I check the indo channels on tv of there demise.
FeministX
I can play the piano. But I won’t marry you. I’m out of your league. Therin lies the rub.
Your inability to make a wholesome environment for kids to grow up in is duly noted……
Dont worry you are not alone.. Most Modern western women cant do this…. Hence ADHD, skyrocketing autism figures, millions of kids with “learning and discipline problems” etc etc.
Luckly White western men can “leapfrog” over this current bad batch of women by living the bachelor lifestyle until age 55 – 65 and then marrying a traditional girl from the Third world…..
“How about then you’re still going to have big problems with almost any self respecting alpha.”
Never had a problem attracting alphas. I mean, I operate in real life, where men can see my T&A. Mostly they don’t care what my opinions are. As for my attitude towards men, sorry dude, no man complains that I detest other men. If I am sucking him off, he’s more than happy to hear that I think every other man is the scum of the earth.
“(I did not spew venom at you. Rather I cooly analayzed you and found a whole lot of your sexual self description with respect to men contradictory, false, constructed on the fly, and so on. A lot of men and women as well on here tended to agree with me.”
Congrats Doug. You got the posters at Roissy to turn against a female whose name starts with the word feminist. Sure that is a sign of the accuracy and potency of your cool analysis.
Anyways, we should be friends. Can’t get water to run upstream. Can’t get me to stop detesting 90% of males.
Billboards with the visa logo advertising credit card.
The problem is it is very difficult to stop multi national corps from doing whatever they want if they don’t care if they only make under 10 percent on the money and have billions of dollars or when they can even lose money and get free money to work with to further their programs.
If they are truly “traditional” by their culture’s standards they will not marry a foreigner. If they are “traditional” by United State’s standards, they will.
well, then. In that case,
i can’t pass out next to you with a bag full of heads
and a nose full of coca
you’ve killed The Dream
it’s over
el chief wrote…
“I swear there is something in the water. All that bisphenol, and those phthalates, and estrogen. It’s fucking everyone up. I am gonna start drinking reverse-osmosis water.”
Soy, cow’s milk and cheese have hormones that are bio active in humans. Some people are more sensitive than others. Stick to red wine not processed with casein and you’ll be fine.
White Girl
If they are truly “traditional” by their culture’s standards they will not marry a foreigner. If they are “traditional” by United State’s standards, they will.
How do you explain the Bazillions of them coming here alone for jobs / hope of a better life then???? Everytime I advertise I get 75% applicants who are freshly imported
Obsidian:
Stillmatic was garbage. The shortcomings of this album are compounded by my favorite Nas track, ‘Made You Look’, appearing on his following album: he was still capable of so much better.
For the record, I regard the purple tape as the best hip hop album; ‘Getto Millionaire’ by Royal Flush is my favorite (this title changes hands every few months, but it’s always something from the 90s).
Present day hip hop music is 95% garbage. I’d recommend Random Axe to everyone as the up and coming album of the year. Of course, Cam’ron keeps it ignorant and deeply philosophical with splendid results.
But what I’d really recommend is some nice vocal progressive trance.
@dana:
“Mandy, if you want your ideas to be taken seriously by men in print you have to drop all moonlight and magnolia, it’s the literary equivalent of flashing your tits. If you are young and pretty most men won’t hear a word you are saying in person, so it won’t matter–but they can’t see you in writing so you can actually have real conversations about your ideas with them.”
That’s why I’ve learned a lot about men in the time I’ve been reading Roissy, and even more when I participated in leaving comments.
Even my boyfriend confessed something to me. He said,”Well, guys are pretty single-minded. We think about sleeping, eating, and sex. So, if you’re talking to me, and I say huh? afterwards, you can probably figure out what I’m thinking about.”
He said it in a joking manner, but there’s always a little truth to “just kidding.”
The Older Man said:
“…Teach my kids how to read and play piano…”
Wow, so I can also use my *mAdd P1An0 Sk1llz* to nab a man? xD
Learning an instrument is the gift that keeps on giving.
“”How do you explain the Bazillions of them coming here alone for jobs / hope of a better life then???? “”
From which countries?
Also, leaving one’s country for a better education or job oppurtunity so that you can send money back to your family in X country is different than running off with some foreign dude you are not married to.
Nonetheless, my experience within Asia is in India and standards there are very high. I’m willing to concede that not all of Asia has the same standards.
naa FeministX never got my dick hard.
iq thing must not be true.
White Girl–
You are pushing an anti white male agenda, ooohhing and ahhhing at black men in comparison to white men in another thread in about as provocative a manner as you could manage without being an obvious caricature (except, well), and Indian men for different, family loyalty kinds of reasons, and finding just about everything about white men bad that you find worth talking about here.
On this a blog by a white male PUA expert with all kinds of gender realism knowledge and insight, and obvious attended primarily by white males.
It’s that old female strategy of attention whore by insult, which American white men unfortunately tolerate too much.
(You may be an Euro kind of white girl, or a S. Asian Hindu or Jain etc, sort of Caucasian (not what’s generally meant by “white” including by Desi’s in America or Britain or elsewhere in Europe), whatever. Probably the later.)
Mandy, I’ve often wondered if guys are really as simple as they claim. They seem pretty complicated to me.
My problem is that I like tofu. Has there been any scientific evidence to link soy with health problems in women? I’ve read much alluding to that but nothing conclusive.
I guess I do have white mans disease.
Why sometimes I think I may be a plague on asia to an extent. I really don’t want it to turn into us type shit divorce laws stuff like that. although I can see the seeds when I check the indo channels on tv of there demise.
further on this
maybe the guy who came up with the divorce laws was actually thinking he would do a countrywide test. Maybe he really thought that woman were equal and that they would be above abusing power.
We all know how that turned out.
@The Older Man:
“Hence ADHD”
Note that nowadays, cases of mental illness or learning disabilities are skyrocketing. One could argue that it’s because society is messed up. One could argue that it’s because society is more accepting of these disorders.
Or, one could argue, at least in the case of ADHD, that children don’t spend enough time outside, are raised by the television, and that schoolteachers want all children to be like zombies. Kids will be kids. And most ADHD diagnoses are done by teachers, and immediately children are sent to the psychiatrist to get a prescription.
The drug companies make an incredible amount of money on ritalin and all these medications, so they keep pushing them.
And well-meaning parents think they are doing their children right by medicating them, when, in fact, it may be a misdiagnosis.
You can start here.
http://www.westonaprice.org/soy/darkside.html
There’s even more on it here:
http://www.soyonlineservice.co.nz/
Doug1, the Desi claim to “caucasianhood” cracks me up.
I am not anti-white-male any more than I am anti-white- female.
If you had intellectual integrity you would acknowledge that I’ve dissed the American white female along with American white male. Both are products of divorce and messed up childhoods.
I never “ooh’d and ahh’d” over Black dudes. Don’t react like a TBW, typical black woman.
I acknowledged that their physiques were generally better looking than other men’s, and that’s it. I have no more interest in forming a life bond with a black man than I do with a white man.
Desi men have their issues too but they are more family oriented than others. Otherwise I don’t ahh or ooh over them either.
I’m not an ahher or ohher over anybody.
Don’t take it personal.
I’m talking cultures here, NOT individuals.
When I say asians I am not including indians in that.
@White Girl:
“Mandy, I’ve often wondered if guys are really as simple as they claim. They seem pretty complicated to me.”
Well, they’re people.
Just be nice to them and they won’t bite.
haha, I kid I kid.
Guys are alright. Listen and learn. My motto.
“My problem is that I like tofu. Has there been any scientific evidence to link soy with health problems in women? I’ve read much alluding to that but nothing conclusive.”
I think it has to do with things like soy milk, and not the way it is consumed in East Asia.
I’m not entirely sure though.
A lot of American snack foods contain soy products. Soybean oils and flour and whatnot.
RE: ADHD. I’ve developed some symptoms since using the internet. I think the internet is a contributor as well.
Again, my links are trapped in moderation….must remember to not use <a href anchor tags when roissy isn't around….
Google "soy online service new zealand."
Than google "Weston A. Price Foundation to FDA: Soy is No Health Food"
I feel so sorry for little kids. I see so many of them suffering emotionally because they are not being brought up in a functional and loving two parent family home. I think that right there is the cause of a lot of “ailments” in kids these days.
Also, according to the guys here, guys are not all that simple. A woman in good faith may give her time, love and attention to a man only to find that when she loses her original figure, starts greying and wrinkling, her man will cheat on her, despite all the love she gave him.
That’s not simple. That’s drama.
maurice:
1. Your women love you. Why’re you finding it difficult to shift your game into her supporting what makes you you, what you care about and what hurts more men becoming like you?
2. Women hate betas in a sexual context and that is easy to tap into. (sorry, betas, they do)
3. Women vote for alpha. You do not need the whole country or the majority of the population, you just need the ‘alphas’ on your side and more of them, in power.
Basically it’s even easier to get support widespread more through women than through men, with all that ’style over substance’ preference often commented on (in a critical manner but USE IT USE IT USE IT. You have studied female nature and what it responds to intimately, so use it). And you should be believing that there is substance too, so that is covered as well.
This is simplistic. But everything starts at the home. And I’m wanting to trigger more thinking that way.
Yea I will never forget when I was in the army. I knew a 29 year old guy who married a woman with a kid before he joined army. Anyway the kid was like 10 to 12 and he smoked some weed. The stepdad wanted to handle it by giving the kid a beating for smoking the weed. Well the mom was like you can’t beat the kid of course the kid became only her kid. He didn’t do it. They did it the moms way and the kid was sent to a home for kids with drug problems where he proceeded to be given all kinds of fucking drugs and learning about a whole spectrum of new drugs he would never have known about. All he did was smoke some week and this was in germany where it shouldn’t have been that big of a deal. That kid got fucked up.
maurice: that was directed at male audience in general, rather than you specifically. I remember you attempting, at least.
How did that go?
“The typical DC couple has reversed polarity.”
Like in hyenas.
“I see so many of them suffering emotionally because they are not being brought up in a functional and loving two parent family home.”
Very few people can achieve this. It’s not generally possible since males and females are so different in their personas and sexual interests that they become incompatible.
The desi model of forcing random people to remain in outmoded traditional roles from arranged marriages leads to worse strife than almost all western marriages I have seen. Broken home is so much better than bullshit marriage, which is what *a lot* of arranged marriages are.
@WhiteGirl:
“Also, according to the guys here, guys are not all that simple. A woman in good faith may give her time, love and attention to a man only to find that when she loses her original figure, starts greying and wrinkling, her man will cheat on her, despite all the love she gave him.
That’s not simple. That’s drama.”
What people say and what people do are two entirely different things.
After 15, 20 years of a good, stable, happy marriage, a man may no longer feel that way. People change, they mature, they get older.
I can’t speak for every male here, but I do know that some may agree with me.
Feministx–
Sure Feministx, for casual sex or a fling. Particularly if he’s seeing other chickas and you’re fine with it.
Married, living together and raising kids is another thing.
If you genuinely really loved him, big diff. i already said having strongly alpha/beta gradient feelings about men isn’t a big problem with a lot of alphas or actually one at all. It can be a draw.
It’s more the not respecting what men as a group have done. Like you know. Technology. Fighting off the military enemies — other men that might well be and probably are “even worse”. Invention of all kinds. Not saying women can’t do any of these things; am saying that kind do the military stuff competitively and probably not the inventing and being real geniuses and so on either- fully competitively. Certainly haven’t, still.
@Mandy
“I haven’t met many women who use that word to describe the sex act.”
True. Women will even use “fuck” more often than “bang,” especially in certain moments.
FeministX, I disagree with you that very few people can achieve providing a functional and loving home for their kids.
If they can’t, they shouldn’t be having kids in the first place.
@Keith:
I think it’s because “bang” sounds more active and aggressive.
“If they can’t, they shouldn’t be having kids in the first place.
”
Don’t say that. That’s why smart people don’t reproduce. Because they know they can’t give kids that ideal without sacrificing too much of themselves.
@ dana:
for someone who seems to see herself as a highly enlightened, supremely logical person you are awfully fond of making blanket statements. those statements may very well be accurate, but they completely lack both precision and relevance.
here’s a crazy idea: good ideas are good ideas, and good systems of social organization are good systems of organization. other than making yourself feel better for having happened to be born white – congratulations on that outstanding accomplishment! – what is the point of attaching a race, ethnicity or gender to everything?
“Don’t say that. That’s why smart people don’t reproduce. Because they know they can’t give kids that ideal without sacrificing too much of themselves.”
That’s why they’re smart. They know that you can’t be selfish and have kids.
Kids is all about sacrifice. If you are not willing to sacrifice for the next 20 years of your life, don’t have kids.
Simple as that.
How about this: Rather than spending time, money and energy on learning how to become an alpha PUA, you guys spend time, money and energy on learning how to become good husbands and dads. Then form an organization that presents to the world as a United Front what you have to offer women. Then say you are accepting applications from women interested in becoming loving and loyal wives.
Basically you’d be preparing yourselves and then throwing the ball in the women’s court.
I bet you’d find takers! And its a lot nobler than becoming a PUA and probably less stressful as well.
But I bet you guys don’t want that.
Mandy–
ADHD is much more commonly diagnosed now that before, and it’s something like 3/1 more often believed to be the case among boys than girls.
Let’s call a spade a spade. The natural aggression of little boys at school is being greatly suppressed and discouraged and punished by largely female feminist influenced and male feminist influenced or outnumbered and cowed teachers and administrators. Boys fights are immediately stopped. Pulling girls hair or pushing a girl down is a crime, punishable by suspension if repeated.
@ White Girl –
That doesn’t work in the current legal climate, unfortunately. The current legal climate encourages people to end marriages when problems come along, regardless of their earlier feelings of being “against that kind of thing” or “pro-marriage and commitment” and so on. There is simply no enforceable commitment in marriage any longer. Unless the law is changed, marrying a woman under the idea of being loyal and loving is not really advisable at all under the current legal regime.
Until the laws around marriage are changed, the decline of marriage will continue apace. And I don’t expect the laws around marriage to be changed anytime soon, due to political realities — i.e., no-one of any political stripe is really in favor of doing so.
@ white girl:
try as you might to be different than the feminists, you’re essentially saying the same things that they are. ‘this situation is fucked up, men, and it’s your job to fix it.’
granted, there are any number of commitment phobic cads and deadbeat dads, but i don’t know that they are either the majority or the real problem. the majority of divorces are filed for by women. what’s more, in many cases the reasons given are nebulous terms like ‘lack of fulfillment’ or ‘lack of emotional support’. what that really means is ‘my husband stopped turning me on.’
most men are perfectly capable of being good husbands, fathers, boyfriends, companions, etc. the problem is that contemporary women want all that and to be continually seduced by the men in their life. if there’s any area in which most men actually need improvement it’s in being more alpha.
@Mandy “I think it’s because “bang” sounds more active and aggressive.”
It’s because “bang” sounds one-sided, like something the guy does TO the girl. I’ve never heard the phrase “they banged.”
Meditation introduced in schools has shown some improvement with kids. I think a martial arts (to get out the aggression) and meditation combo (the two go hand in hand anyway) would work well with kids.
Novaseeker, despite the laws there are still sub-cultures in the States that have extremely low to no divorce rates. Hasid Jews, Amish, Desis, and I’m sure there are more.
We need to emulate them. Not in all ways, but damn, they got something to teach us.
lance, save your effeminate vaporings and ad hominem arguments and refute the content of my point. generalizations are GENERALLY true when based on extensive observation and/or statistics. by definition the do not apply to EVERY member of the class being discussed. they are useful for communicating ideas–that’s the last time i will address the generalization argument.
women and blacks are routinely lied to by whites and males and shielded from their true thoughts, that’s why “racism” and “sexism” are always such a shock to them. i defy one person here to support the notion that the average women knows what the average man REALLY thinks or that the average black person knows what the average white person thinks of them.
“someone who seems to see herself as a highly enlightened, supremely logical person” <==as for this, what is it about some people's reading comprehension that causes them to read ONLY things people DON'T type?
please point to where i asserted i was 'highly enlightened' whatever that bunch of feminine lefty gobblydygook means or that i was supremely logical?
better yet–prove i am illogical by refuting something i say competently without resorting to "you are racist" and "waaa no matter how accurate a stereotype is its mean to say it!"
trying to use social shaming on an intj is always funny
Lance, why would a woman feel unfulfilled in a marriage? All it takes is some romance and “date nights” from her husband.
Are husbands not being romantic?
Are they watching porn?
What are the husbands doing or not doing to make their wives feel unfulfilled?
Keith it was idiomatic, as in i am not “a man that’s trying to bang you”. the MAN in context would say bang.
so keith and lance are women, yeah?
Naa white girl the problem is everything is still in the frame of life is not worth living.
So how the fuck can the west be worth saving.
@White Girl “What are the husbands doing or not doing to make their wives feel unfulfilled?”
Their husbands are losers who spend all their time referring to themselves as alpha males and ranting about feminists, so the wives ditch their sorry asses.
Mandy! xD – @willardlibby: “May I introduce you to Mandy’s head?”
So, I’m a Cabbage Patch kid, now?
Still younger than you, old geezer.
You are 17 years old you airheaded mall rat.
You’re younger than everybody on this site.
The West is probably not worth saving, but who’s going to exterminate it?
My question is, and this is posed towards a man who’s wife has divorced him….. what was YOUR role in the break up of the marriage? Or were you being the loving, romantic, attentive partner who never did anything wrong but she still left you???
@ White Girl –
The subculture idea has been floated before.
It is an interesting concept, but in reality the existing subcultures like the amish and hasidim are all very small, detached from the main culture, generally geographically concentrated, and connected to much older, solid traditions that have not been specifically trashed by the main culture. And there is a strong ethnic identity (and often religious identity) element as well, generally.
None of that really applies to trying to found a new subculture, one that is not based on an old established tradition (other than the western tradition which has been thoroughly trashed and debunked), one that is not based on ethnic and religious ties, and one that is not geographically concentrated.
As I say, it’s an interesting idea, but I think it’s doubtful it could work for most men and women in this culture.
Dana iq what is it?
“The West is probably not worth saving, but who’s going to exterminate it?”
Islamists! Feminists! Democrats! Obama! Capitalists! Jews! Republicans! Blacks! Gays! Corporations! Banks! The Illuminati! Rosecrucians! The Gold Standard! The Irish! Immigrants! Area 51!
My question is, and this is posed towards a man who’s wife has divorced him….. what was YOUR role in the break up of the marriage? Or were you being the loving, romantic, attentive partner who never did anything wrong but she still left you???
GAME: The idea that she left you because you were a loving[read:cloying], romantic[read:needy], attentive[read:obsessive] partner[read:not a husband or a man, but demasculinised 'partner'] and nothing else. These men’re also called kitchen bitches by their wives/devils in prada.
I’ve heard this; men are suddenly surprised when their wives say to them, ” i can’t go on, let’s separate”.
Nothing happens in a vacuum. Women are more finely tuned to the “pulse” of a relationship. Women know BEFORE a man does that a relationship is breaking down. Men are often clueless.
It takes two to tango.
Men must’ve contributed to some aspect of the breakdown of a marriage.
Fess up.
It was either the porn or the lack of romance.
–Was doing some reading re: testosterone levels… I wouldn’t be surprised if the suggested drop in T levels is primarily caused by diet on 2 levels.
1) chemically altered food
2) obesity
I do have a question, are there any side effects you’ve noticed on your personal self? Increased anger/aggression/yelling? Can’t be all peaches and cream..!–
Testosterone is actually very calming because it increases your ability to handle stress and fatigue. You also suffer from higher confidence so it really works out well.
The only negative side affects I noticed, and remember I use a normal protocol not a steroid protocol, is the increased water retention and prostate enlargement when estrogen is not properly managed. The water retention is easy to see and is about 4 pounds worth. The prostate enlargement is easy to feel when you can’t urinate freely. The protocol I posted, perfectly addresses those problems. So today, everything is peaches and cream.
lance, save your vaporing about generalizations and your “social shaming” about unpopular opinions and refute my point.
Generalizations are GENERALLY true and by definition do not apply to every member of the class under discussion.
Fact: women and blacks are routinely shielded from the truth about how males and whites feel about them. That’s why they are always shocked..SHOCKED! by ‘racism’ and ’sexism’
as for this gobbledygook “for someone who seems to see herself as a highly enlightened, supremely logical person” please point to where i said that.
Here’s my take on this topic… most of you were probably too young or not even born in the late sixties and the seventies when the feminists took over the universities and the culture. It was a very big deal and they even called it the war between the sexes back then. I was just a pup but I do remember it. The war was rigged by the MSM and the feminists won the first round of the battle. This was epitomized by the battle of the century — Billie Jean King -v- Bobby Riggs in a tennis match to “settle” the issue. Of course, by design BJK won and it was hailed as a great victory and proof that women and men are “equals”. The adult men at the time did not realize what sort of wool was just pulled over their eyes — but scam it was and soon followed the all the equal rights non-sense and pro-feminist legislation. The only push back was that the ERA — or Equal Rights Amendment was not passed, thank goodness.
As an aside, in the late seventies when my parents were on the verge of a divorce my father once confided in me (and he’s not a very open man) that he blamed the feminists for wrecking his marriage. At the time I was too young to understand the meaning but now I see and agree.
Okay, so after 40 years of feminism what has been accomplished? They have destroyed marriage and any concept of the feminine or masculine and have created two generations of (mostly) miserable men and women. But now thanks to the internet the establishment’s ability to control the culture is gone. This has reengaged the battle between the sexes that was unfairly won by the feminists in the ’70’s and opened the door to challenge many pretty and ugly lies on blogs like this that could not be challenged prior to the internet. Its similar to how the catholic church lost its power when the printing press was invented.
Roissy is right about the role reversal and it is disgusting to watch. I tell my girlfriends that someone has to lead and someone has to follow… there is only one steering wheel, one tv remote and one lead on the dance floor and the nature of the sex act and consistency require that it has to be the man. If she does not like how I fuck, drive, channel surf or dance she can find another man but she must respect my masculinity. Feminism is at odds with that irrefutable fact.
As far as the guys at roissy’s outing — I think that many men today are confused and need to read this blog but some are happy to relinquish the responsibility to be a man.
you’re not really that daft are you? do you really think that fifty percent of marriages end in divorce because men are too busy watching porn to plan date night?
maybe a lot of women feel unfulfilled because they swallowed a bunch of feminist tripe and are increasingly beginning to realize that it was nonsense.
maybe a lot of woman are naturally fickle and as men become less assertive, a la roissy’s post, those women lose a steadying influence in their lives and the center cannot hold.
maybe no-fault divorce and the increasing fiscal emancipation of women has eroded the need for many women to remain in marriages they don’t feel completely satisfied with.
you see where i’m going? these are very complex issues, which you seem to love boiling down to ‘blame men’. and maybe you’re partly correct, but not in the way you think. the beauty of the nuclear family is that it allows men and women to complement each other. as men become more emasculated, that dynamic breaks down. again, teaching men to be more alpha is exactly what is necessary to save the institution of marriage, and western society as we know it.
Women hate betas in a sexual context and that is easy to tap into.
More proof of the truth. May pretty lies perish in sacrifice at the altar of the Church.
@WG –
Listen to Bhetti.
The worst thing to do in a marriage in the US is to be a “loving, romantic, attentive partner”. That gets you in the “boring” box very quickly after the kids come along.
Instead, you need to be a dominant, assertive alpha who keeps her in line. Those are the marriages that work best, because that is, in reality, what women want — regardless of what they say.
But .. men listen to women saying things like you said, and then watch as their wives run off with some edgy, dominant guy 5-10 years into the marriage, because they are bored to death with their loving, romantic, attentive partners, and crave the excitement of a firm, assertive, dominant man.
But this is a classic case of women saying one thing, but wanting another, and many men being foolish enough to listen to what is being said, rather than observing what is being done in other marriages.
@doug1:
“Let’s call a spade a spade. The natural aggression of little boys at school is being greatly suppressed and discouraged and punished by largely female feminist influenced and male feminist influenced or outnumbered and cowed teachers and administrators. Boys fights are immediately stopped. Pulling girls hair or pushing a girl down is a crime, punishable by suspension if repeated.”
Boys Fighting each other is also a crime.
And seriously, little boys chasing girls or maybe playfully pushing them is their way of flirting. That’s what they do.
The other day I asked my boyfriend, who has four brothers, why guys fight, and he said,”It builds character.”
That’s what boys will do. I think the only person I’ve heard arguing it was my father (who has two brothers), but he was raised on a farm, where he could run around for acres and do all sorts of boy mischief and let out all that energy.
Kids need PE. They need to run around outside. This is coming from a girl who had to write “I will not do cartwheels in class” thirty times once. ;-; Kindergarten.
@Keith:
“It’s because “bang” sounds one-sided, like something the guy does TO the girl. I’ve never heard the phrase “they banged.”
That’s hilarious. Now I want to use that to see how people will react.
@dana:
“so keith and lance are women, yeah?”
You’re evil. xD
Roissy, you keep making fun of vegetarians but have failed to reconcile the reality of racial differences in intelligence with animal rights.
Using the logic that we should be allowed to exploit and eat animals because they’re stupid and we conquered them, we can use the same rationale to justify slavery-because blacks are inferior mentally and we can easily re enslave them if we want.
@ dana:
why would i attempt to socially shame you in this environment? your race realist ideas are certainly no means for ostracism in this crowd.
here’s a crazy idea: maybe blacks and women are shocked by racism and sexism, because in america in 2009 they are actually shocking. that is, most intelligent people see the utility of judging people on what they actually say and do and don’t feel the need to resort to stereotypes and generalizations… no matter how generally true they are.
i’ll ask again? what is the value of attaching race and gender to ideas? ideas are inherently devoid of such arbitrary attachments. anyone with a brain is capable of making use of a good idea. the only point to racial cheer leading is to make one feel better about having been born a member of some particular group. in the parlance of this blog, that’s pretty beta.
The Dave,
Have you ever been in a long term relationship with a woman?
Relationships don’t work this way: Don’t like how I f*ck? F*ck off!
Relationships are COMPROMISE. Give and take.
It would probably be hard for all of us to find someone other than our own mothers who would love us exactly the way we are when we are left alone with ourselves picking our butts and engaging in other personal and self-centered habits.
We tweak ourselves for inter-action with others.
If you don’t tweak yourself, you will never get ahead in any sphere in this world.
Also, Roissy’s piece is off the mark regarding “masculinity” and “femininity”. Communications is a woman’s domain. The fact that a woman was dominating the BBQ conversation is a feminine trait, not a masculine one.
Some research on how the human brain functions and the differences in brain function between men and women needs to be done.
Don’t remain confused. Knowledge is power.
the_alpha_male
Zylonet:
“As to your advice to start lifting weights – it is worthless for enhancing T into the top 1%. Tons of powerlifters are low-T BETA men. Lifting weight’s barely nudges t-levels and most people who train, overtrain so their levels are actually at risk.”
Not according to this:
http://www.ergo-log.com/traintest.html–
Alpha,
Ergo-log is good stuff. However, the study only validates my claim that working out is worthless for enhancing T into the top 1%. A 40% increase is not going to take men to the 1,000 – 1,200 ng/dl which is where the he-man feelings can really materialize.
Good link. Thanks.
“so keith and lance are women, yeah?”
Dana, beg all you want; we still won’t bang.
@John Smith:
How can you compare an animal like a cow to a sentient human being?
I think your logic is a little flawed.
”””””””on July 7, 2009 at 11:19 pm White Girl
The West is probably not worth saving, but who’s going to exterminate it?
My question is, and this is posed towards a man who’s wife has divorced him….. what was YOUR role in the break up of the marriage? Or were you being the loving, romantic, attentive partner who never did anything wrong but she still left you???””””””””””””””””
I told her to get the fuck out three years before and she didn’t leave. Then three years later she cheated on me.
Moral if you tell them to get the fuck out make sure to follow through.
Swimming is good for building testosterone?
So y’all are saying women don’t want loving and romantic men? That’s b.s.
Women need to be re-assured of their men’s interest in them otherwise they become insecure. Being romantic does not mean being needy or clingy. It means BEING ROMANTIC.
@WhiteGirl “So y’all are saying women don’t want loving and romantic men? That’s b.s.”
White Girl, you poor poor dear.
Don’t you understand there are only two types of men; dominant alphas who don’t take no guff and fuck 85 women a week, or weakling betas who pee sitting down?
And if you show any consideration for a woman at all and any tendency towards pair bonding or fidelity, you’re one of those weakling betas who’s bound to get left for an alpha?
White Girl, you’re in for some miseducation. Enjoy the ride.
””””’Zylonet,
I do have a question, are there any side effects you’ve noticed on your personal self? Increased anger/aggression/yelling? Can’t be all peaches and cream..!–
Testosterone is actually very calming because it increases your ability to handle stress and fatigue. You also suffer from higher confidence so it really works out well. ”””””””
Increased testosterone with lack of sex makes you really really want to kill people.
@WhiteGirl:
“The fact that a woman was dominating the BBQ conversation is a feminine trait, not a masculine one.”
Yes, it’s not unusual for a woman to be a female hostess, but did you read how she sat down at their table and just took over their conversation?
I don’t know, that’s kind of weird.
Instead, you need to be a dominant, assertive alpha who keeps her in line.
What if you don’t want to be a dominant, assertive alpha?
“What if you don’t want to be a dominant, assertive alpha?”
Then don’t get married, DA. I don’t think that will be an issue for you, though.
@Keith:
Watch out, any minute someone’s going to go stomping through and edit your post to say you like to stuff your junk between your legs.
A woman taking over a conversation is weird??? Isn’t that what they (we) usually do? LOL.
Keith, you’re funny.
Honestly, this whole PUA thing is kind of funny. I first came across it and actually wrote down some of the tips as “motivational mantras”. Not for picking people up but just for improving my attitude and confidence. But I see that beyond the confidence building skills is a very misogynistic side. Negativity is not life affirming and will not get you ahead. I learned that from my own experiences in life. I also used to come from a place of bitterness and sought to empower myself from that place, but it didn’t work. I just became miserable. Nobody else became miserable, I did.
”””””’Mandy,
Boys Fighting each other is also a crime. ”””””””
Again lurker was right.
Man how could I have doubted lurker dang.
@DA:
For being a beta, you tend to show some alpha qualities. Like standing up to I don’t know how many people on a blog, daily, screaming out your crazy beliefs.
And you know, having comebacks to insults, etc.
The self-proclaimed beta may soon be in conflict with his wimpy self.
What Dana said about male cooperation.
Yes, it’s true many women only feel, not think.
Lance — There is no group more filled with hatred for the opposite sex than women. Period. If women could kill every Beta Male in America who was White and Straight by pushing a button, they’d break their fingers pushing it over and over again. And Blacks? No group more filled with racist hate. Trinity United and the huge attendance, or Louis Farrakhan, make my point. Blacks as a group ignored Dr. King’s warnings and became the very thing they hated. Other than skin color and robes, there is no difference between Louis Farrakhan, Jeremiah Wright, Al Sharpton, and Barack Obama on the one hand, and George Wallace, Bull Connor, and Strom Thurmond on the other. Take Thurmond and Wright. Both hate the men of the other race, but found the women just fine for fooling around. [Wright has been named the respondent in two divorce actions by White men divorcing their White spouses for adultery, Thurmond famously sired a daughter by a Black housemaid.]
So please stop with the moralizing and status-mongering. Accept human beings for who they are — fallen and filled with hatred and prejudices, women and non-Whites the worst among them.
Somehow I doubt no matter how sweet and submissive I would have been….. he would have eventually cheated on me. We women suffer from the same lack of trust and insecurities as you men.
What Women Want
True Story: I have had a couple of stalkers. One was a real problem because she was an underling at work. She was insanely insistent and I had no where to hide She knew that I knew that I was vulnerable to a psycho-bitch approach on her part. It felt like having the daughter of the Local Mafioso Don declare crazily intense and possessive love for you. Basically, looking ahead, you see good way to survive.
So, what to do? I got to know her better and then started acting emotionally dependent and needy. In two weeks she drifted away.
“Somehow I doubt no matter how sweet and submissive I would have been….. he would have eventually cheated on me. We women suffer from the same lack of trust and insecurities as you men.”
But what did you do gto make him cheat on you?
Fess up. Remember it takes two to tango, and cheating doesn’t happen in a vacuum.
@Mandy
“Watch out, any minute someone’s going to go stomping through and edit your post to say you like to stuff your junk between your legs.”
Good, that tells me I landed a good punch.;)
lol rum
My first job constantly fucking harrassed to fuck/date the chick who was in charge. This bitch did not take no for an answer. Sent other chicks to help lol
When I became a waiter they wouldn’t keep there fucking hands off me.
@ whiskey:
those ‘well, they do it too’ arguments are best left in kindergarten where they originated. i condemn black racism as quickly, and with as much vigor, as i condemn white racism.
i’ll confess that i don’t know what ’status-mongering’ is, but i’ll stop moralizing when people stop spewing racist nonsense and calling it courage.
Ha. Ha. He didn’t cheat. But I felt that he would have simply because I was not his physical type and their were other issues.
He declined in offering affection and romance (yes, we women want that) and that made me close off. I wanted to be romantic and affectionate but thought he was not into it or would not reciprocate.
Also, I was afraid to open up to him fully. Afraid of rejection. Sometimes he used what I opened up to him about against me in arguments.
Would you tell your innermost secrets and feelings to someone who would use them against you as ammo?
Anyway, I’m with you guys. F*ck relationships. They suck. Better to live and die alone than live and die in pain.
Every ethnic clan or nationality since the beginning of time has nurtured feelings of superiority. What I love about this country is that, by and large, the essential attitude has been, “Even though you are an (X) and I feel deeply superior to you in every way you still deserve a fair shot at making the team.” In my opinion, that is as good as it ever gets in politics and human affairs.
Of course, the whole idea of affirmative action fucked that over.
today’s post on androgyny has brought all the liberals, women, and fags out in full force.
SO, VHAT VOULD YOU SAY ISS, LIKE, ZHA “IN” RELIGION ZHIS SEASON?
Never get involved with an ethnic superiority person (unless you are a member of their ethnic group). That was another issue.
“If women could kill every Beta Male in America who was White and Straight by pushing a button, they’d break their fingers pushing it over and over again.”
@Whiskey –
I think that’s an exaggeration.
I would go back to what Bhetti said earlier.
The revulsion for betas is sexual in nature. So I think a lot of women would be fine if betas were simply neutered (like we do with tomcats, for example), or if they were gay (as you’ve pointed out yourself, one of the main reasons feminism is so supportive of gay men — they wish more betas were open to being gay so that they would leave them the heck alone sexually).
Canon, if you think this post is about androgeny, you really need to get out more.
“Would you tell your innermost secrets and feelings to someone who would use them against you as ammo?
Anyway, I’m with you guys. F*ck relationships. They suck. Better to live and die alone than live and die in pain.”
But for you personally why not go back to South Asia and have an arranged marriage with an extended family? Sounds like a reasonable solution for you?
Yea I had to become fat to get woman to somewhat leave me the fuck alone.
Sometimes you don’t want a fat bitch to beg for your cock.
Mine was a beta, though a good looking one. The secret is that women really want to smother men with love but we are afraid to do so, so we don’t. We hold back a lot because we are afraid of getting hurt.
Also, guys who are more into their own looks than the looks of their women – not cool.
@ nova:
even that is an exaggeration. women have plenty of uses for beta males: asexual companionship, dinner dates, ego boosts, adopted fathers to their bastard kids…
I’m white and wasn’t born there. If I was a DBD (desi born desi), I would’ve been married years ago, by default.
I’m done with “relationships” – im with you guys.
Smothering is not a good idea — it reads as clingy and neither men nor women like that. I think some men try to smother women with affection, too, but learn that this backfires because it is often read as desperation and lack of options, both of which are not attractive.
White Girl
Everybody is a member of an ethnically superior group(in their own mind). I know I am.
let’s not be stupid here, feminist X is nowhere -near- goodlooking enough to get commitment from an ‘Alpha’.
even with letting him fuck the rest of the world.
ain’t gonna happen
unless she never turns around… i always hate girls that are so perfect from the back… but then a train wreck from the front
Imagine being used as a “comfort zone” until what he is really looking for comes along!
“even that is an exaggeration. women have plenty of uses for beta males: asexual companionship, dinner dates, ego boosts, adopted fathers to their bastard kids…”
@lance –
*grins*
“I’m white and wasn’t born there. If I was a DBD (desi born desi), I would’ve been married years ago, by default. ”
@WG –
Noted. Oh well, you still may find someone at some stage, but it would be much harder.
The ethnic thing was an issue too.
Have of you ever met an afro-centric dude with a white girlfriend? LOL. does that make any sense whatsoever?
Actually, i don’t want to get married.
“The revulsion for betas is sexual in nature.”
Great, so when we say beta, do we mean the bottom 80% of guys, or the bottom 10%, or what?
I’ll buy that most guys would have a hard time picking up women at a bar, partly because most women are less willing to sleep with guys immediately off of “pick-ups.”
But most of these guys acquire women about as attractive as they are (or more attractive than they are in a place like DC, which has a lot more females than males), and the women and the guys really like each other, at least for awhile.
In general, what percent of relationships begin in bars and clubs? What percent of marriages?
It just doesn’t make sense to generalize from bar/club pickup dynamics.
@WG –
Well you learned some things from that relationship, it seems. Internalize them, catalog them, and avoid the issue-laden things in the future. At least now you have a part of your red flag catalog filled out.
Then don’t get married, DA. I don’t think that will be an issue for you, though.
Don’t make my secret optimistic side that hopes for the best and thinks the sweet average girl* with nails is a great partner…
*white girl of course…
For being a beta, you tend to show some alpha qualities. Like standing up to I don’t know how many people on a blog, daily, screaming out your crazy beliefs.
I fail to see how that counts as alpha and how that conflicts with being wimpy and sub-human…
@bhetti – what exactly did that post(s) have to do with me? what did i answer? remind me – i missed the reference.
@dana 8:40 9:11 – great stuff, very interesting posts. can you recommend any anthro references (books, articles, etc.) related to the topics of this board?
@doug – groan, ouch. don’t feed the evil troll… you tried to be nice, and you were instantly pwn’d i could see it coming. a leopard doesn’t change its stripes.
@white girl- sorry to be ruder than i usually try to be, but i’ve come to the conclusion that you’re an arrogant, obtuse bore. who doesn’t understand the premises and perspectives of the board. one note topics like raw foods, veganism, promiscuity of the west, etc. .. over and over again, not meaningfully absorbing or reacting to info by other commenters. i usually encourage female posters here, and am nicer than most of the dudes, because i think the female perspective (given acceptance of the roissy worldview) is valuable. and, you know, sausage boards suck, as some other commenter once said.
related beef/rant- what’s up with these 20-something indian chicks showing up on sites like this? WG, LSB, FemX (a particualry lurid construct). and looking down their upper-caste noses at us poor, ignorant american men? i suspect it’s because they know they’re about to be married off by their parents to some beta engineer or doctor, and there’s not a damn thing they can do about it. so they live vicariously on the internet by dissing the men they can never have (or in FemX’s case, imagining she has.) caught between two worlds- not an easy place to be.
news flash: india is not a model for us, and we generally don’t give a shit about it. the country is 95+% illiterate subsistence farmers, living in villages without electricity. the system of arranged marriages between families and clans, accordingly, is roughly where the west was 500 years ago, in the middle ages. that’s our salvation? we should care about that? Not. Same with the vegetarian obsession. you care, we don’t. write about something interesting or relevant to the board, please.
/end rant.
“In general, what percent of relationships begin in bars and clubs? What percent of marriages?
It just doesn’t make sense to generalize from bar/club pickup dynamics.”
Keith –
I agree with that, but that doesn’t mean that women don’t find “betas” (meaning men who are relatively unmasculine, relatively unskilled at pushing their attractional buttons, relatively undominant) sexually attractive, regardless of how they meet them.
Remember, it was a woman — Bhetti — who said first in this thread what I did. As in: “2. Women hate betas in a sexual context and that is easy to tap into. (sorry, betas, they do)”. And Bhetti, IIRC, is an islamic med student, and not a bar/club hopper.
WG
I was inclinded to give you a break but you are starting to come across as either a complete troll or a fat chick. Not a good thing either way.
even that is an exaggeration. women have plenty of uses for beta males: asexual companionship, dinner dates, ego boosts, adopted fathers to their bastard kids…
In turn, I get female attention, a dinner partner, and somebody who thinks I’m sweet. And in lieu of adopting her kids, you simply hand over some checks, buy some gifts, install a few things, and do a little babysitting so you can feel useful, exert some paternal usefulness, but yet have none of the heavy financial and other related responsibilities of raising a child with a woman.
Nova, I relate to men who have been hurt by women and therefore have written them/us off. I know the inner vacuum where that resignation is coming from.
It’s better to never marry here. It will only end in divorce and pain.
Friends are the answer. Not “relationships”.
@Keith:
“Good, that tells me I landed a good punch.;)”
Keith aka The Boxer.
Jamaican Rum, like I care?
Tood stop the bullshit and just come out with it.
“Nova, I relate to men who have been hurt by women and therefore have written them/us off. I know the inner vacuum where that resignation is coming from.
It’s better to never marry here. It will only end in divorce and pain.
Friends are the answer. Not “relationships”.”
@WG –
I actually haven’t written off women. Women are great. I have a great relationship with a fantastic woman underway.
You’ll find that many men who are interested in Game and related topics actually love women quite a bit. Sure there are misogynists, too. That’s because a lot of men come to this with anger, bitterness, resentment and so on. But for quite a few, once they learn how women tick, and stop blaming women for how they tick, they can move beyond the misogyny and actually enjoy women for who they are, and enjoy giving women what most of them really like. Remember, Roissy has his own use for Game, but I would say that many guys who use some elements of Game are not using it to become a PUA, but simply to sustain good relationships with women. Certainly Dave from Hawaii is a prominent example of that here.
Roissy,
I suggest that (if you have the time) you start up one of those forum type things for these discussions; 500 responses on a single page is just too much. Look at phpBB, it’s free.
Also, did you see my suggestion to you about contributing an article to a reputable webzine which fully explains your insight that Kay Hymowitz and her ilk are nothing more than old-style feminsts? I wrote to Michael Blowhard asking him to bruit your name about likely publications and he agreed it was a good idea.
@novaseeker
“Remember, it was a woman — Bhetti — who said first in this thread what I did. As in: “2. Women hate betas in a sexual context and that is easy to tap into. (sorry, betas, they do)”. And Bhetti, IIRC, is an islamic med student, and not a bar/club hopper.”
You all hate on any woman who says otherwise, and insist she must by lying, so your citation of Bhetti is weak.
Of course, part of your problem is the phrase “beta” itself, since it, by definition, defines something as lesser. It’s a self-fulfilling prophecy.
In fact, a woman who buys into this alpha/beta stuff is likely to end up more unhappy, because she’s psychologically downgrading certain traits that are desirable in a mate and even a lover.
And from what I saw on Bhetti’s blog, she really hated a pretty narrow definition of beta.
Nova, if you think women are a mystery and hard to figure out…..men are the same for women.
“men are simple”
how so?
this is one of the codes that i still can’t crack. how are they simple, if they are?
the pursuance of becoming an alpha male seems pretty complicated to me.
i think men are drama queens actually. there’s no telling what they want and even they dont know.
men are simple is an urban myth
@novaseeker, Whitegirl:
“As in: “2. Women hate betas in a sexual context and that is easy to tap into. (sorry, betas, they do)”.”
It’s true. It’s 100% true. I’m not a bar/club hopper. A lot of my social interactions were started or guided by a government funded institution called SCHOOL.
Although, what is beta and what isn’t beta might be a little different for me. It might be a little different person to person. But it doesn’t mean they don’t exist.
IMO, any guy who is crazy and obssessed and stalkerish is beta.
Prime example (phone conversation with a beta two weeks ago):
Me: I have a boyfriend.
Beta: It’s ok! I don’t care! I just really, really like you, and I feel bad because you’ve been avoiding me, and I think it had to do with the fact that I didn’t smile in those group pictures from three months ago, and can I go by your house? please? Please?
Me: Oh, I’m busy with something. I have chores to do. Swamped. So…bye.
Instead of harassing me and obssessing over what it was he did wrong, and begging me to still talk to him (at one point, he tried to guilt trip me by saying that the death of a distant family member of his two years prior made him that way, and while I did ask him if he was okay, it just made me more turned off towards him) he could have polished his game and tried other girls.
This is why guys need to learn game. Yes, WhiteGirl, some guys may choose to use game to get lots and lots of hot chicks. But others just want a beautiful, great wife they can spend their life with and raise a family with, and this is their way of interacting with women and creating a good, romantic, sexual relationship. Others might just want several good relationships. I don’t know. Game can be used for lots and lots of different things.
“You all hate on any woman who says otherwise, and insist she must by lying, so your citation of Bhetti is weak.
Of course, part of your problem is the phrase “beta” itself, since it, by definition, defines something as lesser. It’s a self-fulfilling prophecy.
In fact, a woman who buys into this alpha/beta stuff is likely to end up more unhappy, because she’s psychologically downgrading certain traits that are desirable in a mate and even a lover. ”
@Keith –
There are other women who say the same thing. Lady Raine, who is loathed here, nevertheless says she only considers alphas. Same for Feministx, again not exactly a popular poster here. aoefe — same thing.
Look, Keith, I know you don’t want that to be the case, and want to say women here are saying that to become popular, but I see both popular and unpopular women here saying the same thing about what they find sexually attractive.
What you’re saying is that women need to compromise and accept some “beta” traits that are good in a husband (not a lover, at least not what most of the women here say) in order to find a good mate. That’s fair enough, but it doesn’t apply in a culture where women do not socially or economically *need* mates.
Why not, indeed, follow what Cristina Nehring advises, and eschew becoming any man’s “mate”, but pursue excitement, adventure, and dangerous liaisons while being a single mother? That seems to be what prominent women thinkers like Nehring are advising women, and that advice is not coming from a hatred of men. It’s coming from what those women writers actually crave. They are being honest.
WG
Yes you care. You care about this more than anything else. Fit women never say the things you do. I know about this. Trust me.
““men are simple”
how so?
this is one of the codes that i still can’t crack. how are they simple, if they are?
the pursuance of becoming an alpha male seems pretty complicated to me.
i think men are drama queens actually. there’s no telling what they want and even they dont know.
men are simple is an urban myth”
I think men and women each have their complexities, but what men want in the mating game is more straightforward: they want, generally, the best looking woman who will have them, provided she has other qualities that would make a good mate. For guys who are into casual sex, of course, that changes, because then it is about seduction of women for casual sex — so anything that achieves that goal is deployed, whether it is truthful or not — it is goal oriented. And yes some guys will use women for a while as they wait for someone better to come along — pretty shitty behavior, but there are shitheads of both the male and female variety.
Dana started her sentence:
women and blacks are routinely lied to by whites and males and shielded from their true thoughts, that’s why “racism” and “sexism” are always such a shock to them. i defy one person here to support the notion that the average women knows what the average man REALLY thinks or that the average black person knows what the average white person thinks of them
Lance started his sentence:
for someone who seems to see herself as a highly enlightened, supremely logical person you are awfully fond of making blanket statements. those statements may very well be accurate, but they completely lack both precision and relevance.
aoefe say:
I simply find it interesting that neither one of them capitalize their sentences.
Carry on.
Another thing: going out in public and getting all sorts of compliments from people about your looks but not one single comment from you man? And feeling that hes embarrased to be seen with you in public coz you are not the same skin tone as him…..
arranged marriage within same cultures is the only way to go.
@Keith:
“In fact, a woman who buys into this alpha/beta stuff is likely to end up more unhappy, because she’s psychologically downgrading certain traits that are desirable in a mate and even a lover.
And from what I saw on Bhetti’s blog, she really hated a pretty narrow definition of beta.”
Note what I said about betas.
I think someone’s definition of a beta might change slightly from person to person.
I think I’m pretty liberal with it. Anyone who isn’t crazy, clingy, and/or obsessed isn’t beta.
@Keith,
BINGO !!!!!
I believe Roissy’s alpha/beta dichotomy and understanding of women is mostly true, but it is incomplete. I’ve tried to include “Special Snowflake” theory here, but others don’t accept it. Women’s rational forebrains need to be reassured that the suitor is genuine, truly understands her and values her for more than just her sexual value.
Nova
if men want the best looking woman they can get, how will they ever know if they get married that that was the best he could ever get? therefore he will always be thinking ” i couldve gotten better” and looking around, “could i have gotten her?”
and then there’s the phenomena of everyone you meet thinking you are good looking EXCEPT for your own man.
that is trippy.
White Girl
I have been in a fair number of ones that could be called that, yes.
Though I wouldn’t call them that. That’s too feminist and matrifocal flavored for either my taste or the realities.
i guess im attracted to betas. from what i perceive an “alpha man” to be, from these readings, is an arrogant man who thinks he’s alll that. ive never been attracted to those types.
@doug1:
I don’t find it hard to imagine you being in them (polyamorous relationships).
And for some reason, I think that’s ok.
Even Roissy’s definition has wobbled. He mostly defines alpha in terms of being desired sexually by women. On one of my first comments here, I posted a list of behaviors (my husband’s)that were absolutely not related to sexual desire and had nothing to do with women. Roissy insisted that those were behavoirs of “an alpha who likes kids” So, he made the definition based entirely on behaviors relating to child care as “alpha”.
[editor: the alpha-beta dichotomy is a sliding scale, not an either-or. liking kids has little to do with a man's alphaness. if anything, a man who is already an alpha can only boost his value among women by demonstrating a soft spot for the little shits. an accurate observation about kids and men is that the paternal instinct in men is weaker than the maternal instinct is in women.]
@anony:
“I’ve tried to include “Special Snowflake” theory here, but others don’t accept it. Women’s rational forebrains need to be reassured that the suitor is genuine, truly understands her and values her for more than just her sexual value.”
I know this is the case for me, but I don’t know if this is the case for all women.
She wants someone that will stick around to help raise the babies, biologically speaking.
doug1, what jealousies flared up?
Jesus, does anyone know the record number of comments made on this blog?
anony–
Although you’ve pissed me off at times and annoyed me at others, I really agree with this:
The alpha /beta dichotomy is not as clear cut as many here, especially of the civilizational doomsayer variety such as Whiskey and to a lesser extent the (much wiser and more nuanced) novaseeker, often say. Women can be happy settling, as long as it isn’t too far down.
A lot of the real problem is the culture. Not just in creating too pussy men, and too masculine women, but in constantly encourageing women to emasculate the man who cares about her and used to full bore love her, over every which thing. Really over anything the mind of women or bitchy feminist men or gays can come up with. The more the better.
me too, Mandy
“if men want the best looking woman they can get, how will they ever know if they get married that that was the best he could ever get? therefore he will always be thinking ” i couldve gotten better” and looking around, “could i have gotten her?””
Okay this I explained poorly.
Men are not hypergamous. That is — men have a standard, and they will try to optimize beauty against that standard, but once they have chosen that no longer becomes an issue. I don’t know if that makes sense?
Men generally do not look to replace their wives, but to supplement them. That is still a betrayal, but it’s coming from a lack of control over the desire for sexual variety, rather than a feeling that he could do better than his wife.
“It’s true. It’s 100% true. I’m not a bar/club hopper. A lot of my social interactions were started or guided by a government funded institution called SCHOOL.
Although, what is beta and what isn’t beta might be a little different for me. It might be a little different person to person. But it doesn’t mean they don’t exist.
IMO, any guy who is crazy and obssessed and stalkerish is beta.”
Right. Once we use the phrase “beta,” it then means “negative traits.” The problem is then people turn around and use the word “beta” and apply it to relatively positive traits or just use it to stigmatize anything they don’t like.
“There are other women who say the same thing. Lady Raine, who is loathed here, nevertheless says she only considers alphas. Same for Feministx, again not exactly a popular poster here. aoefe — same thing.”
Two effects at work here.
First, selection bias. What sort of woman would come here to post? Do chicks who prefer considerate men hang out here in Douchelvania?
Second, no chick or guy or anybody is gonna say “I want a beta,” because the very word “beta” biases somebody against wanting that.
“What you’re saying is that women need to compromise and accept some “beta” traits that are good in a husband (not a lover, at least not what most of the women here say)”
No, I’m saying certain traits that may get a guy labeled “beta” are truly alpha. That some women need to smarten up and figure out that so-called betas (those who don’t suffer from irrational overconfidence) are better lovers and are the true alphas.
@anony:
“Even Roissy’s definition has wobbled. He mostly defines alpha in terms of being desired sexually by women. On one of my first comments here, I posted a list of behaviors (my husband’s)that were absolutely not related to sexual desire and had nothing to do with women. Roissy insisted that those were behavoirs of “an alpha who likes kids” So, he made the definition based entirely on behaviors relating to child care as “alpha”.”
Well, a few commenters were saying that my boyfriend’s behaviors (not leaving me after I chose not to put out after two weeks) were beta. But he’s not annoying, attached, or clingy (like my stalkers). I mean, I guess you can argue that we are in a relationship, so we are attached. Or something. But he’s obviously dominant.
I think that if my boyfriend was successful in attracting me, and your husband was successful in attracting you (and maintaining that attraction), then we’re biased. Because they attracted us. And if they could do that, then they’re probably not beta.
I suspect that women with well-developed Special Snowflake instincts are the 50% who (along with their husbands) sustain long term marriages.
The women with well-developed Alpha/Beta instincts are the 50% who initiate divorce.
Men complain about women emasculating them but men de-feminise us.
Everytime a show of affection is spurned, you are de-womanizing us. Everytime you look at another woman with lust in front of us, you de-womanize us. Everytime you comment on OTHER womens looks and NOT our’s – the woman who is cooking for you and loving you daily – you de-womanize us!
”””””””””””White Girl
Another thing: going out in public and getting all sorts of compliments from people about your looks but not one single comment from you man? And feeling that hes embarrased to be seen with you in public coz you are not the same skin tone as him…..
arranged marriage within same cultures is the only way to go.””””””””””””””””’
Yea white girl has been readin this blog for a while notice no r at the end of your.
What poster are you?
but I would say that many guys who use some elements of Game are not using it to become a PUA, but simply to sustain good relationships with women
I’ve never understood that use of game. It seems silly to put all that effort into creating a persona and then wasting it on a relationship when you can run around and bang women galore.
“but in constantly encourageing women to emasculate the man who cares about her and used to full bore love her, over every which thing.”
@doug1 –
Exactly. Exhibit A-du-jour: Kate Gosselin.
katto:
I suggest that (if you have the time) you start up one of those forum type things for these discussions; 500 responses on a single page is just too much. Look at phpBB, it’s free.
i agree, and what makes it worse is that only 10% or so of the comments are worthwhile. but i don’t know if a forum would be a good idea. there are already plenty of forums out there devoted to sex and game and cultural miscellany that people can go to. maybe when i move this blog over to self-hosting (soon) i’ll set up a forum.
Also, did you see my suggestion to you about contributing an article to a reputable webzine which fully explains your insight that Kay Hymowitz and her ilk are nothing more than old-style feminsts? I wrote to Michael Blowhard asking him to bruit your name about likely publications and he agreed it was a good idea.
i did see your suggestion. sure, why not? i suppose i could polish up that blog post into something more presentable.
Men don’t appreciate good, feminine women. They prefer the man-eating but uber sexual video vixens.
Women who exhibit high levels of testosterone (uber sexuality) is what men really want.
This site is made for long boring conference calls.
@novaseeker
Another is that many men do not relish conflict with women. Psychologists will tell you that men and women have very different physiological responses to conflicts with each other — men tend to “flood” with angst, their heart rate soars, and they get very stressed., None of these is measured in women. The speculation is that men are wired to seek female approval, and are stressed at female disapproval, whereas women are wired to manipulate men by means of that. . . . .
I’ve never heard this.
@ dana: chic noir i have little or no use for the discourse of women, as i am neither one of your children or a man trying to bang you i also don’t have to pretend to listen to your blather.
mandy-i use male language to express to women what i think of them because in my mind i feel like a man that’s not attracted to women or interested in them for anything at all–consequently i understand how men REALLY feel about women they aren’t fucking–which is exactly what i expressed to chick noir. and because i am not a man and NEVER have to worry about trying to fuck a woman i can be honest–they can’t
Wow. Just, wow.
I guess you’re lucky that despite those ovaries you’re so removed and superior to us sisters.
@anony
I believe Roissy’s alpha/beta dichotomy and understanding of women is mostly true, but it is incomplete. I’ve tried to include “Special Snowflake” theory here, but others don’t accept it. Women’s rational forebrains need to be reassured that the suitor is genuine, truly understands her and values her for more than just her sexual value.
I agree.
“No, I’m saying certain traits that may get a guy labeled “beta” are truly alpha. That some women need to smarten up and figure out that so-called betas (those who don’t suffer from irrational overconfidence) are better lovers and are the true alphas.”
@Keith –
Smarten up meaning override their sexual prompts? If that’s what you mean, then I think I agree. Sexual prompts seem firmly grounded in pleistocene sexuality, and we would both do well to override them. But do you seriously think it is realistic to think most people have the self-possession, regardless of sex, to actually do that?
Mandy
You are 17, right? Oh, never mind.
@Keith:
“Do chicks who prefer considerate men hang out here in Douchelvania?”
Ouch. You can’t make that generalization.
From what I gather, the women here just want a man who is a little more dominant, not weak. They want someone assertive.
I don’t agree with 100% of what Roissy says, but he does give all his posts a lot of thought, and they can be intellectually stimulating. They are interesting, and make sense.
I don’t agree with the womanhating, the bitterness, and those that are against chivalric gestures. (There is nothing wrong with holding the door open for people, except that some people nowadays haven’t learned their manners and won’t say thank you.)
At the same time, I don’t agree with how a lot of “MODERN WYMYN” behave. So that’s how it is.
“No, I’m saying certain traits that may get a guy labeled “beta” are truly alpha. That some women need to smarten up and figure out that so-called betas (those who don’t suffer from irrational overconfidence) are better lovers and are the true alphas.”
I wouldn’t say irrational overconfidence is the mark of an alpha, it’s a mark of someone trying to hide their (many) flaws.
But it attracts plenty of women. Maybe dumb ones. Maybe those who don’t read people well. Maybe those who are overconfident as well, or maybe some with low self-esteem. But it works. And that’s what the point of Game is.
So, an alpha dude is someone who will walk all over people in order to get what he wants? A “leave no prisoners” sort of guy?
And an alpha female is a video vixen with a Bachelors (not masters or phd) degree?
To hell with both!
“Men don’t appreciate good, feminine women. They prefer the man-eating but uber sexual video vixens.
Women who exhibit high levels of testosterone (uber sexuality) is what men really want.”
Actually I think it depends on what men are looking for. Mate seeking men are not looking for sex video vixens. Men who are trying to pick up in bars are. That’s where I agree with Keith.
[editor: as i've explained to keith before, women who go to bars are not much different than women you meet anywhere else. the bar is the primary social gathering place of urban singles. book clubs and libraries still have a long way to go as social venues for singles. you will not magically find a woman better suited for an LTR on the street running day game than you would find in a bar at night. that woman you see picking through the veggies at whole foods was probably at a bar the night before.]
@al –
A recent reference is the book “You Still Don’t Understand” by marriage therapist Richard Driscoll.
S.
Well over a thousand.
You think it’s maybe touching a nerve, in way not adequately touched before?
–Gunslingergregi
Increased testosterone with lack of sex makes you really really want to kill people.–
Dude, it isn’t that hard to get laid. You can surely find someone. Don’t be a dick and aim only for 9s and 10s. If you need a short-term game plan find a 40 year old single mom. They are often horny as hell and might even go to a swing club with you.
@Rum:
What?
That’s another problem with “relationships” in the West today. Too many games and not enough down to earth, heart to heart communication.
Who in the world wants to play “games” but little kids???
“That’s another problem with “relationships” in the West today. Too many games and not enough down to earth, heart to heart communication.
Who in the world wants to play “games” but little kids???”
Well, but the way attraction works is kind of a game, even if you are not using “Game”. It’s a ballet of sorts. Simply opening the kimono doesn’t work well during the early phases of a relationship with either men or women — it isn’t interesting emotionally.
–I heard before that using t will speed up any disease in your body. Like if you where gonna get cancer. That shit will rage through your body instead of just grow.
But yea dude who told me that was still planning on doing it when he was 55 or so.–
Testosterone does not promote disease growth. HGH has been implicated in activating cancerous cells. No reason to delay t-therapy other than wanting children. One thing not mentioned is that t-therapy, when estrogen is balanced, definitely makes your hanging a whole lot better.
Seems men will never be satisfied, so why bother trying?
“You will not magically find a woman better suited for an LTR on the street running day game than you would find in a bar at night. that woman you see picking through the veggies at whole foods was probably at a bar the night before.”
That may very well be, in that demographic. I am suburban rather than urban, and I have never had an LTR with someone I met in a bar. But I don’t dispute that in an urban environment, those are the primary places to meet people in general.
LilGrl:
“Even if the girl is not a former prostitute or something, she’s definitely not “traditional” if she’s marrying outside her super-traditional culture.”
And even so, the odds of getting divorced are still less than HALF of what it would be if you married an American woman.
So… the average American women is twice as bad as a foreign hooker?
Zylonet
40 yr old single moms? If you go there you need to be willing to kill them. Literally. If you ever expect to make your escape.
“Seems men will never be satisfied, so why bother trying?”
@WG –
Well there is a phrase on that, isn’t there: it is better to have loved and lost, than to have never loved at all.
Now that may be self-justifying wish thinking, but I don’t think it’s untrue. Giving up is self-defeating — you know that, I think. You were just posting about negative thinking a few posts ago.
cptnapalm
So… the average American women is twice as bad as a foreign hooker?
He he – good observation
Why would old men want to increase their testosterone levels and why would young men need to? am i missing something?
on another note; i was loyal, i cooked, i dressed nice for him even though he never noticed, i was sweet and nice and all of it. but i stopped when he started to de-womanize me.
men do not know how to inspire the feminine in women.
@ cptnapalm
“And even so, the odds of getting divorced are still less than HALF of what it would be if you married an American woman.”
Pictures or it didn’t happen.
Er…I mean, from whence are you drawing these glorious statistics? I’m not disagreeing with you, merely curious.
I suppose you don’t need to worry about pair-bonding and such if she doesn’t speak the language. Heh. I don’t know. You tell me. Do you want your future wife to be a former hooker?
@ The Older Man
“How do you explain the Bazillions of them coming here alone for jobs / hope of a better life then???? Everytime I advertise I get 75% applicants who are freshly imported”
Yeah…that doesn’t make them traditional. SRSLY. It just means the world is changing, buddy.
People who leave their home in search of something better aren’t traditional…unless, of course, they’re American.
@ Dave, chic, etc.
Aww, you guys…
”””””’on July 8, 2009 at 1:12 am zylonet”””’
Appreciate the attempt at help. I am self imposed at moment though. Well ok war imposed. Thinking of changeing that.
Mandy has a theory that The Older Man might consider utilizing a mail-order bride service.
I’m convinced that men do not really want a traditional, loving, feminine woman. They want the testosterone fueled sexpot vixen femme fatale. for everything else they can hire a maid
””””””””””””””””””””””cptnapalm
LilGrl:
“Even if the girl is not a former prostitute or something, she’s definitely not “traditional” if she’s marrying outside her super-traditional culture.”
And even so, the odds of getting divorced are still less than HALF of what it would be if you married an American woman.
So… the average American women is twice as bad as a foreign hooker?””””””””””
No
The average american woman is 100 times as bad as a foreign hooker.
@Keith:
“Do chicks who prefer considerate men hang out here in Douchelvania?”
I don’t think that’s a fair statement. Roissy’s blog is a good piece of theatre. I also read because I sympathize with the backlash against liberalism, and the elimination of objective categories that liberalism has wrought. I like considerate men. I don’t like men that are doormats who are drenched in self-pity and cry out, “Why do nice guys finish last?” without any sort of self-examination.
@Novaseeker:
Meeting peoples at bars in cities is popular, but not the best way to meet people. Women at bars are usually pretty guarded and most bars attract a very limited demographic (vapid sluts, greasy ginos, etc.. Upscale lounges attract a different breed of douche.
I vote the subway or a cafe the best way to meet someone.
Rum
Yes but brilliant.
No genuinely brilliant. Genius area.
As well emotionally, as well as intellectually, mature in many ways. Skipped at least one, maybe three grades. Finished her freshman year of college at least. Maybe more. But is 17.
But not life experienced. At all. Esp. sexually.
Is very strong male friendly if good male to woman who trusts and love him.
A very, very special girl.
””””on July 8, 2009 at 1:12 am zylonet”””””’
I have my 10 just no access to her at moment. I work oversees in iraq. At moment.
Rum–
Oh and she’s pretty.
Seen pics.
Special girl.
Let’s protect her.
–40 yr old single moms? If you go there you need to be willing to kill them. Literally. If you ever expect to make your escape.–
I have met some who were not good candidates. However, I have personal experience with a few who didn’t mind a good time and only that. You have to choose wisely and be upfront. Sometimes a single 40 year old mom is the best you can do. I don’t regret my experiences one bit. They were beyond freaky. My experience with women in that age range is what gave me the confidence to go out and find a bunch of hot young girls over the subsequent years. I went from group sex with 40 year old women to screwing 18 year old girls (and older). Of course, I was fortunate in that I received the group aspect. There is something profoundly confidence-building about being the only man in the room with two to three naked women.
its still easy for old dudes to find mail order brides from russia or filipines. those women are gold diggers though. cant blame them and its a fair trade – money, house, stability in exchange for house cleaning, cooking and possibly giving birth. when the dude kicks the bucket she can remarry a more age appropriate younger man who doesn’t need viagra.
–I have my 10 just no access to her at moment. I work
oversees in iraq. At moment.–
Are you contractor or military?
White Girl – Also, Roissy’s piece is off the mark regarding “masculinity” and “femininity”. Communications is a woman’s domain. The fact that a woman was dominating the BBQ conversation is a feminine trait, not a masculine one.
Everything about food is feminine except killing it.
If women want to make all kinds of racket at a BBQ, let them.
I’d just go off and sit by myself and eat in peace and quiet.
gunslinger:
“Again lurker was right.
Man how could I have doubted lurker dang.”
—don’t worry, man; Mandy is like her hero, NotMyPresident; a cunning liar who fools many with her lies, equivocations, and bullshit.
Mandy the cuntrag:
“Because I talk about race ALL THE TIME, and I worship Obama.”
—any bitch who says that Cubans didn’t vote for NotMyPresident based on race–because of diseparate, anecdotal instances from her self-hating childhood—is a Nobama-loving fuckhead.
“Sometimes, lurker, I think you just target me because I’m a massive fat skanky left-wing lying cuntrag.”
—FTFY
Women should be seen and not heard.
Well, but the way attraction works is kind of a game, even if you are not using “Game”.
Sadly, attraction can’t be boiled down into an arrangement like this:
Male: I find you attractive for sexual purposes
Female: Sadly, I do not.
Male: Okay, I’ll go on. Thank you.
OR
Male: I find you attractive for sexual purposes
Female: I do too. Let’s go have sex.
Now that may be self-justifying wish thinking, but I don’t think it’s untrue. Giving up is self-defeating
Given the opportunity costs involved and low chances of success, failing upfront by not trying may be better than trying and then failing.
The best place to meet someone is where they really are – and where they keep their heart.
Lac du Tolumere; deep in the South of France. About a 180 km south of Toulouse. Her name was Rita and she was a natural redhead.
hence yea I can quite today if I want. Been 4 half years. Long fucking time.
What about men who live financially off their wives or girlfriends? Are they alpha or beta?
They managed to get a female who values them so much that she’s willing to pay for them, so is that alpha?
I know a lot of men like that, that’s why I’m asking.
We’ve got Don Juan up in here.
–Upscale lounges attract a different breed of douche.–
I will second that. Upscale lounges = a pasture of fag denial.
”””””””Zylonet,
There is something profoundly confidence-building about being the only man in the room with three naked women.””””””””””””’
I had this in 7th and 8th grade
Yea it built my confidense massively.
three different ages one younger one same one older.
P.S. Lance—
Dave became a joke because he got called out by a white person—specifically a white blond girl—and had no defense. Once he couldn’t do that, he was fair game for everyone to pile on.
Pop music is largely based on image. Black male pop music, in particular–R&B and rap–is built on being the coolest guy in the room, and pulling whatever you want off with panache. It has nothing to do with the music, and everything about image. Without his image, Tupac’s music would be forgotten.
However, if a black male musician is clowned out—made to look like a poseur or fool—he is fair game. Doubly if a white person—the epitome of uncool—calls him out.
Once Dave’s image got trashed and he had no defense, his pop music was dismissible.
it’s the same logic as to why rappers have “guest” rappers on their albums—to bump up street cred. If Dr. Dre doesn’t bless Skittles’s music–and he had every reason to, in producing him—Skittles becomes Vanilla Ice.
Given the opportunity costs involved and low chances of success, failing upfront by not trying may be better than trying and then failing.
EXACTLY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
“What about men who live financially off their wives or girlfriends? Are they alpha or beta?
They managed to get a female who values them so much that she’s willing to pay for them, so is that alpha?
I know a lot of men like that, that’s why I’m asking.”
Beta.
There was a fun article in New York mag a few months ago about high powered career women in Manhattan married to creative, low earning, beta types, and about how the women hated it and left their husbands one by one.
Also you’ve seen the infamous article — lampooned by Roissy — that a woman wrote in a women’s magazine about how she left her beta husband?
Over the entire period. One always but the other 2 would visit off and on.
Nova, what if the husband provides really good sex for the wife and takes care of the baby while she works and really loves her? Do you think the wife will divorce him and risk being a single mom at forty who now needs to put her child in daycare? i think not. she likes the sex.
It was the first time I saw movie porn. Was when one of the chicks put it on.
White Girl
Of course you do, white super slut and whore for black men. I goes with your territory. There’s a whole psychology around that. Yours.
Here’s the scenario, a moderately good looking woman in her later 30s is married to a very handsome man in his early 30s who is crazy about her, good in bed and stays home with the baby while she goes to work and pays for everything. There is non way she’s going to leave him. Why would she?
””””””””Rum
The best place to meet someone is where they really are – and where they keep their heart.
Lac du Tolumere; deep in the South of France. About a 180 km south of Toulouse. Her name was Rita and she was a natural redhead.””””””””’
Did she die?
“Nova, what if the husband provides really good sex for the wife and takes care of the baby while she works and really loves her? Do you think the wife will divorce him and risk being a single mom at forty who now needs to put her child in daycare? i think not. she likes the sex.”
I’m just going by what I have read in major print publications and also experienced with colleagues and friends.
One of the women in the NY article said that she would only ever marry a high earning ambitious man. Another said she resented being the breadwinner, both because she felt pressure (d’oh), and because she felt her husband was stepping on her own turf by being the primary care giver.
You see, when women decided they wanted to do every role, they didn’t appreciate that they might not like doing the provider role as much as the radfems taught them they would, as well as the fact that they might not like ceding power over childcare to their husbands. It’s not so simple, and many women — at least in print — admit that this is not what makes them happy.
Not all women, of course. You could be an exception — I dunno. But I can’t ignore what I see time and again in all forms of media — women in their 30s and 40s expressing boredom and frustration with husbands who are caregivers, cooks, great with kids and so on. The disconnect between what women have been taught they should want and what they actually do want is large, it seems to me. Feminism has failed women, big time. It is not making women happy.
””””””””””””White Girl
Here’s the scenario, a moderately good looking woman in her later 30s is married to a very handsome man in his early 30s who is crazy about her, good in bed and stays home with the baby while she goes to work and pays for everything. There is non way she’s going to leave him. Why would she?”””””””””””””””””””””
She will scream at him all day because he is not working and listening to every detail of whatever she tells him to do.
Amazon was just talking today about how she is trying to take care of her mom and she is a saint. Just that her mom is not helping because her mom doesn’t do every little thing she wants her mom to do.
Now imagine how she would treat a man in the same circumstance.
Meanwhile women who held out for Mr. Right instead of settling for Mr. OK, are now in their 40s and having to adopt or be artifically inseminated to have kids. Their married friends complain about their fat, bald, lazy husbands and these single women sigh and wish they had a fat, bald, lazy husband to complain about.
But alas! they held out for their “soul mate” and he never came.
Bottom line: marriage is about settling and compromise. Either do it or face loneliness.
“Here’s the scenario, a moderately good looking woman in her later 30s is married to a very handsome man in his early 30s who is crazy about her, good in bed and stays home with the baby while she goes to work and pays for everything. There is non way she’s going to leave him. Why would she?”
Because women are sexually attracted to dominance. He may be “good in bed” for a time, but after a while, she will find herself being drawn to men who are not “Mr. Mom”. That is nature at play. Women are still hypergamous — no ideology has changed that, nor will one ever do so. Women lose respect for men who play traditional feminine roles, or at the very least desexualize them to a significant degree compared to more obviously masculine men.
Feminism has trained women to think that this is bunk, but it is reality, and feminist ideas are rather what is the bunk.
Gunny
Fuck No. She was like 18 or so. I cannot really speak enough French to explain the what happened in words she could understand. For some reason: that matters to me.
@doug1:
You are made of awesome. I’m sure that if we went into your core, there’d be a star. That’s how you emit so much light.
Also, I think wordpress deletes posts that have lessthanthree hearts in them. That’s not cool.
@lurker:
“…I’m a massive fat skanky left-wing lying cuntrag.”
MY MY.
Personification and a metaphor. IN ONE.
I’m impressed with your literary abilities.
http://photos-b.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc1/hs111.snc1/4938_91604828596_706003596_2015161_4593468_n.jpg
This is what I really look like.
Sorry guys.
Still, because she wants a stable married life, she will stay with him. She is late 30s, with a baby, she will not want to be a single mom in her 40s. And im sure he will keep on worshipping her so as not to anger his bill payer.
“Meanwhile women who held out for Mr. Right instead of settling for Mr. OK, are now in their 40s and having to adopt or be artifically inseminated to have kids. Their married friends complain about their fat, bald, lazy husbands and these single women sigh and wish they had a fat, bald, lazy husband to complain about.
But alas! they held out for their “soul mate” and he never came.
Bottom line: marriage is about settling and compromise. Either do it or face loneliness.”
Which is what Lori Gottlieb (a single mother by choice) wrote in The Atlantic last year. I have also independently heard from quite a few unmarried women that they resent women (like Loh) who piss on perfectly good husbands, when they have not even found a man of that quality.
You see, there are bastards and bitches alike. The current culture encourages both.
Now a man can be good in bed and have multiple woman working for him if he straight up lets them know the truth he has multiple woman which will help insure that they stay in line through him being socially proofed all day long.
“Still, because she wants a stable married life, she will stay with him. She is late 30s, with a baby, she will not want to be a single mom in her 40s. And im sure he will keep on worshipping her so as not to anger his bill payer.”
Again, not what I see.
My office neighbor has that arrangement and complains a LOT to me (an office friend only, not a personal life friend) about the fact of her husband not contributing enough financially, and how this irritates her and so on. She is still married to him, but the angst is very high at times, and she is certainly a very high risk for an affair.
And again, the women in the articles are not sticking it out with their beta husbands, but divorcing them and getting nannies with their superincomes. Why bother having a man “who is not pulling his weight” when you are attractive enough to snag Mr. Big (or a semi-Mr.-Big) and earn enough to go it alone in style for a while?
Course if one drops out it doesn’t matter. There are more fish they all know it. They all don’t want to drop out of the pool.
@doug1
Ouch! Harsh words there…
And i wonder how the husband is gonna feel staying at home all the time. maybe he will get frustrated as well.
But i know 3 couples wherein the wife is the sole breadwinner and they have been together for decades. even though the wives wish their hubbies would work, they still love and want them! what is up with that?
If a woman knows not thinks but knows that you can get another woman to do the exact same fucking thing she does she will not even dream of leaving you. If she is under the impression that you could not do better or same the next day it does not comfort her on some cold nights.
“But i know 3 couples wherein the wife is the sole breadwinner and they have been together for decades. even though the wives wish their hubbies would work, they still love and want them! what is up with that?”
I know of a couple like that, too. I think they have gotten used to it, and by this point the woman has no real options. Female options decline with age. The biggest risk factor time for that kind of relationship is when the woman is between 30-45 and still has some options.
“And i wonder how the husband is gonna feel staying at home all the time. maybe he will get frustrated as well.”
Eh, not really. I’ve known SAHDs who spend their free time during the day playing golf, practicing photography, playing video games.
Remember, much of the ennui of the Betty Friedanesque women was due to the fact that the suburbs were socially isolating, and women are very much more social than men. A man in the same condition will play nine by himself, fire up a video game, etc — and not be bored and frustrated by that. We need less social interaction — on average — than you do.
theres a very sweet guy here in his early twenties and due to being “mistreated” so he claims, by some teenager, he is not adopting mens rights and pua negativity. i hate to see him being corrupted at such a young age, hes turning bitter already, hes only 22. too bad. he woudve made a good partner for a nice girl, but now hes already ruined
now adopting negativity you mean?
White Girl:
“I also used to come from a place of bitterness and sought to empower myself from that place, but it didn’t work. I just became miserable. Nobody else became miserable, I did.”
“Used to”? Really? Not any more?
“Actually, i don’t want to get married.”
If you say that you don’t want to pollute the world with spawn of your own, then the world will be a better place
well, he went from supporting me to being supported by someone else, so i guess he hit the jackpot.
Although women may be attracted to men who are “good in bed” these men are rarely anything more than “back door men” to them.
I have known several women who have said, privately or through others, that they prefer a certain type of man (insert type here) even though they do not give them orgasms.
One woman told me she preferred large penises, but that small ones were the only ones that gave her orgasms!
Bottom line: women are fucked up.
for every broken man, there is also a broken woman.
if men and women want the same things, why don’t they just get together? why the gender war?
Truth woman do not lose there want for fucking their man from the first day you meet them. They expect it never to change until the day they get another man.
Truth men stop wanting to fuck their woman as much as the first day over time.
“well, he went from supporting me to being supported by someone else, so i guess he hit the jackpot.”
Well you don’t need to become like your 22 yo friend, do you? Meh, he was an ass, so what. Many more asses out there too, and many more good men. And quite a few of the good men now will have Game and you won’t even recognize it, because it just makes you feel good. You see. That is the beauty of Game, especially when used in a non-PUA context.
well, its like men who are sexually attracted to the alpha testestorone femme fatale sexually charged video vixons but want a feminine mousy girl to be their maid and cook.
men are also screwed up
Truth most younger hot woman want a guy with a small dick.
Truth most guys with big dicks end up with the fattie chick who can take it.
“if men and women want the same things, why don’t they just get together? why the gender war?”
I agree that men and women are both broken under the current regime.
The gender war is a product of the social revolution in the 60s-70s, and the embrace of the establishment of the values of that war.
Another said she resented being the breadwinner, both because she felt pressure (d’oh)
Now she sees how beta males feel. Now you see why beta males love having feminism provide middle class jobs for their wives. They can’t escape and go play at home anymore!
Bottom line: marriage is about settling and compromise
Which is what makes it suck ass.
Why bother having a man “who is not pulling his weight” when you are attractive enough to snag Mr. Big (or a semi-Mr.-Big) and earn enough to go it alone in style for a while?
I’d argue that what has exacerbated the single-mother effect in the black community. When unskilled high paying jobs left, the males were left with no real employment options that paid similar options while the women were able to find service sector work or welfare. At that point, why would a woman want to spend her meagre earnings on a man who isn’t employable and doesn’t even offer the excitement of a bad boy?
Remember, much of the ennui of the Betty Friedanesque women was due to the fact that the suburbs were socially isolating
Fun Question: Did the lack of mass low density suburbanization of European cities blunt some of those similar complaints in European nations, hence their weaker or barely existent feminist movements? Or would the presence of our cheap and ubiquitous mass communications networks (cable TV, Internet, unlimited landline calling, and cellphones) stunted such feelings of isolation*? Or was it really just the realization that the 1950s was a fluke given that it was the first time in history that such a large contingent of stay-at-home mothers with little “responsibility” existed in the world?
*Or would it have made cheating with alphas easier?
White girl, no, men want to spread their seed. Its perfectly natural to want to fuck multiple women.
Women who want to get fucked by multiple men have no respect for their genes and are saying that any man is good enough for them to reproduce. Women who do so are rightly labeled as worthless crazy sluts, which, unfortunately characterizes 90% of the female gender right now.
so thats why black dudes are always with fat women?
i
Good point Nova. I’d add that entertainment guys tend to be boom/bust, but when they hit it, they hit it big. The women that dumped them, at least one will be kicking herself when the guy hits it big, and bangs some starlet. Think: Judd Apatow. From loser to hero based on some not very artful movies.
As for women and betas, I do think most would want us all dead. It’s safer that way, we wouldn’t hit on them anymore. Besides, women don’t really need or want a David Alexander. They’d rather have the real (gay) thing. That’s if the button was available. Women are not big on long-term thinking, as a general rule.
I’d have to go with Roissy. The girl you see at the checkout counter, the Church, the coffee house, she was at the bar last Saturday night. Probably far more sex partners than people think, and more wild behavior (one-night stands with the stranger, risky sex, etc). I know quite a few women who met their husbands/boyfriends in bars. These are suburban women too.
Loh’s probably helped poison the waters for women her age, and is quite likely happy about it.
Lance, bellowing about “White Racism” is pretty silly after a good dose of it from Rev. Wright and the President. No one cares any more who is “racist” for SWPL status mongering. The 80’s are long gone, Mandela’s just another retired kleptocrat, and no one cares. Racism is meaningless after Obama and Wright. You might as well go on about the Gnostics or Albigensian Heresy.
I consistently use my black friend as the fattie fucker wing man, and he really doesn’t mind.
I agree that men and women are both broken under the current regime.
But the previous regime is less attractive to me.
Truth commenters named white girl are a man that has been reading for at least a year.
@White Girl:
“well, its like men who are sexually attracted to the alpha testestorone femme fatale sexually charged video vixons but want a feminine mousy girl to be their maid and cook.”
Yeah, there’s definitely a dichotomy present, but I don’t think they’re contradictory. You can be feminine & domestic, yet shrewd & intelligent, and also sexy. People are multi-faceted. I certainly wouldn’t want to be unidimensional all the time.
Truth black people hope to god that whitey doesn’t go under because they know that no fucking race on the planet is going to let africa just sit there and be run by people who charge to much in graft.
Can I say WTF with Judd Apatow? His movies are talky swearfests that seem intent on showing pathetic beta men somehow scoring in utterly predictable fashions?
The fact that this tripe is worshipped is a testament to his PR agency/agent. No different from anything pre-Apatow. What does he have on people that he can blackmail himself into being so highly reviewed?
”””””””””””’S.
Yeah, there’s definitely a dichotomy present, but I don’t think they’re contradictory. You can be feminine & domestic, yet shrewd & intelligent, and also sexy. People are multi-faceted. I certainly wouldn’t want to be unidimensional all the time.”””””””””””””
Wow s can figure some shit out.
S, a quote from the trailer of the new Gerad Butler-Katherine Heigel comedy comes to mind—he tells her a woman has to be two things: the librarian and the stripper.
The black guy with fat women comment was a joke and a bit of a jab at the white dudes here. All in jest and fun. It was supposed to follow the comment about hot girls wanting small ones and guys with big ones having to settle for the fat chicks who can take it.
Please, no one take offense. It was a joke.
I think we should all be secure enough here to be able to take jokes.
Any white dude who pipes up is basically admitting his is small and is insecure about it.
Heck, even over on the other black men white women topic a few white dudes got antsy at the mere mention of black muscle tone.
The secure men were conspicuous by the absence of their reaction.
Black Man: you will forever be despised by White Man because of that urban myth that you and white women keep perpetuating. LOL.
Lurker — Pathetic beta men buy his fantasies. His movies mostly make money, and they’re cheap to make. He’s less risky than Michael Bay, who if he flops will take an exec or two down with him.
Part of the problem of gay-type men, effiminate, limp of wrist, and so on, is that women, particularly demanding Lawyer types and so on, DEMAND this. Kate Gosselin was a spot-on cite by Novaseeker.
Spot on. You can see this in HGTV, “Househunters” and so on. Getting past the gay couples that infest that show, you see wimpy, sorta gay guys with take-charge wives (who are often idiots). Older couples, the guy has his own ways and won’t budge.
Fact white girl has said the word insecure and white together over and over and over and over.
@White Girl:
I think black men just like the fuller figures. I went to Newark, NJ once (primarily black, low-income), and I noticed a pattern of large black women on the arms of scrawny black men.
Fact almost everything in life is the exact opposite of what you think it is or have been told.
Fact working with minorities makes you dumber.
Fact reading roissies makes you smarter.
That’s why we have to go by personal experience.
wink wink
fair enough whiskey. I’m just surprised he is lauded so much—it’s not like his movies are new or original.
Fact almost everything in life is the exact opposite of what you think it is or have been told.
//////
Fact working with minorities makes you dumber.
Fact reading roissies makes you smarter.
Exact opposite of what we’re being told would be:
Working with minorities makes you smarter and reading roissies makes you dumber.
Or is the “minorities” thing a reaction to the Great Unspeakable Urban Myth that makes all men shudder in fear (the men who are not included in the myth that is)
funny to observe reactions in men when it comes to that topic. really funny.
LilGrl:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mail-order_bride#Divorce_rate
US-foreign marriages have an 80% success rate.
As to marrying a foreign hooker vs. an American woman, you must remember that there would almost certainly be a quantitative difference. There would be no qualitative difference.
You can see this in HGTV, “Househunters” and so on.
Given that I generally watch House Hunters with my mom to be a good son, I’d like to know why you’re watching the show since you’re not gay or a mamma’s boy…
I say we take a vote on whether or not White Girl slits her wrists.
All in favor say ‘aye’.
on July 8, 2009 at 2:44 am cptnapalm
Funny shit ain’t it.
Fact marrying a hooker is going to be the best marriage you ever had.
Obsidian… you here?
I’d like to hear some real life stories about “game” with white guys. Do they pull you down or do you pull them up? Or vice versa ?(hey, had to be fair and politically correct)
Does their confidence level increase or decrease in your presence? And who gets the girl?
lets see what sort of “rise” we can get from the confident HE MEN types here…..
lets see how long it takes for a “minority” comment rears its head. LOL.
at least there’s a head to rear…..
Actually, white girl, we’re constantly told that “diversity” is very important to a workplace/school.
So the opposite would be true: working with dumb people—i.e. those minorities who got in solely based on race and whose scores as whites would not qualify them—does not make you smarter.
If she decides for herself to quit.
I just realized I’m being mean and bitchy to betas, and white betas at that. The most insecure of the lot.
Muuaaawaaaaahhhhhh!!!!!
Gunslingergregi – Fact white girl has said the word insecure and white together over and over and over and over.
White Girl isn’t White or a girl.
He/she/it is East Indian and obsessed with White people.
Colonial legacy? Racial envy?
And they wanna switch the subject from penis size to “diversity in the workplace/school”
CLASSIC!!!!!!!!!!!!
Chic,
You know I like you a lot too, but I gotta step in the name of love and correct you on a number of things.
First, I can stand firm on what I’m saying wrt the Black Hipster scene, such as it is, and its not just confined to Philly-its in Motown, Newark, New Orleans, ATL, Memphis, Chitown, LA, Houston, etc, et al. You say its up and coming in NYC, but lemme ask you, please-is that the dominant thing in Queensbridge or Hollis? Out in the Marcy projects or on Bushwick Ave? In Harlem? What up in the Boogie Down? Who are we more likely to see-guys looking like Busta Rhymes or Cassidy, or guys looking like Kanye or Pharrell?
And look, don’t get me wrong here, because I don’t have an axe to grind against these guys personally. Nor is the fact lost on me that YOU prefer the kind of aesthetic they present. I can dig it-but I’m sorry Chic, I’m telling you, that I can take you to 8 Mile Road out in Motown where you are bound to see far and away more guys looking like Eminem than Pharrell in appearance. And even Common, someone I personally like as an artist, won’t have many emulators dresswise among Hip Hop aged Males in the hoods accross America. In fact, I can’t recall the last time I even heard somebody pumpin ANY of Common’s tracks outta their truck, lol, and, this past 4th of July weekend, I heard more “Money, Power, Respect” from The Lox (circa 1993??) and *Slick Rick* than I did Pharrell, Kanye or Common COMBINED. And that was citywide. I’m sorry, but that Black Hipster thing ain’t a widespread phenom, its a niche market thing, much like The Roots are.
Want another example? Ever watched the HBO hit tv show The Wire? It aired from Summer 2002 to Spring 2008 and was set in Baltimore. Name me the prominent character who dressed like Pharrell whizing by on a skateboard and proudly proclaiming himself a nerd?
I’ll wait.
Those guys-Stringer Bell, Marlo Stanfield, Avon Barksdale, etc et al, all dressed a lot closer to Jay-Z and Memphis Bleek than Kanye, Chic. Again, its something YOU like, but that is NOT the way the vast majority of Hip Hop Brothas roll. Again, sorry to confuse you with the facts, but there it is.
Second, please do not get it twisted-I have not, nor will not ask Roissy or anyone else, to speak for me. I can do that very well, thank you very much. And while I’m familiar w/some of the Black Game/PUA forums, quite frankly I don’t find them to my liking. Roissy addresses themes and issues that are of interest to me that intersect w/Game while at the same time takes up other, seemingly unrelated issues, that I simply don’t find at some of the Black sites I’m aware of. But more to the point, its important for me to let the SWPLers like Roissy know, that there is, has been, and will continue to be more than one way of being, of seeing the world, and that no amount of gnashing of teeth and kicking and screaming will change or stop this, if anything its only gonna increase. So we need to have a much more expanded view of things.
It aint about being a “victim” at all, and I’m shocked that you would even mention me and Whiskey for example, in the same sentence. For example, just compare what he and I talk about, who’s the one sounding like a victim, Chic? I gave detailed accounts of how I proceeded to study and then aplply Game to meet my objectives, with success-he constantly posts bemoaning the plight of the White Beta Male and why he can’t keep a gal interested. Compare and contrast.
Going to my earlier question on this thread, I was only picking up on Roissy’s lead about what he was seeing, and, keeping in mind his blog’s byline “Where Pretty Lies Perish” decided to ask a point blank question and framed it in such a way that the comparison point using the Black folk I know would be yea, enough of a shock to force a brutally honest discussion. And while several people have attempted to answer my question in all sincerity, the bottomline is that there is something in the Anglo White world that leaves them more vulnerable to being shamed than other groups, otherwise it would be very difficult to actually imagine what Roissy reported. Everyone else seems to be giving a rundown historically-I’m interested in the source of such a state of affairs.
See, this is another reason why I don’t necessarily hangout much, though I do check in from time to time, at the relatively few Black PUA sites, because they don’t take up themes like HBD. Which is fascinating to me, since I’ve always considered myself something of a “Race Man” in the tradition of say, a J.A. Rogers. And since I know R and others here are intensely interested in the topic, I thought to really turn the apple cart over and begin to ask the hard questions from the other side: Why Can’t Johnny Get Laid? Why is it so hard for Smart (read, White & Asian) folk to have babies? What is up with so many White Men letting their Women to wear the pants in the family? Why do White folk automatically think of Good Times (ie, the ghetto) anytime the word “Black” is brought up? See, to me, these are all questions just brimming over w/HBD implications, only this time, the microscope is focused on Herb, not Hassan.
And besides, preaching to the choir is boring, at least it is to me anyway. Much more lively and fun when you have different voices in the room, challenging what you thought you knew was true, when in fact it may not be, even a little bit. I’ve been known to do stuff like that. And as we both know, White folk don’t take too kindly to having their assumptions upset.
The Obsidian
Does size matter?
Or is it more how you work with what you got?
What about men who have both size and know how to work it well?
Does any of this matter to beta or alpha women?
Fact when a white man walks into a all black club and sits down he can pull as many black woman as he wants to without having to game them or even talk at all.
Obsidian IS here.
Watch out.
Were sure to get more “diversity” comments aimed at diverty the subject at hand, which is
DOES SIZE MATTER?
Men like to think it doesn’t.
Women however, always say something else.
As “race realists”, who’s got the upper hand if indeed it turns out to be true that SIZE MATTERS???
Sorry betas, you knew the topic had to present itself at some point.
You know, i know that women are insecure about some things. But men and their penis size insecurities take the CAKE. Lawd have mercy!
IF there is anything that will turn a race realist into a racist faster than white on rice, its THIS TOPIC.
There’s some deep rooted anxieties around the meme of the well endowed, sexually strong and well skilled black man.
Obsidian, do your PUA beta bros a favor and allay their fears. Even if you have to lie, placate them for the greater good of “game”.
Yep size matters, which is why women would prefer all men below a certain size to be castrated and serve the state, since they are of no sexual value at all to women. After all Michelle Langley says that, so it must be true. *shrug* I have no personal concerns, but I always find it humorous when women try to raise this as a shaming tactic, because it is so transparent that they are trying to use it to knife men emotionally.
Pfft.
Obsidian has already opined long ago about size matters, but he should respond again in his own words if he wishes.
“Yes but brilliant.
No genuinely brilliant. Genius area.”
Mandy? Not buying it. She seems more like a rather intelligent, nice girl who studies her ass off than “brilliant”.
Will someone explain to me why so many high-T, alpha female types seem to be attracted to “beta” guys who take a back seat? Like the guys at the picnic, or like hipsters in Brooklyn who dress like fags? Is there something about non-dominant guys that attracts feminist women?
””””””””””””””””Gunslingergregi
Fact when a white man walks into a all black club and sits down he can pull as many black woman as he wants to without having to game them or even talk at all.””””””””””””””””””””””
Size has nothing to do with whether he can do this or not.
@ cptnapalm
From your article:
“It could be statistically shown that the probability of a divorce declines 20% if the husband earned an income of more than 50,000 USD per year, and that the probability of a divorce increases if the age difference between groom and bride exceeds 15 years.”
HMM.
800 posts!
Roissy, what have you created?
Nova, it just dawned on me that every time the subject of black and size came up, one specific commenter (the same one on three different threads) would follow with the some sort of “minority report” comment.
LOL.
some deep rooted issues for sure.
Don’t hate, appreciate.
White grrl wrote…
“The Dave,”
You insult a great work of art in that oh so modern way of not holding anything sacred, even your man, I suspect.
White grrl continued….
“Have you ever been in a long term relationship with a woman? Relationships don’t work this way: Don’t like how I f*ck? F*ck off!”
I will answer your question with another question. Have you ever made your man’s dick go limp by directing like Scorsese in the bedroom? Do you get the point now or is it still too abstract for you?
> Relationships are COMPROMISE. Give and take.
Somethings are open to compromise and some things are not. There is a time for discussion and a time for action, if you know what I mean.
“Also, Roissy’s piece is off the mark regarding “masculinity” and “femininity”. Communications is a woman’s domain. The fact that a woman was dominating the BBQ conversation is a feminine trait, not a masculine one.”
A devastating blow to his main premise in your mind I am sure.
“Some research on how the human brain functions and the differences in brain function between men and women needs to be done.”
What? More research done by the feminist dominated universities “proving” their pre-existing premises. Waste of tax dollars. How about opening your eyes and making some honest, first-hand observations on the people around you and in your own corrupt soul.
“Don’t remain confused. Knowledge is power.”
Wow, thanks!
Jack, some men like to be dominated and those are the ones that choose to be with dominant women.
Other men, like David Deida, his protege Michael Jacsz and John Gray (author of MEN ARE FROM MARS, WOMEN ARE FROM VENUS) are what I would call “feminine men” who do NOT like to be dominated by women so they have to artifically create, through books and seminars, a new breed/clan of uber-soft, airy fairy women in order to feel masculine themselves and sell books.
”””””””””””””””””White Girl
Nova, it just dawned on me that every time the subject of black and size came up, one specific commenter (the same one on three different threads) would follow with the some sort of “minority report” comment.
LOL.
some deep rooted issues for sure.
Don’t hate, appreciate.”””””””””””””””””
It takes a lot to deprogram what you see with your eyes and live with what is said in life.
@Jack
Will someone explain to me why so many high-T, alpha female types seem to be attracted to “beta” guys who take a back seat?
Alpha females go for beta males to reinforce their alpha status. If you have someone constantly pandering to your needs, or who is financially and emotionally more susceptible than you, you have the control & you direct where the relationship goes. What more could you want if you perceive relationships as fundamentally dynamics of power?
Like I said the opposite of what you hear. Womans actions towards me. Every fucking woman I have ever been with has wanted to marry me.
You know, African American women and White men got one thing in common.
Urban SWPL cesspools are where gender roles are confused and faggotty.
Rural America, however, still has elements of a strong society. Marriages happen at the right age, people have children, gender roles are somewhat expected, and the fertility rate is at or above replacement.
So it is not ‘America’ that is in decline, but rather that America is locked in a struggle between the SWPL faggots and the rural conservatives who have a far more sustainable society.
Which side wins? It depends on which group can take the Hispanics into their sphere of influence. Hispanics have high birth rates, but vote Democrat. So the jury is still out.
White Girl,
Having lived in India for so long, one would think you’d know the answer to your question, lol. Its called the Kama Sutra. You might have heard of it?
And in case S is reading along, yup its true, as a rule Black Men do prefer a Woman that’s fuller figured than White Men on average. But that’s not the thing to me-
The thing to me is, why do so many White guys seem to go out of their way to make such a big stink about it-especially when so many of them, here, claim not to be interested in Black Women anyway? It’s like me complaining why so many Asian Women have asses as flat as ironing boards and why White guys dig em so much-but since I ain’t into Asian gals for the most part, it doesn’t even register on the radar for me. White Girl alluded to it earlier, and I think there is *some* truth to it, that there are some White guys who are a bit insecure about things along these lines. Afterall, if you buy into HBD, Evo-Psych theory etc, then you accept that a big part of what a Man is, is in both being seen as an attractive sexual mate to other Women, and, in fact having formidable woodhandling skills in the bedroom. And while I haven’t, nor am I aware of any scientific studies on the matter, it is generally accepted that Brothas tend to both have more natural Game and to be better in the bedroom than the average White guy. This is per the anecdotal reports of White, Black, Hispanic, heck even Asian Women when they were able to get a taste w/o none of their peeps finding out.
I’m just sayin.
O
Which part of rural America? I’ve not seen what your saying. Divorce and sleeping around, shacking up, is prevelent there.
O,
Expect a “minority report” or “diversity” comment to pop up soon. LOL.
It always does after a comment about black men and size.
Yeah, and white American women are bitchy feminazis who no white guy wants, but let them say “black men have nice bods” and all of a sudden all hell breaks lose!
Sheeeeeeeeeeeeet!
White guys: just hope your wife or girlfriend has never bedded a black men before she met you. or if she has, pray to God she doesn’t tell you, ever.
You’ll have a chronic case of performance anxiety — forever.
Wow, that was a lot of noise and not enough signal. Is there a Firefox plugin that blocks comments from certain people?
@Dave from Hawaii
Sounds like you’re eating an ‘Evolutionary Fitness’ or paleo/primal diet? I’ve had amazing results eating/living that way.
Obsidian: So again-wassup wit the White folks? What happened? – Zylonet: As to why male T-levels are low, no one knows. It could be related to plastics, aerosols, non-stick pans, estrogens in the water.”
What happened to White folks in America is that nation-wrecking Jewish parasites have hijacked the nation and instituted a culture of suicide amongst its hosts – like the grasshopper that commits suicide when infected with a parasitic worm, American Whites are also committing suicide in an attempt to rid itself of the Jewish parasite; see: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D7r1S6-op8E & http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=76BnVsaLiR0
The only solution for White America (males and females) is to become racially conscious again and work together as proud Whites to regain their rightful place in the modern world which they have built. Yes, WHITES and only WHITES built the modern world with little or no help from the African morons, Hispanic incompetents, or Asian copycats.
American Whites – stand up for your people and your racial and historical heritage or else face extinction through swamping by racial inferiors. The choice is yours: either become racially-aware and get organized as Whites and prosper in to the future, or else continue to slide in to the filthy cesspool of Jewish domination, imposed multiracialism, and immigration invasions which will eventually lead to the White extinction and thus the ruin of all worthy culture.
Still interested in these parts of rural American where people are marrying young and not divorcing. Are there lots of Desis living there? Must be. There the only group in the South who gets and stays married these days.
Yea if it is true then I will feel better after the extermination if an archeological dig on dead peoples minds can take place.
It is wierd though that my life is not congruent with my size. Woman tend to truly be addicted to my dick. Yea though my mind is fucked up by it even though life doesn’t match shit is nuts. Like I kind of feel bad that they are fucking me da style but yet they fucking love fucking me. The shit is fucking mindblowing. Maybe one day I will get over it.
Whereas guys with big dicks seem to get fucked up by there woman from what I have seen and disrespected. I on the other hand do not.
Not like you don’t see the guys with the giant dicks there are like what 2 per hundred.
I’d have to agree and disagree w/White Girl on that one, Tood. While what you say I true to an extent, what she said is also true-dysfunction is rife out in the Heartland, Midwest and the South. Drugs, OOW “baby mama/baby daddy” issues, you name it.
Not only that, but Hispanics’ OOW rate is fast closing in on the Black rate, ad already has eclipsed the current White one. Translated in political terms, that suggests that the Dems will have the Hispanic Vote for some time to come.
O
Obsidian, do you know any Black Hindus or Buddhists?
Another ridiculous premise of this “role reversal” piece is that “America is crumbling due to vegetarians”!!!!
Kya bukwus hai!?!?
White Girl,
No Black Hindus, but I have met a few Black Buddhists. And then there’s Tina Turner and Tiger Woods, lol.
O
””””””White guys: just hope your wife or girlfriend has never bedded a black men ”””””’
Yea that is the thing. Black men multiple. Black men do not mind fucking the same woman with multiple guys in the same day. Here is where they really fill the nitch. White girl if a girl has probably been running them trains.
Black guys like white girls for trains because they can handle the abuse. What does that say about the ability of one white man. White men don’t tend to run trains on their woman.
White Girl: “People are hurting. Men and women don’t trust each other anymore, but they want to. What is the solution?”
The solution is for White American men to MAN UP and work assiduously to expose, uproot, and banish the nation-wrecking Jewish parasite that is currently thriving in their midst and sapping their vital strength.
This is the only answer – this Jewish rot/decay is the main factor in the current decline of the USA – this has occurred in every single nation where Jews have managed to gain too much power or influence, and thus the USA is just repeating a very old historical cycle of parasitic Jewish destruction.
Only after the Jewish mind-benders, culture destroyers, and nation-wreckers are dealt with can White manhood, White womanhood, the White family, and White nations like the USA be returned to full health.
But can we still get our Mocha Lattes on the side?
Gunny,
Say what? White guys run just as many and in some cases, MORE trains on White gals as do Brothas. Look at all dem frat parties, etc. Cmon. You know bedda than that.
Anyway, I wanted to go back to something Lurker said about Black folk and affirmative action. Sailer recently blogged about his new piece over at Taki’s where he’s discussing the Ricci case, and makes a powerful point-the REAL reason why most Whites aren’t gonna seriously challenge affirmative action is because doing so labels them as a loser-for real the only White guys who are affected by Black affirmative action are blue collar White guys, whom their middle and upper class betters despise anyway.
So, as is so often the case, this aint really about “unqualified Black folk taking away high post jobs from deserving Whites” but about White folk hatin on other White folk, ala Sarah Palin, etc, et al.
Of course, the facts often confuse folk-even obstensibly cognitively superior White guys.
Holla back
O
Yea I agree that educated look down on uneducated. That is why they all must go.
Forget trying to become alpha males and bedding and wedding the alpha female/s of your dreams. Settle for the nice girl who will create a nice home for you. She may not be “hot” but she’s sweet.
I’ve given up on ever finding my ideal fantasy man. He does not exist.
If you can’t be with the one you love, then love the one you’re with.
Fuck trying to fix the shit there is no fix. Whites have too much of a bleeding heart for pieces of shit. They won’t completely exterminate even to save themselves.
Forget blue collar. They need to bring more black men into offices where white women work. Nothing puts the “zing” back into a dead marriage faster than an affair.
“Can I say WTF with Judd Apatow? His movies are talky swearfests that seem intent on showing pathetic beta men somehow scoring in utterly predictable fashions?”
everyone gets down on apatow, but if most men in the world are beta, he’s merely making movies for a very large market.
It does not matter under divorce law if the woman is nice sweet or anything else because she is not just a woman she is a woman with superpowers given to her by the government.
@White Girl:
I’ve given up on ever finding my ideal fantasy man. He does not exist.
The problem arises when you pair “ideal” with “fantasy”, because then it’s incongruent at an elementary level. My “ideal” man is someone who is real, and flawed, and human.
Superpower is a word only fit to be used in conjunction with Mandingo.
To pickup where I left off…
Sailer went on to say that most Whites aren’t bothered by Black affirmative action, because Black folks just aren’t in position to be serious competitors for their jobs. He noted for example, the fact that almost 95% off ALL Hollywood scriptwriters are White (and/or Jewish). And this is the case w/the vast majority of the really important jobs in American life.
In fact, Sailer made the point that had Ricci & Co, were simply trying to *join* the New Have Fire Dept instead of getting promotions within it, they’d have been deepsixed by affirmative action a long time ago, w/NO recourse at all. Where the pols up there messed up was in their trying to kick dug in White guys in the dept to the curb when it came to jobs that actually mattered. Oops.
O
So a man is not able to choose one of these woman unless he wants to put himself into an unwinnable situation.
Obsidian, if you want to engage the boys here in a convo about affirmative action, nothing will spark a response faster than your statistics or bio-data. In centimeters, not inches. There are Europeans here afterall.
speaking of beta men getting bailed out in unconventional fashions on television….
i’ve recently been watching the first three seasons of “Dexter”. the show’s awesome. i’ve been intrigued by the character of Detective Batista though.
i pegged him as a beta male, LJBF-er from episode one. he is the dough-faced teddy bear nice guy that thinks that sucking up to a woman will get her to like him.
in episode 7 or so of season 3, he is friend-zoned by a hot vice detective (can’t remember the name). inexplicably though, she throws herself on him to make out with him after he asks her to a wedding…this shit doesn’t happen in real life. if she LJBF-ed him, she’s not going to all of a sudden get turned on by him….
anyone else here watch the show?
Gunny,
Like I said, there is the Taliban Option for the Anglosphere. They can put a sqift end to all this crap w/the quickness if they simply do what the Brothas in the Congo and Liberia, and what the Taliban does in Pakistan and Afghanistan. You guys don’t even need to reinvent the wheel, just follow the already existing program, lol.
But, I suspect, the Anglosphere won’t do that because it goes against they way they’ve been wired in genetic and evolutionary terms. The primacy of the Individual is too important in the Anglo Western world. And hence, the reason why we see General Grrrlpower and her Flaming gay looking “man”.
O
”””””””””””S.
@White Girl:
I’ve given up on ever finding my ideal fantasy man. He does not exist.
The problem arises when you pair “ideal” with “fantasy”, because then it’s incongruent at an elementary level. My “ideal” man is someone who is real, and flawed, and human.””””””””””””’
Yea because wg’s fantasy man is 10 black men every day. Well it is not possible for her to achieve that without working and saving money and then setting a place up and paying the expenses of ten black men to live in a house and pay there expenses and maybe rotate them out as they quite. WG this is probably possible to achieve with some dedication.
White Girl:
“White guys: just hope your wife or girlfriend has never bedded a black men before she met you. or if she has, pray to God she doesn’t tell you, ever.”
can’t speak for all white men, but this shit doesn’t bother me. the only thing about it (and all apologies to Obsidian and other black guys on this board, I’m just playing it straight) that would worry me is a higher risk of STDs from my partner.
the facts are that black men have higher rates of STDs, and white women who sleep with black men have had more partners than average.
my anecdote may not account for much, but i’ve been with women who have been with black guys in the past. i’ve stacked up comparitively well, size-wise and torrential orgasms from my hurricane tongue wise….i take sexual compliments with a grain of salt mind you, but when it becomes a trend, well, i tend to believe what i hear.
Bitter that you’ve been unable to tame the shrew, Obsidian?
Yea obsid not going to happen need to do the world a favor and make the shit go away. Cannot allow western divorce laws to reach the whole world. Cannot allow western bullshit woman and men to contaminate the whole world.
Gunny, why play into White Girl’s trap? if you start going punch for punch on the ad hom you’ll only reinforce her argument that white men get bent out of shape about such things.
But what does it matter who or what my fantasy is? I’m just a ruined American feminazi.
ahhhhhhhhhhhhh….the insecure white euro male.
Because it is not gonna matter chuck hopefully in a few years.
And white girl is just a former poster helping me with my stream of consciousnes.
gun:
sorry, just got to the conversation late….are you telling me that you are “white girl”?
Yea white men need to learn the jewish thing of lack of shame about anything. They can talk about anything without it affecting shit.
Obsidian, a question:
Do black men who date white women talk amongst each other about missing black female booty?
No lol but I think white girl has been reading for quite some time. Just came on as an apocalyptic troll. It is fun though.
Just think white girl might be a man. It is not me.
Kind of like biting beaver perhaps lol
Chuck,
No offense taken, and besides, there’s condoms. STD problem, for the most part, solved.
Again, its anecdotal, but most Women who taste tasted tend to agree, that on average Brothas tend to do a better job in the bedroom than White guys. I’m just sayin.
O
Obsidian, you’ve said it over and over. Now enough. You’re starting to sound as unsure of yourself as a TWG, typical white guy.
See what I am saying obsid lol
Ok so maybe we should just get rid of all the woman just saying.
Yea big black men and big white men about the same size. How am I supposed to hate on the big white men. I know they are causing woman pain in the name of white men.
So I am just proud of them lol or ok might be why I want to exterm everyone.
White Girl, I think its fair to say, that very little about me is “typical”. Oh, and while I got you here..
WHY ARE YOU HERE? I mean, you must be like the 5th or 6th gal in as many weeks who’ve come here and posts and posts, even while claiming to stand in direct opposition to all this venue stands for. You’ve said that you find Indian guys to be more to your liking-so why don’t you marry one? And why do you find it necessary to post here? How did you find out about this site anyway?
Just real curious.
O
I found this site yesterday, can’t remember how. I must’ve been googling something with “BLACK MEN WHITE WOMEN” in it and it popped me here.
I don’t want to get married so marrying an Indian is out of the question. Though if I had to, an Indian would be my first choice. I, like many of the men here, am jaded.
lol well shit you should have said so white girl now we can fuck.
Obsid the real woman who post and post love having there minds remelded into what we want them to be.
White Girl,
Not as far as I know, I haven’t heard anything along those lines.
Chuck,
Haven’t seen the show you mentioned, “Dexter” but I’m aware of the premise. Can’t speak on it anymore than that.
However, I’m a bit more familiar w/Apatow’s work, and here you would think Whiskey would be jumping up and down for sheer joy in his celebration of Betas. But naw, he still complaining. I don’t get it.
Then there’s his NEVER mentioning The Wire, which features nothing but “the depressing reality of Black violent street crime”. The show aired for five seasons and was hailed as one of the most realistic shows ever done, and yet Whiskey says, nothing. How odd.
O
White Girl – I’ve given up on ever finding my ideal fantasy man. He does not exist.
Let’s be honest, you sound like you’ve given up on finding ANY kind of man. You sound more bitter than that wannabee Norwegian rapist aspargus.
If you can’t be with the one you love, then love the one you’re with.
Plenty of black guys here in America waiting for you White Girl. And none of your hated White men are going to bother trying to stop you.
What are you waiting for? Stop the taunting and start fucking. It’ll calm you down.
Obsidian
Gunny,
Like I said, there is the Taliban Option for the Anglosphere. They can put a sqift end to all this crap w/the quickness if they simply do what the Brothas in the Congo and Liberia, and what the Taliban does in Pakistan and Afghanistan. You guys don’t even need to reinvent the wheel, just follow the already existing program, lol.
But the Anglosphere already did that. That’s why we all speak English.
The British Empire and early Anglo American Empire was as far from SWPL liberal faggotry as you can imagine.
You and other blacks are far better off in a world of White male betas and their skanky White wives and girlfriends.
Be grateful.
The primacy of the Individual is too important in the Anglo Western world.
But the Anglosphere has a history of collectivism or at least group competitiveness that counters talk of individualism.
Modern team sports are an Anglosphere invention. And the English are notorious as the most thuggish and nationalist of all European football (soccer) fans.
And the last time I checked the legacy of Anglo-Saxon/White racism doesn’t exactly stem from a genetically programed individualism.
I always thought my ex must’ve been comparing me to his exes, but maybe men don’t do that?
“”You and other blacks are far better off in a world of White male betas and their skanky White wives and girlfriends.”"
The white wives and girlfriends agree.
“claps” Good job white girl you really did a good job today. I am somewhat impressed at your determination and fortitude.
Obsidian – Again, its anecdotal, but most Women who taste tasted tend to agree, that on average Brothas tend to do a better job in the bedroom than White guys. I’m just sayin.
Why would you expect them to say anything else to you?
White Girl I, like many of the men here, am jaded.
Google “understatement of the year”.
As per usual Willie, nyou get ish all twisted.
Neither I nor any other Black person here is constantly complaining about the state of things, particularly White America, as much as your fellow White forum members do. I’m simply noting what can be done about it. The bottomline is that none of us are gonna convince or persuade Women get go back in the kitchen barefoot and pregnant, WITHOUT the real and credible threat of violence. Whatever balls your English ancestors had back in the day their descendants have most definitely lost their mojo now.
And that’s really it in a nutshell, Willie-if you White guys are really serious about setting things right you can start right under you own roof, by making Women like General Grrlpower get with the program.
Good luck.
O
“”Obsidian – Again, its anecdotal, but most Women who taste tasted tend to agree, that on average Brothas tend to do a better job in the bedroom than White guys. I’m just sayin.”"
That’s usually what we women say amongst ourselves too. For the most part. Exceptions are there, but there is a general trend in that direction. Testosterone levels, muscle mass, size, technique.
O:
i don’t know, i’m a numbers guy; i’d have to see some statistics before i could agree that white women prefer black men to white men *in general and when they’ve sampled both*.
if i had to choose a side on it, i’d probably be more inclined to say that black men are preferred, but many of the cliches and truths i used to believe have been usurped in the past year or so about many different things.
personally, i’ve noticed somewhat of a backlash against black men by a few white women who tend to date interracially and even some black women. 5, 10, 15 years ago, there was a huge trend towards white female/black male relations that seems to have given way to more prevalent black female/white male pairings.
i’ve heard and witnessed more talk about the “penis size myth” of black males. i’ve heard black and white women say things about black men not being all they’re cracked up to be.
i’m not saying it’s all true, but i’ve seen more of it.
like all things of this nature, there is a natural closing of the great divide. if black men were more desired as lovers, it would make sense that white men would step up their game and black men would rest on their laurels. just my observation.
White Girl – I always thought my ex must’ve been comparing me to his exes, but maybe men don’t do that?
He did that’s why he dumped you. Your type is known as a “pump and dump”.
You are not relationship material, you are a semen receptical, until the guy gets tired of fucking you.
There are black men who are small and/or bad in bed too.
But when they’re good, there is really no comparison.
Damn WG, still at it?
He didn’t dump me willie nillie.
Mr. M, even I can’t believe it. Figure get ‘em all in before I leaver here. LOL.
Obsidian – I’m simply noting what can be done about it.
I’m trying to point out to you, and maybe you just have a deep seated psychological need not to know, that the kind of White Alpha dominance that would put the White women “back in their place” puts your people at the end of a rope swinging from a tree.
It puts your ancestors into slave ships and onto plantations.
The two go together whether you want to admit it or not.
The bottomline is that none of us are gonna convince or persuade Women get go back in the kitchen barefoot and pregnant, WITHOUT the real and credible threat of violence.
That’s not my battle. You have me confused with other posters.
Whatever balls your English ancestors
I have no English ancestors.
….had back in the day their descendants have most definitely lost their mojo now.
And you as a black boy in America had damn well better be praising Allah, Jesus and the tooth fairy 24/7 that that’s the case. And we both know why.
And that’s really it in a nutshell, Willie-if you White guys are really serious about setting things right you can start right under you own roof, by making Women like General Grrlpower get with the program.
You just better hope it never happens because if it does, y’all are next on the hit list.
But ill still have to return to see what Mahogany throws out at me. African American women and white men have one pet peeve in common.
Willie,
They didn’t; this is what I’ve overheard in conversations, read online and elsewhere, etc. Mind you, I could care les one way or another, it has no impact on my life. But since the topic came up, I’m just simply saying.
Chuck,
Interesting thoughts, though your earlier comments seem contradictory, don’t you think? You said that Black Men had a higher STD rate than White Men, then turn around and suggest that Black Men are sitting back on their sexual laruels. Both can’t be true, can it? Of course if one is having more sex w/more people, their chances of catching STDs goes up, right? And again, for the most part, condoms have eliminated that.
Personally, I don’t make a big deal out of size, because I know how easy it is for guys in general to get lazy. Most really hung guys don’t really work what they got because they figure they don’t have to. Its the same deal w/really hot babes not knowing how to fuck, they don’t have to-theyre looks get them the Men they want w/o doing much else.
White Girl,
For all your talk about marriage and the like your comments above some near-hypocritical. Odd.
O
White Girl – He didn’t dump me willie nillie.
He didn’t try hard to keep you either, did he?
Ever dare to question why?
“”You just better hope it never happens because if it does, y’all are next on the hit list.”"
I’m sure he’s trembling in fear! And so am I!
“White Girl,
For all your talk about marriage and the like your comments above some near-hypocritical. Odd.”
Odder than men learning “game” to bed multiple women in the free trade sex market but decrying feminism and women’s liberation at the same time???
White Girl – “”You just better hope it never happens because if it does, y’all are next on the hit list.””
I’m sure he’s trembling in fear! And so am I!
I already instructed you to stop taunting and start fucking.
Your bitterness with dry up, so to speak.
“I already instructed you to stop taunting and start fucking.”
Oh ok. Didn’t see that! I’ll start now. Afterall, everyone listens to random anonymous dudes on the internet, right?
LOL.
White Girl – Odder than men learning “game” to bed multiple women in the free trade sex market but decrying feminism and women’s liberation at the same time???
White Girl, you are as creepy and bitter as the White men you hate.
Oh Willie, me and the Brothas are shakin’ in our boots, in fear of what yall gonna do to General Grrpower. I’ll tell yo what, let’s skip her, since so many of you White boys scapegoat so much anyway, and bring it on and try and make us “go back”. I wish a cracka would. Its been awhile since I had some shooting practice.
So, anyway, like I was saying-Roissy’s point above is that White Men have lost their way with their Women and it aint got a goddamn thing to do with dem Darkies, we got our Women much more in check. This is something y’all are gonna have to get a handle on, lest the real people me and mine need to fear be General Grrrpower, and not Willie from Bumfuck America.
O
LOL ok white girl is surprized at how much he relishes the attention. Now you know how a woman feels somewhat.
Alright boys, nice to meet ya. My period is coming to an end and tomorrow its back to work. This was all just some PMS stress relief for me. My husband thanks you.
Goodnight!
”””””””’White Girl
“White Girl,
For all your talk about marriage and the like your comments above some near-hypocritical. Odd.”
Odder than men learning “game” to bed multiple women in the free trade sex market but decrying feminism and women’s liberation at the same time???”””””””””””’
Well that is the problem it is not the free market. It is all contained nicely in the frame of slavery for men. So yea that is why the game makes sense.
Remember it always comes back to the frame.
Just like we are told free sex
And what we got was slavery.
So you see how pretty much everything is ironic
pretty much everything is the opposite of what we are told over and over and over and over.
Obsidian – Oh Willie, me and the Brothas are shakin’ in our boots, in fear of what yall gonna do to General Grrpower. I’ll tell yo what, let’s skip her, since so many of you White boys scapegoat so much anyway, and bring it on and try and make us “go back”.
That’s not my agenda, that’s your paranoia.
You seem to be having quite a bit of difficulty comprehending what I actually wrote in my above posts about White racial Alpha dominance and it’s necessary connection to BOTH dominance over White women and deadly violence and oppression directed toward non-White races.
Can’t have one without the other so stop pretending you want to encourage it as an answer to SWPL faggotry or “General Grrrpower”.
So, anyway, like I was saying-Roissy’s point above is that White Men have lost their way with their Women and it aint got a goddamn thing to do with dem Darkies, we got our Women much more in check.
Yes, not only White America but the entire world needs to use black male/black female relations as the template of progress.
Just like blacks were probably told we need you to come help us get more of these beads and then it was like surprize you get to work the fields.
Just like we are told how hard the blacks had to work in the fields as slaves.
Yet when I start a little farming of my own. They only work about 40 days a year on the farm. Planting and harvesting twice with maybe a little upkeep thrown in sporadically.
Just like we where told that farming sucks
It is one of the most fullfilling things I have participated in.
Just like we are told that kids are sooooooo expensive
Yet if you save a little money to get a farm like 1/5 the cost of a house in us you can feed as many kids as you want.
Poor people need welfare
not if they are free poor people.
like we are told everyone should own their own house and it is the best investment you can make
Yet if everyone would spend the same money on a business then they would be able to provide jobs for them and their families for the same cost as the average price of a house.
We are told that people who make more money have more money.
Yet someone who makes 2k per month can can end up with the same spending money as someone who makes 10k per month and it is human nature to accumulate these bills with the constant bonbardment of get the biggest house you can afford. Best cars you can afford.
We are told we need to rely on the lottery to get rich or become a movie star or make it into the big leagues
Yet the reality is if we would rely on each other in a family unit we could just save the money to be rich.
We are told that we need to work for a company for 45 years to get a pension
yet we can retire after ten years or less if we would work together as a family to help each other save money.
we are made to believe it takes some sort of major breakthrough or some exciting thing to get rich, there are millions of books on the subject. Tons of websites.
The only guarrenteed way to do it is to work a job and spend way less than you make. Anyone can do this.
We are told that everyone wants to be rich.
the reality is most people are afraid of it because then they wouldn’t have to work and would actually be free
we are told that we all are free
again reality is people fear true freedom and that includes me.
we are told I’d rather be healthy than rich
yet we can be both
we are told what if you die before achieving your goal
well what the fuck is that gonna matter to you at that point.
We are told to break up the family
in reality the family is a power that other people that are telling us that are afraid of.
I’ve seen just about enough of the White Girl and Obsidian show.
really a pretty big lie has got to be about aids and africa
the economist said 45 percent aids rate zimbabwei years ago they are not all dead yet
Then people say well they came up with medicine that helps people live a long time
Did they cure a virus? magic johnson is still alive.
we are told that we need to get jobs to eat and have a place to live so we can work jobs we hate so we can buy shit we don’t need so that we can keep our bodies alive until we die. We are also told do not commit suicide as that is the worst thing you can do on the planet by the church and the government or you will go to hell.
Is that true?
Something surreal about Willard Libby lecturing someone else (White Girl) on how not to be bitter. Kind of like OJ doing marriage counseling.
The commenter here named “White Girl” is not White or Indian – she is clearly a little slimy maggot Jew bitch.
Her rabid hatred of Whites and especially White males, her disdain for the USA, her constant bashing of Western culture, her promotion of race mixing (especially Black male/White female), and so forth all reveal her to be a little JEW MAGGOT.
“You said that Black Men had a higher STD rate than White Men, then turn around and suggest that Black Men are sitting back on their sexual laruels. Both can’t be true, can it?”
i guess i didn’t make my point clearly. my bad. my point is more that black men may have become complacent, compared to white men, when it comes to sex. while the difference may be minute, over time it will produce noticable differences.
if black men rely on the perception of bigger penises and better sexual prowess, it would keep them, on the whole, from trying as hard or going above and beyond in the bedroom. maybe they are less assertive in bed because they feel they don’t have to be.
in short, it’s the tortoise and the hare.
I blogged about this and added a really interesting link at my blog:
http://onestdv.blogspot.com/2009/07/roissy-declares-link-between-gender-and.html
Chuck,
Well, again I haven’t conducted a scientific survey on it, but from all that I’ve gathered over the years, Black guys tend to have an edge, for whatever reason, in these matters over White guys, on average. Are the Black guys who suck-yup (DA, anyone?)-and are there White guys who are number one w/a bullett-yup.
But on average, what I just said seems to be the case. You on the other hand have heard it a bit differently-but, in fairness, you’re out in an area where there aint many Black folks to begin with right? I live in a city that’s rough half Black and half White, w/an overall population of about 1.5 mil.
Hmm.
O
Willie, you heard what I said, retard. Get your Women in check and then come see us, if you got any heart and balls left. We’ll be waiting.
Unless that is, you want us to put Gen. Grrrrlpower in check for you?
O
@ Anony
” believe Roissy’s alpha/beta dichotomy and understanding of women is mostly true, but it is incomplete. I’ve tried to include “Special Snowflake” theory here, but others don’t accept it. Women’s rational forebrains need to be reassured that the suitor is genuine, truly understands her and values her for more than just her sexual value.”
This is correct. There is a dichotomy between alpha and beta ACTIONS, but not such a clear line with people. Every guy has alpha-ish actions now and then. Every guy has beta-ish actions now and then. Its all relative in that sense. This is why Roissy is at his best when talking about specific events and not bigger theories.
@ Anony
” believe Roissy’s alpha/beta dichotomy and understanding of women is mostly true, but it is incomplete. I’ve tried to include “Special Snowflake” theory here, but others don’t accept it. Women’s rational forebrains need to be reassured that the suitor is genuine, truly understands her and values her for more than just her sexual value.”
This is correct. There is a dichotomy between alpha and beta ACTIONS, but not such a clear line with people. Every guy has alpha-ish actions now and then. Every guy has beta-ish actions now and then. Its all relative in that sense. This is why Roissy is at his best when talking about specific events and not bigger theories.
@ Anony
” believe Roissy’s alpha/beta dichotomy and understanding of women is mostly true, but it is incomplete. I’ve tried to include “Special Snowflake” theory here, but others don’t accept it. Women’s rational forebrains need to be reassured that the suitor is genuine, truly understands her and values her for more than just her sexual value.”
This is correct. There is a dichotomy between alpha and beta ACTIONS, but not such a clear line with people. Every guy has alpha-ish actions now and then. Every guy has beta-ish actions now and then. Its all relative in that sense. This is why Roissy is at his best when talking about specific events.
Holy shit! Yet another person (White Girl) whose logorrhea I have to skip over in an effort to read the three or four intelligent commenters. I’m just thankful that Lady Raine hasn’t found this thread very interesting, because then the comment count would be pushing 2,000. Some of you people seriously need to:
a) get a life;
b) step away from the computer for more than bathroom breaks; and
c) try really, really, REALLY hard to think (I know, that’s asking too much) and decide whether it’s necessary to post yet another brilliant insight for the 50th time.
FUCK!
It is game you say at the end when willard told her to go fuck and she did right. he he he
I don’t think black men can put white woman in check. I had these bitches in check I come back and the shit is out of control. One bitch getting called boss and another chick talking about how what I thought was an alpha black male calling another woman boss who he is on the same level with. Her talking about how the guy likes to be bossed around. Destroyed a lot of work I put in putting the amazon in check. The bitch cut all her hair off for christ sake. Another fucking black chick I had to put in check before which is back in check. Everyone is afraid of this bitch because she likes to get loud about someones mistake. She called twice and both times the bitch is wrong no mistake. Her ass back in check and a giggely schoolgirl again. Same chick that sexually harrassed me on phone when I first met her. Really I am like man wtf I not only come back to work but I also have to come back to bitches treating guys like bitches. It is like having two fucking jobs. It sucks.
As I’ve read through the replies to my question inspired by Roissy’s recent experience at the cookout, something else really occured to me that I’ve touched on before and that I feel I need to really zero-in on again:
Roissy laments a “role reversal” going on in society, and while he does mention it in passing, its very important to really emphasize the fact that this is occuring most among the Creative Class & Cognitive Elite-of which Roissy himself is a member.
Afterall, as I noted in my initial post that got the ball rolling, such things as he reported is virtually nonexistent in my neck of the woods-a largely blue collar set, at least as far as the Men are concerned. As we all know, Black Women as a rule tend to be rather well formally educated, but many still tend to date and often marry, blue collar Brothas.
I’ve asked several times here in the forum, how many of you hangout among the solid working/blue collar class-or, how many of you actually make your living in such a way? I think the only reply I got was from Tupac Chopra.
Everyone else remained silent.
Roissy could have easily sought out a more blue collar setting, and in fact I kinda wished he’d attended one so as to provide a more compare & contrast analysis to his post above. But the point is clear. Neither he nor the vast majority of you have any inclination or desire in the least to roll among the Great Unwashed-and let me be clear here-I aint talking about Darkies like me, I’m talking your fellow White brothers and what few remaining sisters (Lady Raine comes to mind) are left. I find Roissy’s and others, laments about the less of Masculinity fascinating-he/they/you want to keep that edge more commonly found among the working class, but want all the panache, prestige and real money that comes w/being part and parcel of the SWPL world. If one didn’t know better, one could suggest that it has all the markings of a kind of mental disorder, expecting a little something from two totally different worlds.
Maybe next year-or maybe this coming Labor Day?-Roissy or some other intrepid member of the forum will do that compare & contrast thing I spoke of above. Hell, if they’re really brave, they head over to Chocolate City for a spell at a cookout.
Make for a hell of a post.
The Obsidian
Exactly what I was about to say.
The most pathetic thing about her is she thinks she’s intelligent, original, and interesting.
a kind of mental disorder, expecting a little something from two totally different worlds.
So if you’re not 100% blue collar or SWPL, you’ve got a mental problem? Why not just copy Jay and Kells… Best of Both Worlds?
Just don’t piss on anyone.
Better than the Mystery Method:
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/31704728/ns/local_news-philadelphia_pa/
Roissy, let me just say that you missed a golden opportunity. At the onset of Gen. Grrlpower’s hostile takeover of the conversation, I believe that the appropriate and timely action would have been to reach across the table and give her a Big Face.
That, or ignore her words and stare at her tits.
Seeking Alpha,
Hmm. Mustve struck yet another raw nerve. Good!
Although you kinda got what I said twisted, yes, I am saying that certain ways of looking at the world, and functioning in kind, can indeed be dysfunctional. Clearly what Roissy is speaking to, *is not normal*. Would we agree with that, SA?
Perhaps you’re familiar w/some of the studies that have been wrt racial imagery? I think Stanford’s done quite a few, although there have been a number of top shelf uni’s that have done their own work/research.
Researchers have found that the idea of Black criminality, for example, is so deeply embedded in the White Psyche, to the point that a White person can see a clearly well dressed Black Man *and still associate him w/criminal behavior*. Several of my mentors, Black Men who are professionals and are old enough to be my dads, have personally experienced this. For example, they will often be the only one to board an elevator out of a group of White folks. One of my mentors was met w/horror while getting on an elevator on the way to a business meeting; the older White Woman on it cowered in a corner, clutching her purse.
And we see the same thing on buses and trains. White folks are known to either stand rather than to sitdown next to a respectable Black Man or Woman, or if on a train, to move to another car altogether.
These are *dysfunctional* mental processes, SA. There are so because the White folks involved either cannot or will not take the time to make meaningful distinctions between Black folk who look they may do them harm, and Black folk who look like no plausible threat.
This is why I suggested you check out the work of Dr. Alvin Poussaint of Harvard U in this regard. He and other prominent Black thinkers, mental health professionals and sociologists have much to say in these matters and adds considerably to the studies already mentioned in this post.
O
O – As usual, a very long post for no good reason.
I didn’t twist what you said, it was pretty clear.
he/they/you want to keep that edge more commonly found among the working class, but want all the panache, prestige and real money that comes w/being part and parcel of the SWPL world. If one didn’t know better, one could suggest that it has all the markings of a kind of mental disorder, expecting a little something from two totally different worlds.
You’re saying someone who wants the ‘edge’ – the masculinity – most commonly found in the working class, while also wanting the privileges of the upper class, has ‘the markings of a kind of mental disorder’.
That’s obviously a silly statement. No working class man would turn down a raise and no upper class man would turn down a boost to his masculinity.
You’re trying to be too clever for your own good and its not working. It is amusing though that you brought it back to race. Expected, but oddly… comforting.
Holy shit, just looking over last night’s comments, and scrolling past toilet-paper-roll-length of blahblhahblah.
Does “White Girl” have a life or a job? Please tell me she compulsively posts from her Blackberry, rather than sitting with her ass rooted into a chair in front of her desktop computer.
I think she’s the first one ever to comment throughout the 24-hour cycle.
— Researchers have found that the idea of Black criminality, for example, is so deeply embedded in the White Psyche,
The track record of B-on-W violence when black numbers are significant and the apparatus of law is ineffective has somethign to do with this. See the pre- & post-Apartheid South Africa, pre- and post-Jim Crow USA.
— to the point that a White person can see a clearly well dressed Black Man *and still associate him w/criminal behavior*.
Nonsense. White Americans have a finely-tuned thugdar and we instantly assess a black guy’s risk level. Most black males outside of the ghetto register with us as completely harmless.
Seeking Alpha,
You really should stick to the issues instead of taking poorly thought out Ad Hom detours. Makes for much more direct posts.
Yes, I said what you qouted above-do you deny that there is an absence of a blue collar masculinity among the SWPL class? And, do you deny what I said wrt the seeming disconnect along these lines involving these two classes? If so, why? Let’s see if you can bring some light instead of heat to the discussion. Ok?
O
Obs
Yes, I said what you qouted above-do you deny that there is an absence of a blue collar masculinity among the SWPL class? And, do you deny what I said wrt the seeming disconnect along these lines involving these two classes? If so, why? Let’s see if you can bring some light instead of heat to the discussion. Ok?
I don’t think you took a close look at what I said. Of course there is a masculinity difference between the SWPL extreme on the one hand, and the blue collar man on the other. You won’t find anyone disputing that.
What I took issue with was your description of the desire for a less masculine, upper class man to improve his masculinity as some sort of mental disorder instead of the natural order of things.
In simple terms, your argument boils down to there being something wrong with a man wanting to improve himself.
PA,
I’ve addressed the SAFR situation on the other thread, please checkout my most recent reply. And the Stanford studies and other college studies, as well as the personal accounts of my mentors would disagree w/you.
O
taking poorly thought out Ad Hom detours
Out of curiousity, where was my poorly thought out Ad Hom detour? I poked fun at you a bit for taking a class discussion and making a completely unrelated racial detour, but that’s an accurate description of your argument – neither poorly thought out or an Ad Hom?
A poorly thought out Ad Hom would be along the lines of – well you’re from Philly so your argument doesn’t make sense. Philly has nothing to do with the argument (poorly thought out) and it’s attacking you, not your argument (ad hom). Mine was neither.
Just sayin…
No, SA, what I’m saying is that to want what is common among a more working class Man *w/o all the rest that comes w/it* is somewhat troubling at the least, because being a part of said world is in large part to be masculine in ways that is at the least difficult, if not problematic in a host of other ways in the SWPL world.
Moreover, to want this while at the same time wanting to stay within one’s SWPL world is in my view, dysfunctional. Now, again, if you can explain to me why what I’m saying just doesn’t make sense, I’m open to being converted. This isn’t about improving oneself. This is about how and why certain groups look at the world in the way they do, and the expectations, all too often unrealistic they wish to get from it.
O
900+ comments overnight on one post are simply 700 comments too many.
No matter how perceptive the comments are, a large volume of them flooding a single channel in a short period of time is bound to hit diminishing return. The readers on the receiving end, with limited time and mental bandwidth, would naturally stop engaging and start nitpicking the writers’ character flaws.
Seeking Alpha,
Your mention of Jay-Z & R. Kelly “best of both worlds” pissing comments were off the mark and in my view a poor Ad Hom attempt. But that’s neither here nor there, the issue is, is what I’m saying on point or not, and why.
Also, my mention of the Stanford etc, studies was to highlight how mental dysfunction works. Again, if you disagree, and PA seems to, then perhaps either of you can present countervailing studies?
O
If I may move the subject to game for a minute:
I want to ask out a girl who works at the desk of a spa. Never spoke to her before, and there will probably be another girl at the desk too.
Advice?
Obs
Glad we’re back on track. Let me flip it a different way. If a tough, working class gets rich, does he have to become less masculine?
Or alternatively, maybe you can expand on this point:
masculine in ways that is at the least difficult, if not problematic in a host of other ways in the SWPL world.
Now granted, a SWPL person is – almost by definition – unmasculine. But your original point wasn’t about a SWPL person becoming masculine, but a well-to-do, urban professional. So how would it be problematic?
A theoretical abstration of Pupu’s comment above is the “noise channel coding theorem”
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shannon%E2%80%93Hartley_theorem
May I take the liberty of proposing a new informal protocol?
In pissing contests and other such quarrells of personal nature and not topic-related, could you limit yourselves to one comment of such nature, and leave it at that?
No need to keep defending your e-honor, one else cares, remembers, or keeps track of who pwned whom.
Same with hair-splitting micro-arguments. Make your point, do one or two follow-up rebuttals, and … no one reads past that.
Same with hair-splitting micro-arguments. Make your point, do one or two follow-up rebuttals, and … no one reads past that.
Please be sure to let us know when we’ve exceeded your quota.
Seriously though, if no one else is commenting what do you care? You definitely have a point in the flurry of comments four or five hours after a post, but if me and Obs are the only ones here, and you don’t like it, just wait for the next post to come up this afternoon.
@pupu – “900+ comments overnight on one post are simply 700 comments too many”
In agreement with you there chick.
@pa
“May I take the liberty of proposing a new informal protocol?”
Like the idea of the informal protocol. (don’t think it’ll catch on however)
Holy Lolita! Hefner Hoovers Up First Serial Rights to Nabokov’s Last Novella
http://www.observer.com/2009/daily-transom/holy-lolita-hefner-hoovers-first-serial-rights-nabokovs-last-novella
Many commenters should pick up some style points from David Alexander.
He formats other commenters’ words into easy-to-follow italics, and replies with short, high signal-to-noise ratio responses. His comments are polite, and written with standard English grammar, spelling and punctuation. And he shows an ability to say in two or three sentences what otehrs would say in five sprawling paragraphs.
In other words, agree or disagree with DA, he abides by the maxim “brevity is the soul of wit.”
As a caveat, some commenters have the cred and style to write long comments. Like Vladimir, with his expansive knowledge and coherent exposition. Or Dave from Hawaii with his “specialist” insight in LTR game.
Unless you are Vlad or Dave, and a few others (Obsidian in his better moments, Clio with her crisp didactic style, Hope when her feet attempt to touch the ground, or Yours Truly when relating a particularly funny and illuminating anecdote from my colorful past), no one reads your long comments.
Seeking Alpha,
About a week ago, Vladimir made the point that college degrees were important from the standpoint that they signalled that the holder, especially if male, was able to tow the PC line, which is extremely important for the professional, de facto SWPL world, in ways that just aren’t an issue in the blue collar one. Even now, its not that hard to be a few steps away from Archie Bunker on the job. Again, look at The Wire and how the cops-a decidedly blue collar line-talks to each other in the precinct house. Urban/suburban professionals simply cannot speak in those terms. It just isn’t done.
And that’s what I’ drving at, and you seem to agree, which brings us back to Roissy’s lead off post-he laments the loss of the kind of masculinity that is common among fireman and cops and longshoremen while not being aware of the fact that said masculinity was possible because the environment supported it. That’s simply not true in the de facto SWPL world. And to attempt to meld the two worlds, is to me a bit of cognitive dissonance that threatens real mental anguish and trauma, on the level of what Roissy witnessed in the role reversals he wrote about here.
Am I making sense here?
O
pupu is indeed wise. no naif is she
White girl=SWPL troll.
Mandy XD=Cuntrag.
Lady Cumstaine=lonely bitter old hag.
Seeking Alpha=dickless wonder.
G manifesto=heroic.
roissy=enlightener.
O=not a bad commentator, just a bit one-note.
warpig=MIA
Dr. Grzlickson:
Comrade Doctor, this is not allowable. We are discussing either something to do with Africans and Americans or the values of a worldview held by a misnomered poster.
However, I’m in partially the same slot at the moment, so here goes. The Apocalypse Opener is probably not a good idea. You’ll need a good plan, or a good wingman, to deflect the second girl. Beyond this, I can’t say.
If we can redirect the conversation towards something of a gaming nature, then I’ll chime in with my situation.
Obs
Urban/suburban professionals simply cannot speak in those terms. It just isn’t done.
You are making sense and you make a good point: it’s tough to fully internalize masculine behavior if you can only express it outside of work hours.
I think the answer we’re looking for is a balance. I don’t think the people we’re discussing are looking to act like a West Baltimore beat cop while working in an office. But you can take on some of the better traits. Certainly with respect to how you handle the women in your lives.
One way to adapt the masculine to the office is quiet competence. Now maybe I can’t yell to my buddy ‘Greg you cunt, hurry the fuck up with that trade’, but that doesn’t mean you have to be gossiping with the girls about Jon and Kate in the kitchen. Head down, short answers, no personal talk… state control.
lurker, I thought we were buddies?
lurker= pudgy 15-year-old boy who plays Warcraft and eats ding dongs all day, occassionally stopping to comment on Roissy.
@ Virginia Gentleman
I’m going to make an appointment for a haircut so I’ll have a minute to chat with her. No chance of using a wingman, so I’ll just try to ignore girl #2 during the whole process. I’m thinking I’ll just say there’s a house party this weekend and she should come.
Roissy made a comment much earlier about not wanting a forum, which is perfectly sensible.
A slashdot.org type commenting system might be a good way to go. Each post by Roissy would have its own comment section. Each comment section functions like a forum with threads which disinterested parties can skip once they realize that all White Girl has to say is “Big black dick! Big black dick!” over and over again. People can be in small self-contained flame wars without annoying everyone else.
Seeking Alpha,
Yes, I hear what you’re saying and Roissy himself speaks to that above, the “stoic masculinity” of times past. But the problem is, that stoic masculinity could exist because REAL THINGS GOT DONE ON THE JOB. Meaning, buildings got built, cars got made, fires were put out and criminals where locked the fuck up. Today, most Men-White I’m talking about-sit in a cubicle manipulating abstract symbols on a computer screen. So being stoically competent today ensures your being invisible. And we all know from an Evo standpoint that the bird that don’t display, don’t get laid either.
Again, the fundamental problem, one of them anyway, that I see here is that the de facto SWPL world is one that is seriously at odds not only w/the way Men interact, but speaks to a much larger problem, and that’s a wholesale shatting on the working and blue class.
Ok, your serve…
O
@cptnapalm:
“all White Girl has to say is “Big black dick! Big black dick!” over and over again.”
Or,”Arranged marriage! Arranged marriage! America fails!”
@ Dr. Grzlickson
“so I’ll just try to ignore girl #2 during the whole process.”
Just a girl’s two cents. If the other girl is a friend of hers or a liked co-worker you don’t want to totally ignore her. If she has influence on this girl she’ll say afterwards something negative. You should acknowledge both, but concentrate on your choice.
@aoefe, Dr. Grzlickson:
Exactly. She might try to cockblock you.
Be polite and friendly to both ladies, but obviously, send a message to the one you like.
So true and trenchant an observation – it’s worthy of being reinforced.
Also of note, is the further explanation that ignoring stoicism now fosters resentment in the competent.
Obs
So being stoically competent today ensures your being invisible.
I don’t think that’s the case. I could be wrong, but in my experience, competence gets promoted over ass-kissing. But then buy-side finance is a strict meritocracy.
One way to adapt the masculine to the office is quiet competence.
Your attitude of quiet competence, and the actual achievement of practical tasks that emerges from this, is deeply offensive to women, people of color, and the GLBT community!
“competence gets promoted over ass-kissing”
There was a study (which I can’t find) that ass kissing is the way to financial success. This isn’t new though; read Seneca and Cicero on the topic of flatterers.
Pupu simply has too much time to burn this morning. Here is the tabulated result of the comments on this thread:
By 10:44 this morning,
Total comments: 910+
Unique commenters: 80
# of commenters with 10+ comments: 22
Top 10 commenters (by frequency) accounts for nearly 60% of the total comments
The list of the top 10 commenters by frequency:
1. White Girl (153)
2. Gunslingergregi (113)
3. Mandy! XD (47)
4. Obsidian (43)
5. Seeking_Alpha (41)
6. Novaseeker (37)
7. Firepower (36)
8. doug1 (29)
9. Mr.M (25)
10. Dave from Hawaii (24)
One of the central themes that The Wire revolves around, is that merely keeping one’s head to the proverbial grindstone, working hard and playing by the rules, does not always ensure success; in fact, quite the reverse. The Era of Meritocracy, is largely over, which explains why the Major Leagues was a source of so much trauma for its fans-again, in the main, White and Male, fans. Because it was the final betrayal of all they had been taught and believed in, an era that is now all but DOA.
And while I don’t claim any competence in financial matters, I think its safe to say, given the past year or so, that clearly it aint immune to SWPL sensibilities either, if anything, quite the opposite, its the SWPL flavor of the month. Again, if you’re a strong and silent type that shows up and does your job, at best you’ll get a decent raise. Getting that hot chick next to the corner office? Fuget bout it.
O
thank you pupu, for that excellent analysis. i will now randomly delete comments from the top three commenters in your list for the next few posts. this place needs to clean up. too many worthy commenters who actually have something to say are getting drowned out by absolute shit.
aoefe:
Putting your concept with Herr Doktor Grzlickson’s situation suggests the following possibilities:
1. “(Details confirming appointment omitted.) By the way, there’s a house party this weekend—if you’re interested, drop by.” Cut your eyes over, nod your head and/or gesture at the friend and say, “You’re invited, too.” If they act interested, give the one you’re after the details.
2. As before, but replace “You’re invited, too” with telling the one you’re after to, “Bring a friend”. Whether you indicate the other girl is up to you.
I would attach a slight grin, probably without a display of teeth, to close either option.
Any advice or commentary is welcome; I don’t pretend that these are great options, merely the ones that I thought of.
@virginia gentleman
I don’t think I’d necessarily invite the other girl to the party. I think a friendly (and confident) hello to both is a good start. I’d use the appointment or something relevant to her job to open up the conversation with girl of choice. Social signals having to be read at this point. Is the other girl actively watching or going about her business (that sort of thing). If she’s going about her business that makes it much easier, you can ask without leaving the other one out. If #2 is actively participating it’s more difficult to exclude, at this point it might be prudent to invite her too. I wouldn’t say bring a friend, it leaves it open to the possibility of her bringing a dude. You could say bring a girl friend and look at the other girl though.
Best approach is confidence and breezy attitude. The goal is to get her to go but she doesn’t need to know that’s your goal, in fact the less she believes it is the better. Plus with that attitude if she shoots it down it’s easy to say something like “ok, some other time”, leaving it open for another approach.
Hope that is helpful.
aoefe:
It is helpful. I think I’ve been fond of “Bring a friend” since Robin Hood: Prince of Thieves; there’s just something timeless about that remark. That being said, you’re right about potential dudery; Herr Doktor doesn’t need, and we don’t want, that.
I’ll make note of a dual hello—might be applicable for myself.
What would your response to either of my options be? They’re intended to be somewhat signal-proof, useful where the speaker might not catch the subtleties you’re mentioning. Whether it’s true or not is a different inquiry.
@roissy. thanks. WG was an unbelievable troll.
@pupu- is Pupu a radio engineer?
””””””1. White Girl (153)
2. Gunslingergregi (113)””””””””
Someone had to do something to set her up for the famous willard I told you to go fuck
and then she/it/he does.
Anyway the circle is complete yet again.
The same circle that keeps bitches here.
And they keep coming for the inititation.
And they get jealous of attention on another one.
This is learning for real.
Than after they calm the fuck down especially if you show them you are not afraid to get down and dirty.
If you can’t handle this (if you fail the shittest) how the fuck are you gonna handle some cunt bitch american whore (which is all of them basically) when she is screaming at you on why you are a lazy fucking piece of shit for 4 hours straight. What you have been doing is being stoic while an american bitch has been talking down to your lame ass. You need this type of training.
Also you can now see why the west is going under as roissy says. They are weak and the weak must be purged.
Sorry it is what it is.
I can’t really handle the truth either. I don’t even fucking like the truth or this planet.
It just is what it is grow some balls stand up to some whores and they will quite acting like spoiled brats.
Dave from Hawaii…
“All those predator/prey species have one thing in common – they all have canine teeth and hydrochloric acid in their digestive tracts…just like us humans.”
Let’s not forget the location of the eyes… predators typically have front-facing, binocular eyes whereas prey have eyes on opposite sides of the body to increase field of vision and avoid getting eaten.
Since I’m feeling a bit contrarian today, might as well to get this off my chest-
I’m not so sure it was a good idea to “erase” White Girl, for this reason: no matter what her true identity was or is, I think its noteworthy that she felt it important not only to visit the forum but to participate in it despite the fact that it stands in direct opposition to her stated beliefs and views. And I for one have noticed a clear trend of Women coming here or late doing pretty much the same thing.
This suggests to me that despite their protestations to the contrary, they really do agree w/what’s being said here, and have a very hard time tearing themselves away from it.
My own unscientific surveys of Women wrt Game has been quite positive, the vast majority of them love it. And I think the reason why Women, both those who openly love it and those who claim otherwise, come here is basically in line w/what I’ve found.
Just a few thoughts.
O
@virginia gentleman
My responses to your options would entirely depend on the siutation I was in. Very hard to say. I can only say I’m always attracted to men with confidence. Eye contact is very key for me, I prefer he hold the look until I look away, gives me knowledge of his ‘type’ of interest. Eye contact is intense so a smile should accompany it, makes it less threatening.
Eye to eye contact is good for so many things – interested greeting, warnings, seduction etc. Some men have been conditioned not to look directly at a women and that is unfortunate if you ask me. Eye to breast or booty contact that’s an entirely different story, happens a lot.
@Obsidian
I agree and disagree with your comments about the usefulness of posters like WhiteGirl.
Positive – opens dialogue
Negative – allows soapboxing
Obsidian…
“This suggests to me that despite their protestations to the contrary, they really do agree w/what’s being said here, and have a very hard time tearing themselves away from it.”
I tend to agree with this. I think the noisiest objectors to game think its all misogynist trickery to bed a female but come to see its much more than that and, if they have a working brain, learn to question the feminist crap they’ve been fed all their life about what is masculine and what is feminine.
Maurice,
Pupu is not an engineer of any field. But when feeling frustrated, she could make herself one.
i, for one, would support a pupu blog!
For instance roissy immediately (took 3 fucking minutes) to cow towing to the bitch pupu.
This is the problem guys don’t think about it long. Just so used to automatically doing what a bitch tells them. You must break out of that mould if you expect to get married in america. The bitch will fucking eat you alive. I have seen this shit happen up close. The guy was stoic. She ate him alive. He still didn’t have the balls to leave.
This of course was not me.
Aoefe,
Although I haven’t spoken directly to Roissy’s “countermeasures” or Pupu and others protests about thread length and the like, I have always seen censorship of any kind as abhorrent and against all that our nation stands for. The very nature of Democracy is messy, loud, raucous. Its an *adult* affair, not for the faint of heart or for the sqeamish. I say let a thousand flowers bloom, but I also recognize the fact that they’ll be some weeds in the mix, too. One reason why we have so many “role reversals” in my view, is because we go too far in attempting to sanitize life.
But it aint my forum its Roissy’s, and I respect his right to do w/it as he sees fit for that is his right. Just registering my POV, is all.
O
Greetings Gentlemen:
Just a few points:
1. Regarding working at a desk all day. Your job does not define you, your job is what you do to financially support what defines you – your mission in life. When people ask you, “what do you do?” First reply with what it is that you do for your mission in life, then reply, “and I do such and such to support that”.
2. Something I don’t understand is – if the “game” is simply about hooking up, why should it matter what anyone does for money? A woman only cares about money when she wants a LTR from a guy, not a one night stand. If its a matter of 1 or 2 nights only, you can always lie to the girl if you think that will make you and her feel better. What’s the big deal?
3. Regarding the “masculinity” of jobs like firemen and policemen that cannot be replicated in the office. LOL. Just join a sports team after hours or something. No need to lament that you can’t use slang in the office. Go in the bathroom during your coffee break and scream at the top of your lungs, you HE MAN you!!!
3.
Thanks white girl you did inspire me to stay up for 36 hours straight. If is good every once in a while.
Plus yea if you can not be ashamed of any of your weaknesses from birth and if there is a god then no one, woman or society can put you down for anything to make themselves feel better can they. You already came to terms with your faults and faced the demons. You can move on to thinking of your strengths without the underlying fear. This allows you to sarge the fuck on in life if you also come to terms that you are stuck here to an extent. Maybe one day come to terms that I am not stuck here.
“learn to question the feminist crap they’ve been fed all their life about what is masculine and what is feminine.”
What do feminists feed people regarding masculine and feminine? I’m not familiar with feminist mas/fem doctrine.
However, what I am familiar with in the “post-feminist” West, I guess you could say, is this silly MEN ARE FROM MARS, WOMEN ARE FROM VENUS b.s and the airy fairy new age “sexual polarity” fluff that is being thrown at us from the likes of Deida, Grey and Jacsz.
Did anyone watch that video link that someone posted here yesterday of Deida in action in a workshop? Classic.
This is the fluff that people think are going to improve relations between the sexes. Its embarrassing.
(video link poster, if you are still here, can you post it again please?)
Obsidian, White Girl didn’t so much participate as chant “big black dick!” over and over again half of the time. The other half was split between “I hate white men! They don’t have the big black dick” and variations on “Indian men don’t want me”.
@whitegirl
“video link poster, if you are still here, can you post it again please?”
Say please.
Video: David Deida 90s teachings in Byron Bay
Gracias Aoefe,
Men and women here, please watch that above video and let me know what y’all think.
@Obsidian
“I say let a thousand flowers bloom, but I also recognize the fact that they’ll be some weeds in the mix, too.”
Plus for some it appears one man’s weed is another man’s flower.
http://www.mooseyscountrygarden.com/gardening-articles/weed-dandelion-flower.jpg
@pupu- Pupu knows how to find technical wikipedia links, at least. I fear a Pupu blog might be a lot like Sesame Street – hopefully it would be spiced up by some sexy pix.
Er, no time to read all comments so just a couple of responses where name mentioned.
maurice:
nevermind me. Just some extra thoughts to add to the speech you liked.
Keith: I have not to my knowledge defined a beta, just got some poison out using personal experience in an extreme I suppose I experienced. The hate was very clear. To say women hate betas is to simplify, but for the purpose of PR-contexts and manipulation, that element of the female reaction is something to bring out.
The automatic disgust for when a man does not display assertiveness is very easy to feel. There is nothing sexual or attractive sexually about that, so such a man inspires disgust or at best, indifference, should he attempt sexual contact.
With ‘higher betas’ or even sometimes lower, I think, you can have a loving relationship (which may or may not last forever, depending on the nature of the woman and the cultural values around her); it won’t reach the height of sexual bonding but it can be affectionate, respectful and based on loyalty. Some women can make that last (and it does depend on the woman).
However, women are stronger and better than they have ever been, not as willing to settle, more willing to blame men. A man to be respected to a relationship sustaining extent has to be on their level in some way.
If you want non-bar hopping evidence of female sexuality and a definition of what’s sexually attractive to them, pick up a random romance novel or anything written from a female perspective. Although a clear look at this is increasingly being subverted by feminist influences on modern literature, you will see it even in those when propaganda is not being consciously promoted. Actually, MORE by the feminists as their poor beta husbands are oppressing them on top of being boring:
http://whiskeys-place.blogspot.com/2009/07/sandra-tsing-loh-and-state-of-marriage.html [look at the links in there, rather]
Remember that the automatic way to first insult a man for a woman is his ability to get laid, or not. His penis size. His virility. His success with women.
There is nothing more distasteful and hate-inspiring than experiencing unwanted advances, for a woman. It is in every piece of media written and promoted by women. It is what the endless promotion of rape as a horror taps into.
“Buying into this” has made me be able to recognise when and when I’m not attracted, and what the motivations for this are. It has shown me what my behaviour actually means. I can understand quite clearly what qualities attract me, and what don’t.
Buying into this will not make a thug ever look hot, or indulge in a series of short-term prospects as DA apparently wants me to go for. It just makes it very clear what I need to be doing as a feminine woman, and what a man I’m with who commits to me actually deserves from me, and what — specifically and individually for me — inspires those feelings that I can actually give that. Different mechanisms work for sexual attraction and emotional attraction, but a synthesis of both is the ideal; they feed on and enhance each other exponentially.
I was fairly hating men and convinced that I was too bitchy/something to love someone.
So buying into this has meant happiness.
In an unmitigated way.
I had a dream the other night and Pupu was in it.
I really need to stop reading this blog.
Hey, can someone on this thread post Goldman’s quant trading software that Serge Aleynikov put out this weekend? I am prepared to lift my self-imposed ban on day trades.
Cannon just because I am going to go down in flames day trading you don’t have too.
Really though what does the software do?
How many screens do you trade on?
“The automatic disgust for when a man does not display assertiveness is very easy to feel. There is nothing sexual or attractive sexually about that, so such a man inspires disgust or at best, indifference, should he attempt sexual contact.”
Ok but then why do these assertive, type-A women date beta SWPL guys? Presumably, these guys ARE fucking these women.
gregi, feast your eyes:
http://zerohedge.blogspot.com/2009/07/is-case-of-quant-trading-industrial.html
to answer your question: zero
or two at the most
Yea ok interesting just program it to pull the 1 to 4 cents per trade however many times a day.
I was thinking 20 26 screens would be fun. But shit just letting it auto go. wtf
Or is that using what is being imputted by clients of gs to put the trades through?
Are you automatically trading now?
And what is return your looking at.
Would prob be nice to have 4000 screens going.
Obsidian is the 4th in pupu’s list, but if you use word count then he’s the first by far. Granted he’s not as annoying as the girls, but it’s a tight match.
And I kinda feel bad for Gunslinger getting deleted, by man you really should learn some brevity.
doug1 on feministx
Doug, I hope you aren’t really going to “do a 180″ on a worthless cunt like femX just because she tosses you a few polygynous morsels.
It’s not as though the ability to tolerate or sanction such things is uncommon among the wives of top alphas.
Not to mention that she still wants her ongoing lesbian stuff. You don’t think that would poison the well? Really?
sorry if im refering to a dead topic but this is directed at “white girl”.
how can someone who has lived in india push a vegatarian diet as something that makes people more alpha?
have you not noticed during your time there that indians are by and large some of the physically weakest and least socially dominant people on the planet?
so much for that plant based diet theory….
curiously – Pupu complains more of troll defense body count than does she post of her own thongability.
what shame would befall this wondrous temple if muzzles were applied for benefit of 200 pounder
“mirrored aviator glasses”?
Are you kidding, did he have the Hollister t-shirt as well.
ahaha this “white girl” guy is funny.
Guess what, no one is more insecure when it comes to black men than OTHER BLACK MEN, fact.
believe that.
””””””’’spandrell
Obsidian is the 4th in pupu’s list, but if you use word count then he’s the first by far. Granted he’s not as annoying as the girls, but it’s a tight match.
And I kinda feel bad for Gunslinger getting deleted, by man you really should learn some brevity.
”””””””””””””’
What I had fun with a supertroll who was a supertroll from first post. Feel bad for roissy who lost his balls.
I put all my faults out there to face my deamons but also to show that is I can get some pussy anyone can. I mean I really did day pick up quite a few chicks. The problem would be marrying chicks in us not to get married that is easy but to not get potentially fucked over in a subsequent divorce.
At cannon if I leave my present job I will be getting apartment and will only be trading. Now if someone wants to join up would be good to have some different point of view. Toss some bunkbeds in one of the rooms and get twenty screens for the living room.
@ White Girl:
Guys who are by nature “soft” require women who are really, icky-sticky sweet, soft, uber-feminine in order for them to feel “like a man”, because they themselves are so much in touch with their feminine side.
This sounds a little too intuitive to map to reality with high fidelity — only a portion of it, that portion that serves your bitchiness. Granted, I find the guy in that video (David Deida) — as well as the whole notion of discovering my bloody feminine side — only repulsive and icky. Yet, I like my girls sweet and “uber-feminine.” You may not have noticed but men who have no problem with being men find tomboyery or sexual aggressiveness in girls very annoying.
If the two sexes of the human species had a significant number of psychological features in common, by evolutionary logic they wouldn’t have such an incessant and obsessive sex drive to procreate. That we do attests to the fact that the sexes differ significantly on too many things, and I for one have no special yearning for my girls to display anything remotely masculine.
Some of your comments sound like a variant of the Whiskey (read Jewish sissy, beta) theory of “strong women are not bullied by men, so they make wiser choices” crap. It’s the beta fantasy of “hey, maybe stronger women won’t need — and therefore be turned on by — alpha men; we may get to score with them, then.” How they’ve been burned on that one (along with on dozens of other nonsensical rationalizations too tedious to enumerate here).
A “feminine” woman as most cultures understand is in the end a female primate who has been properly socialized not to become addicted to her “primal” urges (as contrasted to getting drunk on elaborate squid-ink verbiage like celebrating her sexuality or finding enlightenment by discovering her deeply-seated desires (how deep can the gina tingle get?)), has fully comprehended that the way to get things in society is not to have a sense of entitlement the size of Alaska but to earn it through toil and realism, has been inculcated with a deeply-rooted sense of loyalty to family (by obeying the partiarchal figures of either her father or her children’s father) since every evolutionary indicator says families and extended families are all we have to survive, etc. There’s nothing to belittle in this for any girl who has frontal-lobe discipline and isn’t easily lead astray by her c*nt.